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New dev blog: Capital ship balancing

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Ydnari
Estrale Frontiers
#281 - 2011-10-10 18:52:36 UTC
Not bad at all.

--
Indeterminacy
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#282 - 2011-10-10 18:52:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Indeterminacy
Micerinos wrote:
Yeahhh Welcome to hurricane online......


Where've you been m8?

Also, I predict hilarious killmails as a direct result of the logoffski nerf.
Vicar2008
MCMLXXVI
#283 - 2011-10-10 18:52:53 UTC
Posting in a "Long overdue thread......" but I suppose wortht he wait Shocked
Joshua Samson
Doomheim
#284 - 2011-10-10 18:53:22 UTC
Lan Caden wrote:
Cry cry.. "Your guns can hit my hurricane!"

"They better hit 1,800 of your hurricanes before I explode."

1 Titan = 90,000,000,000 ISK
1 Hurricane = 50,000,000 ISK

1 Titan = 1,800 Hurricanes



So thats what 2 weeks of botting for you and your comrades?
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#285 - 2011-10-10 18:54:31 UTC
Joshua Samson wrote:
Lan Caden wrote:
Cry cry.. "Your guns can hit my hurricane!"

"They better hit 1,800 of your hurricanes before I explode."

1 Titan = 90,000,000,000 ISK
1 Hurricane = 50,000,000 ISK

1 Titan = 1,800 Hurricanes



So thats what 2 weeks of botting for you and your comrades?


hurricanes come from our technetium spigot

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
Mag's
Azn Empire
#286 - 2011-10-10 18:55:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Mag's
Sakaali wrote:
Also, has anyone looked at the math of giving the moros a rate of fire bonus? It seems like with the way hybrids currently function its going to be brutal on its cap usage.
This.

We can only wait and see what changes hybrids are getting I guess, but I hope that CCP haven't overlooked that this change will nerf the Moros in more ways than one.


Edit: The more I think about the drone bay removal dread change, the more it looks bad.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Jackk Hammer
MinnieZ
#287 - 2011-10-10 18:55:08 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
Jackk Hammer wrote:
Weaselior wrote:
Jackk Hammer wrote:
Are goons not capable of killing a carrier putting remote tracking links on a titan?


why would you put the remote tracking links on a carrier


that is what the other goonNoob was saying...I guess he didn't want to say you guys couldn't kill a logi putting tracking links on a titan


this is a dumb argument and you are a dumb person

tracking links are stupid cheap and stupid effective and you can hide them nearly anywhere, and playing the "find the tracking links and destroy them while titans are blowing subcaps up with impunity" isn't a fun combat mechanic that aids in making combat interesting and balanced

saying moronic things like "goonNoob can't kill the links" is annoying when you have failed to think through how you'd deploy the links to avoid them getting blapped (and this is stupid easy to figure out and you should have done it before posting) and keep them in numbers that avoid them easily getting cleared out before the battle is already over; you don't understand how the pieces fit together so you have no useful input on the effects of changing the pieces or failing to change them



you're just another goonNoob talking what you know nothing about...

stacking penalties combined with the fact that you end up with a higher tracking speed by using 3 x faction/officer tracking computers than having 3 x tracking link put on you means they are nowhere near as useful as you think.
MastahFR
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#288 - 2011-10-10 18:55:57 UTC
CCP need to consider balancing the super carrier then. because the blind -20% everything is dumb.

What about shield supercarrier especially the Hel ?!

Should I be in a giant supercoffin that i know will be primary because i'm the weakest ?

As said before, you need to balance the SC so the Hel get better tank than Nyx, and about just 15-20% less HP than Wyvern/Aeon
Imigo Montoya
BreadFleet
Triglavian Outlaws and Sobornost Troika
#289 - 2011-10-10 18:56:00 UTC
Sounds good. Ships should be functionally destructible.

Please keep iterating on this CCP, I'm looking forward to seeing more positive tweaks Soon(tm).
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#290 - 2011-10-10 18:56:31 UTC
Jackk Hammer wrote:

you're just another goonNoob talking what you know nothing about...

stacking penalties combined with the fact that you end up with a higher tracking speed by using 3 x faction/officer tracking computers than having 3 x tracking link put on you means they are nowhere near as useful as you think.


quotin dis so you can't edit it

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
iulixxi
EVE-RO
Goonswarm Federation
#291 - 2011-10-10 18:57:29 UTC
Best nerf ever!
+1 CCP
FeralShadow
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#292 - 2011-10-10 18:58:08 UTC  |  Edited by: FeralShadow
#1: Supercaps are still perfectly fine for the role with which they were intended; Killing Other Capitals

#2: Dreadnaughts have heightened survivability because they only need to last 5 minutes under enemy fire before receiving remote reps, while being able to damage those darn structures easier.

#3: Supercaps have a defense against subcaps; their friends. In what world are you living where you can field a single ship against multiple ships and expect to easily win? You field a super in a fight, you are committed and if the enemy has the ability and gonads to engage you, you should have backup ready. Supers aren't IWIN buttons any more, and they never should have been in the first place.

Thank god for the changes.

As an edit, I do agree the Hel is a badly tanked super, and now with the changes it is even more dangerous to fly. The Hel should be brought in line.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Pattern Clarc
Citeregis
#293 - 2011-10-10 18:59:16 UTC
Also, what do fighters do exactly?

Ex CSM member & Designer of the Tornado. Gallente - Pilot satisfaction
Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#294 - 2011-10-10 18:59:27 UTC
The Mittani wrote:
[Excuse me sir, but the forums have taught me that the CSM is a completely powerless entity and that the Chairmanship is a title without meaning.


I can confirm that this is indeed the case. All CSMs are mostly useless, and the Chairman is the most mostly useless of us all.

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery
Zhade Lezte
#295 - 2011-10-10 19:00:10 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:
Regarding Titan gun tracking:

I am well aware of the issue and considered making changes to it. I decided against it for this balancing pass. We are still working on the winter release and this is not completely off the table. There will be public testing of these balancing changes on SISI and we are ready to consider further changes if needed.


Excellent to know this isn't set in stone...but could you tell us the reasoning for leaving out this change? To me it seems you're leaving the ability for titans (and dreadnoughts) to easily destroy subcaps while making it significantly more difficult for the other kind of supercap (and carriers using fighters) to take out subcaps. Granted the doomsday nerf is a step in the right direction, but it seems weird to significantly nerf fighters (especially if they can't even hit stationary battleships anymore) and leave XL turrets as is. Especially, as previously mentioned, with titans being immune to hostile EWAR but not friendly EWAR. If someone can tracking link a titan I don't see why I should be prevented from using a tracking disruptor on one.

Like many others, I think the fighter nerf might need to be lessened slightly and XL gun tracking should absolutely be looked at. Hopefully SISI combat tests will illustrate this.
Heimdallofasgard
Ministry of Furious Retribution
Fraternity.
#296 - 2011-10-10 19:00:11 UTC
BUT YOU NERFED THE VELDNAUGHT!!!!
demonfurbie
Covert-Nexus
#297 - 2011-10-10 19:00:39 UTC
the issue with supers isnt the ship its self its the ability to move them with such ease

a fleet shouldnt consist of 1 plated out cyno ship a few hics and 150+ sc/titans that can jump to the 1 cyno

the sc should be able to have 20 fighters and 20 bombers in its drone bay, seeing thats all it can use now anyway
the fighter change is a little too drastic, a triple extended shield rigged rokh thats being painted cant be hit if the changes go3
it also hurts the less used carrier.

the moros is gonna have huge cap issues unless they buff the cap amt/recharge

it seams like they are trying to make blobs bigger with the removal of drones, less ability for the bigger ships to kill the smaller means more people in smaller ships

the dd change is fine (still wanna see it like the the vid were it dd's a station)
Metis Laxon
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#298 - 2011-10-10 19:00:46 UTC
Sigras wrote:
ToXicPaIN wrote:
Remove Dronebay from the Titan and Dreadnought sucks
also that the DD dont work on Sub-Caps ... ppff ... F*** O**

with what weapon can a Titan and a Dread now fight vs. Sub-Caps ??

a Citadel Torpedo vs a Hurricane dont work.
or a Siege Autocanon vs. Hurricane also dont work.

at the moment there are only Drones to fight them.

so this realy realy sucks !

That was the point . . . . did you even read the blog? let me spell it out for you

YOURE NOT SUPPOSED TO FIGHT SUB-CAPS WITH CAPS, THATS WHY YOU NEED SUPPORT FLEETS NOW!


^ that
Dirk Tungsten
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#299 - 2011-10-10 19:01:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirk Tungsten
Ok heres the bread and the butter of things.

Thers are by all means alot of pros that will mean fleet fights could be more Ballz deep coming from the patch, but alot of crutial badly influenced cons.
The loggoff timer relooping, yes a good idea, but why introduce 20% decrease in shield/armor/structure aswell. This is giving supers/titans relatively no chance. with the aggro relooping, should keep the stats tank wise for supers/titans, but maybe balance out what currently is there. For instance Aeon should have less HP as has an isaine tank, wyvern and Nyx should tank wise be relatively unchanged. The Poor Hel should get a buff. Make it competitive.

DDs on titans should be able to hit BSs if not give them a slight tracking bonus so they are at least able to hit BSs well and have some sort of a tank lol

It seems ccp are carebearing up eve for newer players or alot of the subcap players. What they are failing to realise is that this patch will be a tradgedy for a few of those crutial points. Alot of other vets are thinking of hanging up there boots when this patch is released.

It seems heirachy has been too influenced by certain GMs CSMs that revolve around fountian region,we all know who they are. What this patch allows is certain entities that live in fountian (cough cough) to use mass blob fleets of 2000+ again and lagg out systems. There will be no counter to this after the patch. What this patch is going to allow is lagg tactics and mass 2000+ man fleets to rule eve over better organised,structured & skilled alliances. Its basically allowing a bunch of noobs with no structure in there fleet to be successful. Carebearing it down. If you want to kill a titan/super then an aggressing fleet should at least have a well thought through structure an plan to there fleet, they do not deserve and should not expect to kill any supers/titans unless that is implemented.

When alot of the narrow minded people out there eventually realise what this patch will do, the pros from this patch will be massively overlooked, as this will not balance things, its only going to be putting the weight on the other end of the scales.
mkint
#300 - 2011-10-10 19:02:03 UTC
These changes are good, I guess, except they won't fix the problem of "blobbing = winning".

Unless there's a SPECIFIC counter to supers, these changes are promoting even bigger blobs. CCP's RMT friends will still own null because they will be the only people able to meet the new standards of even bigger blobs.

Blackops should be able to solo-kill supers.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.