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Incarna/WiS Disappointment

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CCP Bayesian
#301 - 2012-07-02 18:03:05 UTC
Salpun wrote:
We getting that blog to day?


I've been held up trying to get a moment with CCP Unifex. We're a lot further on than we were when the blog was written so I'm going to rewrite it on Wednesday to update it, change up the pictures and if we can get approval put together an edit of an internal release demo Team Avatar did of the prototype to the whole of CCP. Sorry for all the delays in getting information to you guys but we will show you what we've been doing in more detail soon.

EVE Software Engineer Team Space Glitter
Rees Noturana
Red Rock Mining Company
#302 - 2012-07-02 18:24:46 UTC
CCP Bayesian wrote:
Salpun wrote:
We getting that blog to day?


I've been held up trying to get a moment with CCP Unifex. We're a lot further on than we were when the blog was written so I'm going to rewrite it on Wednesday to update it, change up the pictures and if we can get approval put together an edit of an internal release demo Team Avatar did of the prototype to the whole of CCP. Sorry for all the delays in getting information to you guys but we will show you what we've been doing in more detail soon.


Farther along with that Unity based demo? Is the blog just to show the concept before starting development? We're years away from this hitting TQ right?

_ _
Salpun
Global Telstar Federation Offices
Masters of Flying Objects
#303 - 2012-07-02 18:27:23 UTC
Rees Noturana wrote:
CCP Bayesian wrote:
Salpun wrote:
We getting that blog to day?


I've been held up trying to get a moment with CCP Unifex. We're a lot further on than we were when the blog was written so I'm going to rewrite it on Wednesday to update it, change up the pictures and if we can get approval put together an edit of an internal release demo Team Avatar did of the prototype to the whole of CCP. Sorry for all the delays in getting information to you guys but we will show you what we've been doing in more detail soon.


Farther along with that Unity based demo? Is the blog just to show the concept before starting development? We're years away from this hitting TQ right?

Earlier in the thread it was stated it would take the current team a year to get it to TQ. If I remember correctly

If i dont know something about EVE. I check https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/ISK_The_Guide

See you around the universe.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#304 - 2012-07-02 18:29:48 UTC
Andoria Thara wrote:
Baneken wrote:

Well that certainly sounds promising, I wonder if in future we could interact with DUST soldiers on stations, now that would be just awesome.


Could that be the reason why we aren't getting DUST for the PC? Because WiS will let us interact with DUST players in FPS style shooter mode? /me starts rumors


Please remember that with the eve server in one location and running with a one second update cycle that shooters will not work too well. Dust has multiple servers scattered about the planet (to reduce speed of light issues), and a faster cycle. (I assume you can only play dust vs players who are close to the same server you are on. Eve being world wide cannot have such a limitation)

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Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#305 - 2012-07-02 19:59:14 UTC
CCP Bayesian wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
[quote=CCP Bayesian]I wonder in what point "actual gameplay" became "dungeon raiding shooter", as i can't recall that anyone asked the players interested on WiS what did they want or expect from it. Question


A "dungeon raiding shooter" is definitely not what we envisage this gameplay as being.


Hey, i also don't envisage it as a dungeon raiding shooter. I would love to envisage it as a stealthy crime thing, FAI. I would PAY to sabotage a griefer's clone right before he gets podded so he losses some skillpoints and the rules put him in the position of biting the bullet for once in his despicable life.

But it's not what we envisage, rather it's the time-to-grief within the rules. Follow the explorers and shoot them dead ASAP, that's exaclty the shortest time-to-grief, an that's exactly what this gameplay will become about with the rules you are planning.

How do you plan to prevent that it becomes a grief fest with professional bullies and leroyjenkiners spoiling it all? Will the site be protected from outside? No. Will players be safe from friendly fire? No. Will be players unable to harm others? No.

So, please, HOW will you prevent your gameplay to become a griefing sport in the line of blow-a-Hulk?

Of course, there will be a place where it will be 100% safe and so will be grinded to exhaustion: nullsec. But then, you already should know how many people lives in nullsec... And in case you can't figure, nullsec is not my cup of tea.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
MotherMoon
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#306 - 2012-07-02 20:38:05 UTC
CCP Bayesian wrote:
Salpun wrote:
We getting that blog to day?


I've been held up trying to get a moment with CCP Unifex. We're a lot further on than we were when the blog was written so I'm going to rewrite it on Wednesday to update it, change up the pictures and if we can get approval put together an edit of an internal release demo Team Avatar did of the prototype to the whole of CCP. Sorry for all the delays in getting information to you guys but we will show you what we've been doing in more detail soon.


awesome can't wait to see it : )

also to other people here, a year away would mean it looks really good. You people have no concept of how long it takes to make a game. Just trust us, a working single level aplha build might LOOK good. but that's it, it's going to need content, balance, levels, more graphics, systems to hook it up live, docking mechanics, a new system to handle your empty ship in space, how to get multiple teams in at multiple points, weapons, tons of stuff to find.

Then it needs at least 6 months of game testing.

http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg
Solhild
Doomheim
#307 - 2012-07-02 20:39:59 UTC
This is starting to sound exciting Shocked
MotherMoon
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#308 - 2012-07-02 20:40:14 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
Andoria Thara wrote:
Baneken wrote:

Well that certainly sounds promising, I wonder if in future we could interact with DUST soldiers on stations, now that would be just awesome.


Could that be the reason why we aren't getting DUST for the PC? Because WiS will let us interact with DUST players in FPS style shooter mode? /me starts rumors


Please remember that with the eve server in one location and running with a one second update cycle that shooters will not work too well. Dust has multiple servers scattered about the planet (to reduce speed of light issues), and a faster cycle. (I assume you can only play dust vs players who are close to the same server you are on. Eve being world wide cannot have such a limitation)


Eve doesn't , in eve you can shoot any dust players.

also dust players can play across all of the planets of eve online with any other dust player no matter where they are.

WiS in eve is already on the same cycle as dust. In fact it was one of the corner stones of getting dust and eve to work together despite being on separate ticks.

http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg
MotherMoon
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#309 - 2012-07-02 20:41:47 UTC
CCP Bayesian wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
[quote=CCP Bayesian]I wonder in what point "actual gameplay" became "dungeon raiding shooter", as i can't recall that anyone asked the players interested on WiS what did they want or expect from it. Question


A "dungeon raiding shooter" is definitely not what we envisage this gameplay as being.


more like deadspace then? What do you envision? also ignore that bart, we don't get to tell CCP what to do. if it's well done and popular, then ya, if it's terrible and no one plays, i won't be becuase players didn't want it, it'll be because what you made is ****.

http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg
MotherMoon
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#310 - 2012-07-02 20:44:01 UTC
Morwen Lagann wrote:
Lapine Davion wrote:
See: Dust 514 Cloning tech.


Entirely different tech. We are not DUSTies. If we get killed outside of the capsule, our only recourse is a backup ("soft") clone that only contains memories (hint: SP) up to the point the backup was made - a time-consuming backup given the need to not destroy the brain in the process.

Furthermore, #2 is out entirely as well, unless there are some pretty drastic changes to CONCORD policies. Having two or more simultaneously active clones is highly illegal and a "crime of the highest magnitude". To avoid this you'd need to "shut down" the clone inside the capsule, leaving your ship entirely defenseless. That really sounds like an absolutely wonderful idea to me.

#3 is the most sensible: given the option of dying and losing your memories, causing CONCORD to crawl up your ass even more than they do already with all of the monitoring equipment stashed in our ships and capsules, or sending some expendable peons, what is any capsuleer with a brain going to do? That's right - they're going to use the redshirts.

On the other hand, #3 also defeats the purpose of it being our own avatar doing things, which begs the question: if, god forbid, CCP decides to design this feature with the intent of remaining consistent with EVE's already-existing and long-established Prime Fiction, what the hell is the point of this kind of WiS content?


what? we are in a spacesuit, just like dust bunnies, and in the books pilots die out side of the pod all the time. Just read the articles on this very site, your making stuff up.

dust players can have 1,000's of clones, and these dust mercs DO fight in space, according to the book that is launching the game. So one day you might have POS fights with dust players. No reason they couldn't do that. it's all networking.

http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg
Mashie Saldana
V0LTA
WE FORM V0LTA
#311 - 2012-07-02 21:15:49 UTC
Just let us clone jump to a station assault clone after we dock where the ship clone will act as the "medical clone". Sure if the ship is exploded before you exploration clone there may be some SP issues. Twisted

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Price Check Aisle3
#312 - 2012-07-02 21:20:18 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
blow-a-Hulk

Shocked
  • Karl Hobb IATS
Urgg Boolean
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#313 - 2012-07-02 21:28:13 UTC
Peter Raptor wrote:
- snip - weirdo avatar perverts with no life, trying to chat up 12 year olds. Abandon WiS .


The Internet: where men are men, women are men, and children are Federal agents.

WiS Potential ::
- a stock exchange style center where you could interact with other traders.
- corp meetings in special rentable halls like an Apple share holder meeting.
- where you can meet up with DUST players and slam some intergalactic brews while talking over the next wave of battles
- and if you really want to, synchronized dancing (like people would do in in Guild Wars).

Is any of that going to happen? Probably not.
Messoroz
AQUILA INC
Verge of Collapse
#314 - 2012-07-02 21:46:22 UTC
Bootleg Jack wrote:
You mean CCP let a handfull of loud mouth babies who were actually only mad because they couldn't get mommy to buy a monocle convince them to allow their game to stagnate and die?

When this game dies another will fill it's place, one with modern graphics, so I am not losing sleep over it.

This is the exact same mistake EA made with UO, they let their current customers talk them out of anything that was not "more of the same" till they had almost no new customers.

Then the current customers left.


Modern graphics? Are you playing with EVE on low?
Price Check Aisle3
#315 - 2012-07-02 22:14:56 UTC
Urgg Boolean wrote:
WiS Potential ::
- a stock exchange style center where you could interact with other traders.
- corp meetings in special rentable halls like an Apple share holder meeting.
- where you can meet up with DUST players and slam some intergalactic brews while talking over the next wave of battles
- and if you really want to, synchronized dancing (like people would do in in Guild Wars).

Is any of that going to happen? Probably not.

Since all of that is pretty much devoid of actual gameplay, I'd say it's a good thing.

I mean, stock exchange could be kind of cool but why bother when your market window provides all the functionality you need?

Corp meetings? Use Mumble/TS3/EVE Voice/whatever while people play their game. Having avatars just means someone will be doing some masturbation dance on a desk during the meeting.

"slam some intergalactic brews" and "synchronized dancing" lmao.
  • Karl Hobb IATS
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#316 - 2012-07-02 22:19:40 UTC
Urgg Boolean wrote:
Peter Raptor wrote:
- snip - weirdo avatar perverts with no life, trying to chat up 12 year olds. Abandon WiS .


The Internet: where men are men, women are men, and children are Federal agents.

WiS Potential ::
- a stock exchange style center where you could interact with other traders.
- corp meetings in special rentable halls like an Apple share holder meeting.
- where you can meet up with DUST players and slam some intergalactic brews while talking over the next wave of battles
- and if you really want to, synchronized dancing (like people would do in in Guild Wars).

Is any of that going to happen? Probably not.


Hah, dancing in WiS. I used to fantasyze with that and even accounted for the1 second server update time so two players could synchronize their animations and follow the steps of a formal dance; not just make silly moves together but follow each step of, say, a waltz, from two corners of the world and just because it is fun to do and pleasant to see.

Call me insane. Lol

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Shepard Book
Underground Stargate
#317 - 2012-07-02 22:52:25 UTC
Some pretty cool concepts IMO. I take it this kinda stuff in a POS has been discussed? Looking at the modular stuff in yalls trip to Russia made me have to ask.
Steve Thomas
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#318 - 2012-07-02 23:47:09 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
We're here for spaceships. CCP was on a path that had an 18month gap in spaceship iteration.

That's bad, mmmkay.

If you want to dance, the command works really well in WoW.


and on top of that this was a product that suposedly has been in development (depending on who you talk to) since somewhere between 1998 and 2001, and all we got was a game engine that still has issues with you being in a single mostly unfurnished room by yourself,

to put this in perspective, a company with HALF the software development team that CCP claims that they threw at this was able to create a game Engine that started development sometime around 2005, (the Creation Engine) that is capable of doing things that the Current WiS/Carbon Engine cant do for at least a full 2 generations of Graphic cards that dont exist yet.(handleing multiple Dynamic avatars in a fully animated enviroment with controled population in a SINGLE PLAYER GAME, never mind an MMO(MMOs simply due to the fact that Player behaviour cant be predicted, never mind the tendancy on the part of players to create flash mobs and semi perminent high pop locations for whatever reason tends to put a heck of a lot more load on graphics cards than single player mmos)
Steve Thomas
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#319 - 2012-07-03 00:19:44 UTC
Let me clarify something

I want Walking In Stations that works, and has Full single and multi player bit s to it

I also want to be able to Walk in Spaceships.

I also want to walk on planets

I also want to be able to pull out my guns and missle launchers and other things and be able to use them on other players.

I also want to stick live grenades in people pants or crazyglue them to the middle of there backs but then im odd that way.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#320 - 2012-07-03 00:30:34 UTC
Steve Thomas wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
We're here for spaceships. CCP was on a path that had an 18month gap in spaceship iteration.

That's bad, mmmkay.

If you want to dance, the command works really well in WoW.


and on top of that this was a product that suposedly has been in development (depending on who you talk to) since somewhere between 1998 and 2001, and all we got was a game engine that still has issues with you being in a single mostly unfurnished room by yourself,

to put this in perspective, a company with HALF the software development team that CCP claims that they threw at this was able to create a game Engine that started development sometime around 2005, (the Creation Engine) that is capable of doing things that the Current WiS/Carbon Engine cant do for at least a full 2 generations of Graphic cards that dont exist yet.(handleing multiple Dynamic avatars in a fully animated enviroment with controled population in a SINGLE PLAYER GAME, never mind an MMO(MMOs simply due to the fact that Player behaviour cant be predicted, never mind the tendancy on the part of players to create flash mobs and semi perminent high pop locations for whatever reason tends to put a heck of a lot more load on graphics cards than single player mmos)


Considering the multi player and combat oriented nature of WOD, which uses the same engine, I'm pretty sure they considered that. Smile

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