Missions & Complexes

Everyone that is complaining saying "Incursions are too much isk" are getting it wrong... "Vanguards too much isk" yes that's possibly right.

But just because the only instances of incursion running you have done or your friends have told you about are overpowered and easy to do, don't assume that the much harder and more effort to complete Assault and Headquarter sites are the same. It would be like me saying, "Oh I did one of those 3/10 DED sites. They are so easy, they should nerf all DED sites"

When we did Headquarters sites the other day, it took on average 40 minutes to complete at 31.5 mill pay per site. so that's 46/47mill per hour roughly. For Headquarters... 40 man fleet, in which some pockets have enough incoming DPS to take out a heavily tanked BS in around 10-15 seconds.

I can make more Isk on my own... I have 2 toons with lvl 4 agents, both with the same corp, so I could take missions on both and blitz them duel boxed. Would save myself the effort of finding another 39 people to do HQ sites with. But I find the Incursions more enjoyable. I just wish there was a bigger reward for doing the Assault and Headquarters sites.

Also for those that think the AI for the Incursion NPC's is easily beaten... it's not. They do rapid target switches and alpha strikes. we had several close calls and even lost ships because they would spread fire throughout the groups then suddenly focus fire on one ship. The logi's would struggle to get reps, because they are cycling off of the previous targets.

I feel bad for you, need 8 years to get to play real eve.

time to get out of HS??

There are these nifty areas of null sec you can't take sov in. Rumors say the systems are NPC controlled and anyone can dock in the stations.

If it's a small tight group you want to roll with, why not take said group to one of those areas?

-EFFORT-

Which does not matter to the individual pilot lol. Getting anomalies done quicker doesn't do anything for you.

Let me give you an example.: I rat with a ship and make 15 mil ticks. My buddy comes in with a ship that does less dps, we complete anoms faster, but get 12 mil each per tick. The anoms are pumping mre isk in to the game with 2 of us yes (24 mil per 20 minutes as opposed to the 15 mil I was doing solo), but MY share has decreased do to the current "even split" mechanic.

The even split mechanic punishes anom runners grouping up (unless you are the guy with the lower dps, then grouping up with a more powerful buddie allows you too bascially still isk from the other guy) unless (as I do) both ships belong to one actual person. Incursion Runners (and to a lesser extent, Mission Runners) don't even notice this because in addtion to bounties, Incursions/Missions give LP, so "running the sites faster" makes sense.



Yes, i've run them post nerf, just like I did anoms post nerf. My buddies corp was working on the best way to do Assaults last night.

The problem wasn't the nerfs, it was the "less than creative people". After the anom nerf, many people with anom running alts went back to empire because their "sanctums and havens" were gone. Me, I learned to live off (pre-buff) Forsaken Hubs and Forsaken Rally points and scoffed at the idiots that ran.

Same thing here. Hell there are now new incursion videos on youtube from people who are figuring it out. Unlike people like you, who seem to have given up and who now demand CCP basicaly fix it for you.



Yes, because I need a TWO THOUSAND TOON Alliance behind me to make that possible. Incursion runners fly more expensive fits than I do and have concord to prevent all but the most suicidal non-consensual pvp other than wardecs..



Yes, your head and 2000 of my closest friends lol.

Just like lower isk making potential is what you consent to when you live in the highest security space.

This is why a mission in an 0.5 system pays more than a mission in a 1.0 system. Incursions (before now) violated this principle, the core principle of what is supposed to be a pvp-centric risk vs reward game..

It's not really different from the old "gunmining vs mining" problem CCP also just fixed (and that some people who benifiteed form the old way complained about). CCP understood that you just shouldn't have been able to mine "better" with a gun than you can with a mining laser, thus the end to drone poo. Well, a person in less risky space should accept that if they WANT more, they have to RISK more.



The "freedom of CTAs and hotdrops lol.



Someone needs a dictionary. Something you EARNED (by taking it, by having to defend it) is not an entitlement.

This is what I hate about hi-sec dwellers, they don't want to go to the trouble, face the frustrations and risk as those of us who venture out from under the loving embrace of high sec, yet they still want all the goodies. It's like high sec people = the Welfare hoodrats of real life lol.

In the recent past, CCP has shown some wisdom in this regard, nerfing anomalies so that all null space isn't the same, killing gunmining so real miner can thrive, and nerfing incursions out from under the coddled minority calling itself the "Incursion Community". I just hope their bravery doesn't waver.

Sure, make incursions worthwile, but keep to the Risk vs Reward spirit of the game.

Did you even read half of what you quoted here? Risk vs Reward is why low and null sec incursions pay more than high sec. Thats not an issue. Trying to say that a ten man fleet in high sec should make less isk/hr than a solo pilot in null is just ludicrous. And yet this makes us 'entitled' cause we believe it was over-tuned a bit? Unless you have something to say related to the actual topic of the thread please stop trolling. You're only making it harder for feedback to be passed along.

Hard to believe there are so many obtuse Incursion Runners, no wonder y'all can't figure out how to make the new system work for you and need ccp to hold your hands. You should be embarrased.

High Sec is the games "safe"-ish zone. By staying there instead of venturing out to less secure space where people have an easier time of killing you or forcing you to group up for self defense, you are tacitly agreeing to lower income across the board.

In order to be "safe"-ish in null tkaes a massive effort by a lot of people (with a lot of other people trying to make you unsafe). part of that effort is joining a corp, making frineds, joining an alliances, following someone else rules, fighting against others ect. You don't have to really do ANY of that in high sec or high sec incursions (or just about any other activity in high sec).

CCP should put it's foot down and continue to say "you want better, go forth into the wilderness". Even as they stand right now, High sec incursions are wrong for this kind of game. I enjoy them, the game needed group pve content, but that doesn't make them any less wrong.

I accept that many people are too weak willed (even in a video game) to put real effort into something, but I really wish CCP would stop handing them more stuff for them to get spolied by, even if ccp is trying to stay in business.

For high sec incusions, those fleets you're whining about making more isk than you, those are the guys, that either joined a corp JUST for incursions, or developed a solid reputation in the community and worked their way into an incursion network like BTL, DTM, SAQD, ISN etc. ALL of which work hard at protecting their fleets without outside support, which means having rules to follow, keeping a blacklist, and always having the eye out for those griefers. And the sad thing is you act like you cant BOTH live in null and run high sec incursions. I did that with jump clones for a long time before i decided i was sick of CTAs and pos bashes. Pretty much the only thing holding sov garuntees you is the right to shoot anyone for any reason. Trying to imply that also entitles you to make more isk than anyone else regardless of conditions is about as 'entitled' as it gets. I can promise you that every member of an incursion fleet works harder for that isk than you do in null. Running incursions is way harder than any pve i ever did in null, and i will even go so far as to say that flying 9 2-5bil isk ships in high sec is a hell of a lot more of a risk to fly than a 60-70mil isk bc in null. I think it's fairly obvious that you hate living in null and just want everyone else to be as miserable as you are.

In other words you will do a post mortem after you'vekilled an entire community.