EVE General Discussion

then how far did you go back ! all the way back to 2003 when a CVA contingent attacked empire and out tanked concord and ended up getting a weeks ban ..... i bet not .... admittedly it wasnt on the scale that goonswarm have done .... but this is not the point .


were you around when the saddest event in eve occoured ... two stupid idiots getting married ingame ...... untill M0o decide to **** on thier parade ! no ...i bet you werent . !

so dont give me the "computer says no" bollox mate cos it happened ...and i dont post bollox when i know crap has happend in eve .

There are many who think he was wronged.

Where/when did Mittani say anything? I havent seen him since "the return"

A few reasons why they support it.

1. EVE is a Sandbox. That means there is no official rule requiring people to play nice or even be civil to each other. CCP has upheld this belief through thick and thin, albeit with some recent missteps (the 180 on the Boomarang tactic, for example). Simply put, they don't really "support" it per say, they support the rule framework and the culture of the Sandbox that allows us to do it if we want.

2. EVE is unique amongst the MMOs because it is a Sandbox. It is literally it's biggest selling point. No other MMO comes even close to offering what EVE offers -- and stories like this are perfect examples that CCP can point to and go "You can't get that experience in WOW."

3. The EVE Economy is absolutely ******. Years of RMT, of Botting, of "free" minerals have done an absolute number on the economy. While CCP would never directly intervene, they certainly welcome player self correction. Goons attacked the Gallente Ice fields not because it would **** off highsec kids -- well, not entirely so -- but because our logistics guys looked at the economy as a whole and realized that the entire economy is based on a few hundred people cheating using ice bot accounts. That's ****** up, and you don't have to be a Goon to agree. Ice needs to be moved to lowsec or even Nullsec, and moved fast.

4. The risk/reward balance between Highsec and Nullsec is even more ******. Hulkageddon, the Ice Interdiction, Burn Jita, these are all symptoms of a bigger disease -- the death of the PVP Ecosystem in Nullsec. This is going to be hard for some Highsec players to understand, but there are Nullsec players who do enjoy Mining, Crafting, and other Logistics roles. Hell, The Mittani originally was a miner. The problem is, with botters and other cheaters, as well as the flood of "Nullsec Minerals" coming from other sources (Drone Poo, Refining, etc) there was literally no reason to ever mine in Nullsec. It just didn't make any sense at all in comparison to mining in Highsec, even with the minerals being slightly less valuable.

5. EVE is, at it's heart, a PVP game. Everything in EVE is a zero sum game, save some Isk Faucets that CCP are desperately trying to plug. Everything you do in EVE is either working with (in temporary partnership) or working against other players. Crafting, Mining, Market Shinanigans, even if you never fit a gun to your ship, you are PVPing.

7. Highsec players feel they are too safe. Simply put, there are those out there who read the warnings and thought that they were bunk, because Jita's a "safe" system. They were wrong. If you want to be safe in EVE -- fit a tank. Get a friend to fly a combat ship or a logi ship with shield reps to keep you safe. Don't just think you can streak naked across the Jita sky carrying a huge sack of money and holding a sign saying "Bite me, Goonies" and not expect to be mugged.

8. If you fell prey to the Goons in Burn Jita, you deserved it. CCP (and Goons!) literally did everything they could to warn people not to fly big ships in Jita. We announced it a month ahead of time. There were hundreds of threads premptively complaining about it before we even began. And CCP put a warning up on the freaking login screen, which bent the spirit of the Sandbox. Simply put, if you did get ganked, you had no excuse. EVE is a multiplayer game, and ignoring the entirety of the playerbase outside of spreadsheets is not the spirit of any MMO.

The definition that CCP, and indeed the rest of the gaming industry, uses for Player vs. Player has been spelled out many times even in this very thread. Griefing has been covered as well.

Unfortunately, that doesn't stop people from sticking their fingers in their ears and chanting "No, I'm right and everyone else is wrong".

Not criticizing your post in any way, it was good.

"News" article linked on the forums.

Disagree. This event is exactly the same as any scam or piracy...

In point of fact, Jita itself is a sandbox creation; CCP did not declare Jita the place for trade - the players did. Tomorrow the players could change their mind. CCP for the more part has been neutral in this.. they love to see sandbox activity..in all it's forms.

Your 15 dollars is paid to take part in the experiment.

I'm not a fan of having my activities disrupted.. but I am not blaming CCP for allowing it in their sandbox.

Uh no, sitting in certain spots in WoW and pvping ppl is considered griefing.
Its very specific in that game.

In here, its very vague or rater its enforced in a very vague manner.
IF this were enforced LIKE WoW, then yes, BJ would have gotten ppl temp banned.

But what if I simply DONT FEEL LIKE IT? I gotta work during most of all those hours you are in Jita. And that one hour that I do have time to log in to haul some goods, I am being blocked. Obviously, I am not happy to find out that someone with too much free time and money has the power to prevent me from playing my favourite game the way I want to play it. In my opinion, the only entity with the ability to do this should be the devs.


What I cannot understand though, is why is it that CCP and so many others who play EVE refuse to acknowlege that some people simply do not want to PvP, and will continue refusing to do so, no matter how much you push at them.

There are those that refuse to PvP because they simply do not have the time for these things. PvP requires a hefty time investment and lots of dedication. You need to buy all necessary items on the market, then you need to fly your ship to the place where the fight wil take place just to get it blown up and be forced to start the whole tedious process over again. All for a few seconds of excitement, and hours of grinding to make the isk back required to purchase a replacement ship and all items required. I happen to be one of those that find their satisfaction in other things, such as mining rocks while watching TV or modifying orders on the market during evenings before going to sleep. Am I suddenly not allowed to do so becuase some maniac out there in control of a large virtual corporation with too much free time thinks I should change my activities to PvP?


I can quit in anger... But why? The maniac would then be very sad becuase he would have no one to push anymore.. The problem is that eventually it's ought to happen. I may decide that the satisfaction I get from EVE online is no longer worth the time/monetary investment due to certain rescent changes, and then the maniac in control of a large and powerful virtual corp can sit there playing with himself... But wait, that sounds like I am planning to quit, which I most certainly dont intend to do until the option of "carebearing" is completely and totally taken away from me.

If no one was flipping burgers, ..... What kind of the world would be be living in?

You do know, right, that Security Status of systems and pilots, aggression mechanics (and Hi/Low/Null) were added? That "in the beginning" there was only mining and shooting each other? There may have been belt rats (I'm pretty sure there were - but not 100% - older players will have to correct me on that if I'm wrong).

But there was *no* "hi-sec".

So really, CCP is fully aware of the game mechanics, and have pretty much specifically made a game, wherein we can be interfered with, or interfere with others. In effect saying to each and every player (not specifically saying, but rather saying with the actual structure of the game):

"Yes, this *is* a pvp game, as almost *every* activity you engage in, can be interrupted by another player, or players".

That is what the game is designed for.

Stop saying EVE is a Sandbox than. A sandbox supports every type of gamer including solo players, if the game Mechanics does not support solo play then it cannot be a sandbox because in a Sandbox a player decided what to do, when to do it and how to do it and if they choose solo then that should be an option. In EvE that is not an option, hense its NOT a sandbox, so stop with this crap about being a Sandbox.

Per your own logic EVE is not a sandbox because solo play is not an option due to game mechanics.

I happened to not play the game solo and enjoy it but to tell others that their game play is wrong because they want to play solo, than EVE cannot be a Sandbox.

I think you Vet EVE players should learn what a Sandbox is before you keep using it over and over again and clearly do not understand what a Sandbox is.