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Eve WiS

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Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#141 - 2016-11-18 13:51:00 UTC
Jogging, jumping, shooting, doing stuff around. A lot of stuff. Actually thinking more about those things, and these thoughts are quickly starting to overwhelm my little, feeble mind. 😓
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#142 - 2016-11-18 13:54:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
mkint wrote:
Nana Skalski wrote:

And some features required a lot of background work, not really visible in client until they delivered stuff working in new environment.


This seems to be a running theme with CCP:

"Oh, we're doing a massive upgrade to the NPC AI that will close the gap between PVE and PVP fits!" -come out with wormholes, the sleeper AI doesn't affect the vast majority of PVE

"Oh, we're restructuring the mission system so we can have much more elaborate storylines in mission!" -puts out some epic arcs, only one of which sees any traffic as it's treated as part of the tutorials.

"Oh, we're putting together a new mission and NPC authoring system so we can revamp missions and put out new content easier and faster" -absolutely nothing happens with any of this work.

"New AI again" -incursions, mostly the same AI as sleepers but in highsec, abandoned after a few minor balance tweeks.

"New AI again"

"new AI again"

And the majority of PVE is still done with the original AI in belts, anoms, and missions.

What other systems have had the same story? An entire continent of fallow fields.


😱 OMG you are right!
Maybe they are still working on it, one code line a day. Then starting over from scratch when it doesnt work at all as expected. 😵
mkint
#143 - 2016-11-18 14:02:30 UTC  |  Edited by: mkint
Nana Skalski wrote:
mkint wrote:
Nana Skalski wrote:

And some features required a lot of background work, not really visible in client until they delivered stuff working in new environment.


This seems to be a running theme with CCP:

"Oh, we're doing a massive upgrade to the NPC AI that will close the gap between PVE and PVP fits!" -come out with wormholes, the sleeper AI doesn't affect the vast majority of PVE

"Oh, we're restructuring the mission system so we can have much more elaborate storylines in mission!" -puts out some epic arcs, only one of which sees any traffic as it's treated as part of the tutorials.

"Oh, we're putting together a new mission and NPC authoring system so we can revamp missions and put out new content easier and faster" -absolutely nothing happens with any of this work.

"New AI again" -incursions, mostly the same AI as sleepers but in highsec, abandoned after a few minor balance tweeks.

"New AI again"

"new AI again"

And the majority of PVE is still done with the original AI in belts, anoms, and missions.

What other systems have had the same story? An entire continent of fallow fields.


😱 OMG you are right!
Maybe they are still working on it, one code line a day. Then starting over from scratch when it doesnt work at all as expected. 😵

that... that wasn't my point. My point is if they ever do another WIS, they'll probably do what they already almost did with WIS. Make a brand new system that has nothing to do with the old one, and leave the old one cluttering up all our hard drives, the new one basically inaccessible to basically everyone. They'd make a new citadel that costs 1,000X as much as the current biggest one, and make that the only place you can newWIS. It's the CCP Way.

ed: on the other hand, it could be worse. They could remove the hangar view.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.

Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
Somethin Awfull Forums
#144 - 2016-11-18 14:18:44 UTC
Arkoth 24 wrote:


DUST was closed.


I noticed 0 pilots in one of the new corp systems.

That's kind of a bummer. I have 100,000 Marines I was hoping I could unleash on the little buggers one day.
Arnogh Weristrighis
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#145 - 2016-11-18 20:26:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Arnogh Weristrighis
mkint wrote:
There's a reason why that old code was abandoned. There's a reason why the current implemented code was abandoned.


And that reason was crying manbabies that thought this will destroy content that's already there. And compared to what they need to actually maintain game in a working condition and making other content, WIS is peanuts in comparison.

Also, this game might as well not have any NPC enemies, since it's so heavily PVP focuses (if you're in EVE for PVE, you're doing it wrong). NPC mining/NPC frigates should stay in just so players have some heist opportunities, but IMO sleepers and other NPC enemies should be removed as they're easy to kill and easy to run away from. Yes, this is controversial, but really, if they can't make NPC challenging, they could just as well remove them completely and then give players some tools to take over systems, even in highsec and maintain their presence there, so fights would be actually challenging.

Back to WIS, I think CCP would do well by bringing it back. If you don't like it, you just wouldn't use it and play the game as you always were. Meanwhile those who'd like it could get into it.

I know a thing or two on how software get made. I've been deving since I was 10yo (now I'm 26), so based on my experience and given the size of CCP as a company and the fact that WIS content existed at one point (and probably is stowed away somewhere, perhaps even in the client itself, just made inaccessible), it would really take them one to two months to get WIS running again, mostly spent on adjusting old WIS code to current codebase so it would work (as most of graphical assets related to WIS are already made as shown in that video someone linked earlier).

Nana Skalski wrote:
Jogging, jumping, shooting, doing stuff around. A lot of stuff. Actually thinking more about those things, and these thoughts are quickly starting to overwhelm my little, feeble mind. 😓

Well, I'd be fine if it would be just jogging and jumping. Those things are easy to code in a multiplayer context - running is just speed change and animation change and jumping is just movement on the Y axis ;). As for doing stuff around, they could add some casino games where you could bet and win ISK, perhaps some arcade games as well and billiard (pool most likely, though I'd love to see snooker as well).

But things that aren't necessary for working WIS can be added in a future patch, which includes combat and more advanced in-station entertainment.
PopeUrban
El Expedicion
Flames of Exile
#146 - 2016-11-18 23:18:10 UTC
WiS will happen eventually. After the structure revamp, completion of the NPE revamp, whatever systems they are attaching to those player built stargates (new space with new mechanics of some sort) and after the release of legion/nova/whatever they call it these days.

At that point they'll have updated first person assets, two games that are making money, and a reasonable framework to use it as an integration point between them.

So, basically, don't hold your breath. They made a decision a while back to actually start finishing projects before working on new ones, and we have a pretty clear timeline for the currently planned projects.
Hal Morsh
Doomheim
#147 - 2016-11-18 23:31:44 UTC
http://imgur.com/a/Ql3Jc

Yes to WiS.

Oh, I perfectly understand, Hal Morsh — a mission like this requires courage, skill, and heroism… qualities you are clearly lacking. Have you forgotten you're one of the bloody immortals!?

Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
End of Life
#148 - 2016-11-18 23:33:04 UTC
Hal Morsh wrote:
http://imgur.com/a/Ql3Jc

Yes to WiS.

Is that your butt Hal? You sexy man.
Khenza Vektara
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#149 - 2016-11-19 13:07:20 UTC
I've long been a fan of the WiS concept and would love to see it implemented. EVE's character creation is top shelf and it's a pity that the end result is so underutilized. Even if just from a sociological standpoint, having a more fully formed avatar experience in game would add some interesting layers to the interaction that's pretty much limited to ship to ship combat. And then of course there's the whole revenue stream for CCP, as it's a proven fact (phenomenon?) that players tend to dump credits into habitat customization and personalization when there's actually something for their avatar to do. If nothing more, it'd be a fantastic experiment.

I hear the roar of the big machine

Two worlds and in between

Hot metal and methedrine...

I hear your empire down

Bibosikus
Aliastra
#150 - 2016-11-19 13:51:55 UTC
WIS/fps + ccp = bad. it's simple math.

Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.

Lulu Lunette
Savage Moon Society
#151 - 2016-11-19 14:05:59 UTC
Even if it's just a bunch of different 'hangout' venues for our characters, or kind of like now how you can walk to your PI button or your fitting window; that's all it needs to be. (Maybe walk to a mission agent?) All you old money saying that WiS is bad and not good for Eve .. are you kidding me? Video games are more and more microtransaction based everyday. Especially now that we're free to play.

Money on the table.

@lunettelulu7

Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#152 - 2016-11-19 15:06:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
Just add what SC citizens had to pay for with heavy cash when they have done kickstarter. Multiplayer. This.
I think it would be funny to see how those people who had to pay 10000$ react if someone would say them there is something like that in other game for free. :P
mkint
#153 - 2016-11-19 16:32:43 UTC
Lulu Lunette wrote:

Money on the table.

Is this even true? Are there people out there who say "Gee, I sure hate internet spaceships, but I would pay for an internet spaceships game if they had a bigger captain's quarters."?

Or I guess with a little less hyperbole, would this bring in enough *new* players, help retain current players that would otherwise leave, or bring back old players in enough numbers to financially justify the *huge* costs in building and maintaining this? Keep in mind, CCP had to fire 1/3 of it's employees when it turned out space barbie didn't work out, and that was how many employees it took to *fail* at it. The doubling of the company's workforce to do something like this right isn't a small investment.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.

Lulu Lunette
Savage Moon Society
#154 - 2016-11-19 17:02:56 UTC
mkint wrote:
Lulu Lunette wrote:

Money on the table.

Is this even true? Are there people out there who say "Gee, I sure hate internet spaceships, but I would pay for an internet spaceships game if they had a bigger captain's quarters."?

Or I guess with a little less hyperbole, would this bring in enough *new* players, help retain current players that would otherwise leave, or bring back old players in enough numbers to financially justify the *huge* costs in building and maintaining this? Keep in mind, CCP had to fire 1/3 of it's employees when it turned out space barbie didn't work out, and that was how many employees it took to *fail* at it. The doubling of the company's workforce to do something like this right isn't a small investment.


Roll

The first part of your argument makes hilariously no sense.

The structure is mostly there, it's probably not that big a thing to add to it. Like how they add clothes.

@lunettelulu7

Khenza Vektara
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#155 - 2016-11-19 17:26:39 UTC
mkint wrote:
Lulu Lunette wrote:

Money on the table.

Is this even true? Are there people out there who say "Gee, I sure hate internet spaceships, but I would pay for an internet spaceships game if they had a bigger captain's quarters."?

Or I guess with a little less hyperbole, would this bring in enough *new* players, help retain current players that would otherwise leave, or bring back old players in enough numbers to financially justify the *huge* costs in building and maintaining this? Keep in mind, CCP had to fire 1/3 of it's employees when it turned out space barbie didn't work out, and that was how many employees it took to *fail* at it. The doubling of the company's workforce to do something like this right isn't a small investment.


I'm guessing that a robust socially interactive in-game avatar WiS feature could bring in new players to a certain degree, especially those who only know EVE as "that spreadsheets in space game". It would certainly make EVE a fuller experience (and the lulz would be epic and non stop, considering it'd be like these forums but with avatar to avatar face time) but you do have a good point about the cost effective angle for CCP. I suppose time will tell...

I hear the roar of the big machine

Two worlds and in between

Hot metal and methedrine...

I hear your empire down

Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#156 - 2016-11-19 17:27:33 UTC
The money is on the table, but the table is going apparently to another castle for now. Something like 140 M $ I evaluate. Pirate
Arnogh Weristrighis
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#157 - 2016-11-20 13:42:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Arnogh Weristrighis
Nana Skalski wrote:
Just add what SC citizens had to pay for with heavy cash when they have done kickstarter. Multiplayer. This.
I think it would be funny to see how those people who had to pay 10000$ react if someone would say them there is something like that in other game for free. :P

Oh god... Would literally do anything to see those SC(ammed) people cry an ocean after learning about it.

Let's face it, Star Citizen is never coming out, at least not for foreseeable future. It's basically modern Duke Nukem Forever. There are bunch of techdemos related to it, but that's all. Not actual game. Hell, even No Man's Sky is better than SC by virtue of NMS actually being released. And that's saying something.
Jade Blackwind
#158 - 2016-11-20 14:04:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Jade Blackwind
The idea of WiS just refuses to die, doesn't it?

Well, F2P actually happened, so who knows, WiS also might one day.
Alessienne Ellecon
Doomheim
#159 - 2016-11-20 19:02:15 UTC
It won't die because a significant number of people really do want it back. I signed up after Incarna, and I want the stuff I missed. People talk about the Gallente pleasure hub and other things and if there's even a remote possibility of being able to go beyond the captain's quarters into a third-person Citadel environment, I'm all for it.

"CONCORD are the space cops. If you attack someone in a high-security solar system, CONCORD will commit police brutality." - Encyclopedia Dramatica

If EVE is a PvP game, then Anti-Ganking is emergent gameplay.

mkint
#160 - 2016-11-20 23:41:58 UTC
Alessienne Ellecon wrote:
It won't die because a significant number of people really do want it back. I signed up after Incarna, and I want the stuff I missed. People talk about the Gallente pleasure hub and other things and if there's even a remote possibility of being able to go beyond the captain's quarters into a third-person Citadel environment, I'm all for it.


The pleasure hub was replaced by WIS. WIS is part of the reason it's gone. That was lost when they got a new artistic director and the visual style went from a unique eccentric and kinda funny playfulness, to soulless boring grimdark. "yay, we can finally wear leather jackets AND NOTHING ELSE." It used to be there were several different station hangars, Gallente being the one where pop culture would have lived. All the most interesting flavor was thrown in the trash to pave the way for WIS.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.