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Dev blog: Politics by Other Means: Sovereignty Phase Two

First post First post First post
Author
Nyctef
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#421 - 2015-03-03 18:37:32 UTC
I think there's a lot of good ideas here (yay FW in null)

My 2 cents - I think the TCU icon on the in-space UI should be the only one that gets displayed, or is bigger than the others. TCUs have little value now apart from indicating which alliance actually *owns* a system (I think is a big psychological factor) and this would help with that
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#422 - 2015-03-03 18:38:09 UTC
could the timer be switched to be based on the corp that owns it? you can still have multiple TZs but then its can be determined by the smaller groups within the alliance what TZ needs to be covered.
Lena Lazair
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#423 - 2015-03-03 18:39:43 UTC
Aiwha wrote:
I see two options, either we have another massive rebuild of supers (remember when they were motherships?) to fill an entirely new role, or CCP needs to give capital warfare a BIG shot in the arm. Personally, I'm for buffing and expanding capital roles.


You know, I'm at the point that I wish CCP would just accept that the type of people that are going to be most attracted to supers as a concept are the people that will be happy to use supers for PvE and nothing else. And CCP should stop fighting this and just enable it.

Nullsec PvE income should be switched from AFK carrier anomaly ratting to some form of (hopefully active rather than AFK) incursion/sleeper/escalation/L6 missions/whatever supercarrier-based PvE. The people that WANT to fly supercarriers are the ones looking for the purple loot, the raid gear, the biggest/baddest/bestest ship to blow up red crosses with. So fine, let's give it to them to do exactly that in nullsec. They can still be giant loot pinatas the rest of the time to attract/draw conflict.

Everyone who actually flies supercarriers now does so because they HAVE to for PvP/blob/MAD reasons. Pretty much every one of those pilots would actually rather be in a T3 or a HAC or something a lot more fun for regular PvP purposes.
Mudd3
Vector Galactic
#424 - 2015-03-03 18:40:05 UTC
Whatever they end up with, however ****** it potentially can be, there is hardly any chance at all that it could end up any more repulsive than how sov null operates right now.

DaOpa
Static Corp
#425 - 2015-03-03 18:40:12 UTC

Suggestion:

Add in ways for Attackers to shift the "Prime Time" timer by PVP Kills, Structure Kills of SOV Holders and other stuff.

Unbound anchoring requirements for POS/Structures in Null Space, let them build anywhere but with limits of each other.

Change All POS structures and make them modular, allowing additions for players to create "sandcastles"

"POS Idea is to let players start with a base structure that supplies power, requires fuel, has link connectors to which you can add other stuctures too, some structures dont require link but need to be in certain range of base structure. " etc

Change Moon Goo Mining / make it like PI ...




Other things I would add is to make EVE:Legion & Valkyrie have valuable placement in the SOV Changes.
Go with the idea of being able to Jump Clone Out from EVE, Into Legion or Valkyrie and back.

EVE Legion will have modes to destroy PI Operations / Moon Goo stuff since they are planetary.
Valkyrie will have modes to protect the Legion Warbarges


Just my ideas :)
Tyr Dolorem
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#426 - 2015-03-03 18:41:14 UTC
Lena Lazair wrote:
Aiwha wrote:
I see two options, either we have another massive rebuild of supers (remember when they were motherships?) to fill an entirely new role, or CCP needs to give capital warfare a BIG shot in the arm. Personally, I'm for buffing and expanding capital roles.


You know, I'm at the point that I wish CCP would just accept that the type of people that are going to be most attracted to supers as a concept are the people that will be happy to use supers for PvE and nothing else. And CCP should stop fighting this and just enable it.

Nullsec PvE income should be switched from AFK carrier anomaly ratting to some form of (hopefully active rather than AFK) incursion/sleeper/escalation/L6 missions/whatever supercarrier-based PvE. The people that WANT to fly supercarriers are the ones looking for the purple loot, the raid gear, the biggest/baddest/bestest ship to blow up red crosses with. So fine, let's give it to them to do exactly that in nullsec. They can still be giant loot pinatas the rest of the time to attract/draw conflict.

Everyone who actually flies supercarriers now does so because they HAVE to for PvP/blob/MAD reasons. Pretty much every one of those pilots would actually rather be in a T3 or a HAC or something a lot more fun for regular PvP purposes.


I disagree with just about everything you said here.

I mean.... wut...
M1k3y Koontz
THE AESIR.
Hostile Probes
#427 - 2015-03-03 18:41:34 UTC
Yugo 60 wrote:

Problem: Interceptors
Having "uncatchable" fleets of interceptors troll reinforcing everything in the region (or two) during one evening every single time that some structure is out of RF just for the heck of it (and to make sov holders form up for def all the time) is not what I would call a good mechanics. CHANGE INTERCEPTORS to make them catchable or give them inability of RFing.


If, in the 10-40 minutes you have to respond to the RF'ing of your TCU, you can't manage to get one ******* there in a Caracal with RLMLs and one of these links to block the inty's hack and/or kill it, you live too far from that system and do not have the ability nor right to hold it.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.

Querns
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#428 - 2015-03-03 18:42:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Querns
KIller Wabbit wrote:
Shouldn't Starbase deployments, or at least their active industry related arrays, impact the Industrial index? That's a huge component of production presence, probably far exceeding even mining.

I like this suggestion quite a lot. Allow manufacturing in both outposts and pos, and reactor arrays to affect industrial index.

e: research as well

You can use system cost indices to roughly measure the efficacy of manufacturing/research, and have active POS moongoo reactors ping the industrial index as well during their hourly simulation events.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

Amyclas Amatin
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#429 - 2015-03-03 18:42:53 UTC
Vaju Enki wrote:
Nullbear tears. Good.


Would you like to ******* trade places?

For more information on the New Order of High-Sec, please visit: http://www.minerbumping.com/

Remember that whenever you have a bad day in EVE, the correct reponse is "Thank you CCP, may I please have another?"

virm pasuul
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#430 - 2015-03-03 18:43:04 UTC
In all this fuss don't forget that destructible player built stargates are coming at some time.
The fanfest is 2 weeks away, there may be stuff in there that ties in to these changes.........
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#431 - 2015-03-03 18:43:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Bagrat Skalski
All I wanted to see was destructible stations and gates, with battles for gate operation privilages.
Callic Veratar
#432 - 2015-03-03 18:43:27 UTC
I'm really confused. So, if the defensive window is not during your availability you have nothing to do and if it is during your availability you can't do anything else.

So... living in nullsec means you spend all your time defending sov and that's it?
Lena Lazair
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#433 - 2015-03-03 18:43:34 UTC
Helios Panala wrote:
Alliances need to be able to set 'prime-time' on a per structure basis so that groups spread across multiple timezones can be given content, at the very least you can have your different TZs defending different borders.

Other than that looks good to me.


This is way too granular and confusing and doesn't really introduce ANY pressure for widely sprawled groups to consolidate. However, as someone else mentioned (and since the entire system is constellation-focused), being able to set prime-time per constellation might be a reasonable middle ground. It would let people congregate with their active TZ players in a smaller area while still giving a large alliance the ability to bring multiple/flexible groups together across multiple TZ's in neighboring constellations.
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#434 - 2015-03-03 18:43:44 UTC
Am I wrong to believe that the new system involves a lot less destruction? In the old system - apart from stations, sov structures were being shot at and destroyed, which provided an engine for the eve economy. In the new system, basically you flash a light at a sov structure and it flips back and forth in a glorified game of tag, no destruction required. As a result, have we just lost a significant driver of the eve economy?

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.

Anton Menges Saddat
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#435 - 2015-03-03 18:44:25 UTC
I'm very much NOT feeling the primetime concept. It is idiotic and will restrict 'meaningful' battles to just one TZ and I cannot support that. I also say meaningful with quotations because I see no indication of actual benefits for taking/holding sov. Whye ven bother?

I am also envisioning troll fleets of slippery entosis interceptors. Interceptors are already annoying enough with their bubble immunity, this is just going to make it even worse.

I also don't appreciate the way capitals and especially supercapitals keep getting nerfed. At this point I'm having difficulty seeing usage for supers at all because they can't assign fighters, will not be put on-grid to fight subs due to atrocious lock-times and gimped offensive abilities (only 1 wing of fighters, no regular drones) and dreads are the more sensible option for killing other capitals.
Heptameron
Roving Guns Inc.
Pandemic Legion
#436 - 2015-03-03 18:45:13 UTC
Nyan Lafisques wrote:
Heptameron wrote:
So you took away hot drops
You took away fast moving cap warfare
You took away large supercap fights
You gave me space aids

and now you effectively taken away offensive deployment away from my 'home'....

Oh but you have given the griefer in a kestrel a great tool to get their s**ts and giggles....

Nice CCP nice..... *slow clap*


If all your neighbours weren't blue you wouldn't need to "deploy away from your home".


Part of the attraction of such a large universe is the ability to travel long distances and punch people in the face.

I am not saying the game doesn't need change, in particular sov mechanics but they have, in 2 horrible patches removed so much of the different ways to pvp it's kinda crazy. I don't want to be in an almost permanent defensive posture which this patch is going to push on all sov holding alliances.

Does it get rid of the blue donut(s)?? Of course not...

Does it make it easier for smaller entities to take and hold sov?? Of course not.
Nyan Lafisques
Quebecorp
Removal
#437 - 2015-03-03 18:45:32 UTC
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Am I wrong to believe that the new system involves a lot less destruction? In the old system - apart from stations, sov structures were being shot at and destroyed, which provided an engine for the eve economy. In the new system, basically you flash a light at a sov structure and it flips back and forth in a glorified game of tag, no destruction required. As a result, have we just lost a significant driver of the eve economy?


They will explode once the attackers control the Capture-the-flag/Domination system.
Kiandoshia
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#438 - 2015-03-03 18:46:38 UTC
I don't like the primetime thingy. I don't know, everything else sounds nice and will have to see and it makes sense in conjunction with the primetime thing but the primetime thing itself is a little terrible and it kind of makes everything else buckle.

Also yay for lots of tiny, fluid engagements. Ships bigger than cruisers are boring anyways.
Querns
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#439 - 2015-03-03 18:46:57 UTC
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Am I wrong to believe that the new system involves a lot less destruction? In the old system - apart from stations, sov structures were being shot at and destroyed, which provided an engine for the eve economy. In the new system, basically you flash a light at a sov structure and it flips back and forth in a glorified game of tag, no destruction required. As a result, have we just lost a significant driver of the eve economy?

TCUs and IHUBs are blown to smithereens once an attacker successfully contests their sov game. This is especially important for IHUBs, which are freighter sized.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

Nyan Lafisques
Quebecorp
Removal
#440 - 2015-03-03 18:47:33 UTC
Heptameron wrote:
Nyan Lafisques wrote:
Heptameron wrote:
So you took away hot drops
You took away fast moving cap warfare
You took away large supercap fights
You gave me space aids

and now you effectively taken away offensive deployment away from my 'home'....

Oh but you have given the griefer in a kestrel a great tool to get their s**ts and giggles....

Nice CCP nice..... *slow clap*


If all your neighbours weren't blue you wouldn't need to "deploy away from your home".


Part of the attraction of such a large universe is the ability to travel long distances and punch people in the face.

I am not saying the game doesn't need change, in particular sov mechanics but they have, in 2 horrible patches removed so much of the different ways to pvp it's kinda crazy. I don't want to be in an almost permanent defensive posture which this patch is going to push on all sov holding alliances.

Does it get rid of the blue donut(s)?? Of course not...

Does it make it easier for smaller entities to take and hold sov?? Of course not.


Nobody is forcing you to hold your space if what you want is constant deployments. BL and others are doing it just fine.