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There is no multiplier change.

Half the bonuses from the secondary scanning skills are being moved to Astrometrics, so Astrometrics V will be more important than ever.





AFAIK The bonus from the skills are changing (being moved to astrometrics), not the training multiplier. No need for reimubursement

I want to be able to launch less than 7 probes and set my own formation. I always did perfectly well with 5, I don't see what that should change. Also this would mean that if you would loose a probe for whatever reason and you have less than 7, you can't scan at all, which is kinda dumb.

Astrometrics:

This is now a starting skill, all new characters receive this at Level 1
Does not alter ability to launch probes, all players can now launch 7 probes.
Added +5% scan strength, -5% max scan deviation and -0.5 sec scan time per level


Then Astrometric Acquisition, Astrometric Pinpointing and Astrometric Rangefinding will cease to exist?

Should i assume ill have the SP refunded?


EDIT: nvm, just red the following paragraph xD

...what? I... what? Did you even read that?

Before patch:
Astrometrics: Increases number of probes allowed, allows use of DSP @ 5.
Rangefinding: +10% scan str per level
Pinpointing: -10% deviation per level
Acquisition: -10% time per level.

After patch:

Astrometrics: +5% scan strength, -5% max scan deviation and -0.5 sec scan time per level
Rangefinding: +5% scan str per level
Pinpointing: -5% deviation per level
Acquisition: -5% time per level.

This comes out to a very slight buff to probe strength (1.25*1.25 = 1.5625 > 1.5) and a very slight nerf to deviation and scan time.

The skills are not being removed. The skills' training ranks are not being changed. The bonus they provide IS being changed. I would assume you will also need the appropriate skill at 5 to use the T2 versions of the new modules (and, personally, I would be okay with it if they ALL required Astrometrics 5 in addition to the relevant skill).

Thoughts on the new scanner.
The loss of the ability to launch a single probe is missed very much, please put it back in.
The loss of DSP is also missed (contrary to my views prior to using the new system) please put it back.
I like the group movements by default, but scaling the distance between probes should be just alt or user defined.
Please add the scan timer back it was useful.
Cannot comment of the new Data Site mini-game, as it did not work for me.
Please add 8 probes again.
Scanning is way to fast now and I mean way to fast.
Edit: The Astrometric Pinpointing, and Astrometric Acquisition skills need to be increased to 7.5% per level to compensate to the loss involved with the multiplication process.
Ex: Scan time before 10s * .5 (from skills) = 5s New Scan time 10s * .25 (Astrometrics) *.25 (Astrometic Acquisition) = 5.625
Proposed Scan time 10s * .25 (Astrometrics) * .625 (Astrometric Acquisition) = 4.6875

Exactly. The ability to do any advanced probing techniques are gone. Push buttan, get sigs.

Probers used skill to find them before, now any scrub can do it. Why not just have 1 module you fit on your combat ship, press buttan, kill target. Same thing.

Clap.....clap.....clap.....clap


Seriously. All this work, and you still can't fix the 5 sec scan time it take to get a position on ships coming in at range.

How long has it been? 2-3 years now? And still you have your heads up your ...... when it comes to long range gameplay.


What's funny is that every Caldari BS you are working on has a bonus to fight at range. Scorpion, long range ecm, Raven, 200km+ cruisemissiles, Rokh, 200km Rail guns.

Apoc
Amarr Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+7.5% to Large Energy Turret optimal range
+7.5% Large Energy Turret tracking speed (replaced large energy turret cap use)

And now, with all the work you are putting into probing, you just ignore the possibility to actually make those bonuses count.

Let's take the Raven for example, the slowest locking race in the game, with the weapon system that takes the longest time to reach target....

And it takes 5 sec to scan him down....


As I stated somewhere else, I was hoping for the best, but expecting the worst....

Unfortunately I was right.

"Not easier, but more accessible. We are not trying to reduce the art of scanning down to a simple click, we are aiming to make scanning more accessible to those who want to use it, but still requires you to master the art."

The pre-set formations are good. The ability to launch multiple probes at once is good, though that should be a toggle. These are both examples of tedium. The negative aspect of this is that unless we fit into a specific pattern that you pre-determine, we are left out in the cold. That 8th probe was a reward for training Astrometrics to 5 and offered advantages to those who went through that effort beyond the mundane additional 5% improvement.

Astrometrics 5 should still reward the 8th probe. There should be a toggle for launching 7 or 8 probes, defaulted to 7 probes, which remembers your last choice.


While I will begrudgingly accept that automatically finding a new sig is good, it should be a toggle mode in the scanner, and require probes to be deployed: when you no longer wish to "pinpoint" sigs, you can switch to a Monitor mode that will scan the system for as long as you leave your probes out. Repeatedly pushing the scan button is an example of tedium, but just giving away the information for free is a step too far in the "accessibility" direction. You should have to set up for it and have a ship capable of using the information.

This change also pushes the game in the direction of more safety. When your own economist has been saying that more things need to explode, and the market is saying the same thing, this kind of feature is moving in the wrong direction. At least requiring a ship with probe launcher to automate the scans will differentiate between those who prepare and those who don't.


"The scan results are now displayed through a progress bar, instead of a table."

Major source of contention. This combines with the removal of Deep Space Probes, though from the way you guys approached the subject, you don't like how players have learned to use "real life" skills to determine what is what.

The ability to use real world people skills to differentiate yourself from someone else in this game used to be a major defining feature of EVE, and is something I would tell others when proselytizing EVE to them. "In most games, it doesn't matter how good of a player you are, everything is dependent on in-game skills. But EVE is different. In EVE, you can have the same in-game skills but still be leaps and bounds ahead of others if you have good personal skills and abilities." I fear that in the name of accessibility to new players you are beginning to destroy this defining characteristic of EVE.


"Probes now instantly recall on system jump or station dock"

This is both good and bad, and it would be nice to have a toggle for this: "Autorecall Probes [YES/no]". There are operational and strategic reasons one might want to leave probes out in system.


"You must lauch 7 probes, and have 7 probes in the launch to be able to launch probes. But you can recall select probes if you wish."

If we must launch 7 probes, and must have 7 probes in the launcher, why require probe ammo at all? Fold the probes into the launcher itself, and script it for Core vs Combat scans. If you're simplifying, go ahead and take away the complexity of Faction probes in non-Faction launchers.


"Reduced the per level modifier for Astrometrics Rangefinding, Astrometrics Acquisition and Astrometrics pinpointing by half."

I'm not an advocate for reimbursing skills that are still useful, but please understand that the change to Astrometrics Rangefinding is a major kick in the nuts for anyone who trained level 5.


"Celestial brackets will also no longer get in the way of trying to use the positioning arrows or the probe spheres."
"Double clicking a probe in the list will center the camera over the probe."

Awesome news. I don't know if this is a change from current, as I've never tried to center based on anything in the scan window, but the change to double-clicking to center on a target in space was frustrating for a while. The ability to do this from the scan window is awesome.

Along these lines, if you continue with the "everyone gets seven probes" concept, could you auto-rename the center probe to "Center"? Then if we want to center the window on the center probe, we know which one to click without annoyance. It's not hiding anything or preventing us from doing anything by not doing this, it's just tedious and annoying to identify each time.

Alternatively, allow us to rename a probe with a name that is saved as part of the custom formation. We can then anchor and center on that probe position each time. This will cover the case of using 8 probes as well.


"POS anchoring positioning arrows are now fixed size while zooming in/out with the camera"

Currently when anchoring POS modules, you absolutely must right-click on the positioning arrows to get the right-click menu; if you click the positioning box instead by accident, you get the regular in-space right-click manu. Could you guys look at making it possible to right-click the entire box to get the menu (yes, you could still use the Manage window)?

And can you make it possible to center the camera on the positioning box? This particular change might even make the quoted change redundant.

People saying DPS aren't needed anymore never used them to their potential.

From the viewpoint of a hunter.

Open wormhole into new system.
Hit Dscan, don't see anything. Your not safe. Drop single DSP, cloak back up immediately. Move DSP up over the sun out of Dscan range. Make max range, hit scan. If they don't have a DSP out, they don't know your there. You see ships now. Warp around using Dscan to get the general area they are in and making sure not at a POS. You can get them tracked down within 1-2 au. Warp off Dscan range. drop combat probes, and arrange in a suitable pattern. Position over the ships general area. Hit scan once, get a hit pull probes back. Hope they didn't see probes on dscan. Warp to ship at zero uncloaking in warp to prevent targeting delay. Land blow up ships, loot warp off.

From the viewpoint of the prey.

Keep one single DSP out in the system, over the sun again out of dscan range, scanning constantly along with dscan. See a wormhole open into you, get everyone to safety, or set up a trap. They don't know you seen them come in especially if they came in off dscan range.

Another thought though on why does the probe launcher still hold 8 probes. Perhaps make probe charges. Like say a charge holds 7 probes, or a charge holds 4 probes, or a charge allows just 1 probe. You can then launch a charge.