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AFK Cloaking in System is a Terrible Mechanic
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Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#101 - 2012-05-20 20:27:14 UTC
malcovas Henderson wrote:
What I see here in this thread, is plain and simple nullbears QQ. What you are say does not change this. Infact it would indeed worsen the situation.

Being in a cloaky does not give you all the intel in the system. Guess what. To find that out you have to move. Risk getting de-cloaked, bla bla bla. Infact by not being in the local, will make gathering intel a whole lot easier. They dont see you, they dont dock up. Thus hiding the ships they were using.

Then you would have the next wave crying QQ, We can't tell if theres a cloaky in our system, let us see the AFK cloakies so we know they're there and when they're not. So we can absolutey know, when we are safe to mine / bot

Local is not the broken mechanic here. What is broken is people's perception of a perceived threat.


o7


If being decloaked is even a remote possibility for you I recommend you just stop playing the game

o7

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#102 - 2012-05-20 20:28:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
malcovas Henderson wrote:
Local is not the broken mechanic here. What is broken is people's perception of a perceived threat.
Well duh. But what's causing that perception is local, and if they to solve that “problem”, local is where the “fix” needs to happen.

…of course, the real reason for their complaining is that they want to be able to get more information — not that the information they already have is too much and too cheap to get. The funny part is presenting a solution to the problem they claim they have and see how horrified they are at the mere thought of it, thus demonstrating quite clearly that the problem isn't at all what they say it is.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#103 - 2012-05-20 20:34:21 UTC
I don't have a problem with AFK cloaking, the problem is when people suggest removing local as a solution because that's just stupid beyond belief

there's already a part of the game without local and it has 2000 systems

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#104 - 2012-05-20 20:37:03 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
I don't have a problem with AFK cloaking, the problem is when people suggest removing local as a solution because that's just stupid beyond belief
…except it solves the problem completely since it removes AFK cloaking, both in terms of removing the practical application of it on the “attacker's” part and in terms of removing the frustration on the defenders' side.
malcovas Henderson
THoF
#105 - 2012-05-20 20:38:31 UTC  |  Edited by: malcovas Henderson
Richard Desturned wrote:
malcovas Henderson wrote:
What I see here in this thread, is plain and simple nullbears QQ. What you are say does not change this. Infact it would indeed worsen the situation.

Being in a cloaky does not give you all the intel in the system. Guess what. To find that out you have to move. Risk getting de-cloaked, bla bla bla. Infact by not being in the local, will make gathering intel a whole lot easier. They dont see you, they dont dock up. Thus hiding the ships they were using.

Then you would have the next wave crying QQ, We can't tell if theres a cloaky in our system, let us see the AFK cloakies so we know they're there and when they're not. So we can absolutey know, when we are safe to mine / bot

Local is not the broken mechanic here. What is broken is people's perception of a perceived threat.


o7


If being decloaked is even a remote possibility for you I recommend you just stop playing the game

o7


With my upmost apologies, it would appear as if you have mis-understood my post Big smile


o7
Cosmic Fart
Doomheim
#106 - 2012-05-20 21:00:33 UTC
Null-sec carebear tears are so cute.

AFK cloaking works as intended.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#107 - 2012-05-20 21:29:46 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
I don't have a problem with AFK cloaking, the problem is when people suggest removing local as a solution because that's just stupid beyond belief
…except it solves the problem completely since it removes AFK cloaking, both in terms of removing the practical application of it on the “attacker's” part and in terms of removing the frustration on the defenders' side.


for a problem to be solved it has to exist to begin with

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Heinrich Rotwang
Spectre Fleet Corporation
#108 - 2012-05-20 21:48:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Heinrich Rotwang
Wild Rho wrote:
[
The AFK cloaker can sit in a system all day but only needs to be actively used by the player when they (and possibly their friends) are ready to take action. If they're bored or there are no targets they can leave the character sitting there and go do something more interesting until an opportunity presents itself.


Welcome to the world of covert ops. The only thing thats wrong is local somehow magically exposing the presence of the cov ops ship.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#109 - 2012-05-20 22:01:43 UTC
Heinrich Rotwang wrote:
Welcome to the world of covert ops. The only thing thats wrong is local somehow magically exposing the precence of the cov ops ship.

Love to covertly operate.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Jessie-A Tassik
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#110 - 2012-05-20 22:13:23 UTC
Sentient Blade wrote:
I think a guy earlier hit the nail on the head; cloaky campers mean that you either have to safe up, and stay safe, or you have to drag a support fleet with you to do so much as run an anomaly.

At which point the ISK per person might as well drop to nothing, not to mention a lot of boredom being injected into the game, at no cost at all to the "aggressor", whom may very well be completely AFK.

You have to act as though he or she isn't, though, and THAT is the problem... it's a broken mechanic in risk / reward for the attacker. They have absolutely no risk, and for 23.5 hours per day they get rewarded by harming their opponents economy.

Edit: To be clear, I have absolutely no problem with stealthy-on-stealthy warfare. I had some awesome times in Geminate with 2 enemy bomber / recon wings going at each other.


Or you could stop being a baby, have ONE of the baby carebears log on a combat alt, and then have it sit AFK waiting for cloak boy to show up.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#111 - 2012-05-20 22:35:07 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
for a problem to be solved it has to exist to begin with
Exactly…

…which is why AFK cloaking is so easily proven not to be an actual problem: because those who want to claim it is also don't want to see their problem solved.

That said, the actual problem with local is a separate issue and it's slated to be solved… somehow… at some point. Soon™.
Hanuman Li Tosh
Nullbear Protection Act of 2019
#112 - 2012-05-21 00:35:54 UTC
Eso Es wrote:
Don't get me wrong, I like cloaking, I like ganking in WHs, I like breaking gate camps, but to be able to sit afk in someones system cloaked FOR DAYS with no repercussions is just unacceptable. Make cloakers susceptible to combat probes, or really, just do SOMETHING to limit the un-interactiveness of cloak, its a fail mechanic as is. Let the flames begin ^^


The repercussions of cloaking are listed in the description of the cloaking mod you choose.

Just because you choose not to recognize something does not mean it does not exist.

I find intel gathering to be one of the things that kept me from un-subbing.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#113 - 2012-05-21 00:49:26 UTC
AFK cloaking is an important PvP tactic, affecting whole solar systems at a time. Leave it alone, please, I want to afk cloak some more.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
seany1212
M Y S T
#114 - 2012-05-21 00:54:51 UTC
I love how the null-bears are crying about if local was removed, so what? you have gate entrances, stick some scouts on them, the only problem you have then is the rare occasion wormhole spawn Roll

Try wormholes you bleating morons, no local and any number of wormholes opening into yours at any time of the day. Some people just want to see eve easymode...
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#115 - 2012-05-21 01:08:08 UTC
seany1212 wrote:
any number of wormholes opening into yours at any time of the day

aww yeah ~~ keep telling me about it ~~<3

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#116 - 2012-05-21 01:41:11 UTC
seany1212 wrote:
Some people just want to see eve easymode...


yes, namely those who want local removed

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#117 - 2012-05-21 02:03:03 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
seany1212 wrote:
Some people just want to see eve easymode...

yes, namely those who want local removed

Tell me more about the gankers who want easy ganks...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Leetha Layne
#118 - 2012-05-21 02:11:53 UTC
I think people do it because "it puts a nit in people's craw" (Look it up)
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#119 - 2012-05-21 03:52:40 UTC
Eso Es wrote:
Don't get me wrong, I like cloaking, I like ganking in WHs, I like breaking gate camps, but to be able to sit afk in someones system cloaked FOR DAYS with no repercussions is just unacceptable. Make cloakers susceptible to combat probes, or really, just do SOMETHING to limit the un-interactiveness of cloak, its a fail mechanic as is. Let the flames begin ^^



how do you know they were afk.. and if they were afk why were you worried?

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
Eso Es
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#120 - 2012-05-21 04:31:02 UTC
Savage Angel wrote:
I love these threads. Goes to show the hypocrisy of the players that whine about Empire needing more risk for the rewards and how players should be "forced" into nulsec. If you quiver in a POS when a single ship is sitting in the same system doing nothing, don't talk to me about risks.


That single ship isn't what scares me, its the power hes able to project that does. He can at any time, find me in an anomoly, drop a cyno, and before i can even blink have 20 reds sitting right on top of me. Again, my main issue here is the non-interactivity of cloaking as it stands. I'd rather not have this thread turn into a discussion of having local or not, rather, whether or not cloaked ships should be able to be combat probed.