Wormholes

anomalies take 1 click on your on-board scanner to find them all. and we do scan a lot, but when its a ladar it gets ignored outside home system.

as for your home system, yea, im pretty sure we do clear the ladars. but with 100 people living in the wormholes owned by the big wh alliances thats hardly going to make any real income.

plus...its boring!

if you watched the EVE econ vid, they said re balancing will happen throughout 2012, I have a feeling the drone blue loot in WH space will get nerfed in later patches, along with higher fees and taxes on the market for isk sinks.

Some of the people spouting nonsense in this thread should try living in a WH for awhile before posting.

Wormholes are high risk/high reward*, nerf the income from it and a lot of people wouldn't bother any more and a great part of Eve would be lost.


* To be making a significant chunk of ISK from high class WH your typically looking at around 8bn in capital ships and another 3-6bn in sub-cap support fleet - with the constant threat of someone opening a WH link to you and dropping you with a PVP fleet and the NPCs themselves are quite capable of taking out a carrier or dread if you mess up in regular site running. Then you have to get that loot salvaged and hauled back to empire both of which are far from risk free.

Remove CONCORD and GCC inside incursion sites, and i will be happy to agree with the 10% nerf to WH =)

But if that happened, i guess we would just have another stupid, non-knowing post from you..

i can see the topic in my head:

"BUFF WH!! WE CANT DO INCURSIONS ANYMORE, WE RISK GETTING PVP SHIPS IN HERE!!!! OOOMMMGGGG CCP!!!"

Mission reward and bounties are an isk faucet too, should they be nerfed as well? What about 0.0 rats, should they only drop manufacturing-related materials instead of give out bounties? EVE is full of isk faucets because it needs to be, with ships getting blown up everywhere there is isk constantly disappearing from the game. It's true that inflation has hurt the game lately, and many player's wallets because it's getting harder and harder to afford to PLEX accounts with isk, but W-space isn't the cause of any of it.

As far as incursions go, they need to be nerfed and quite honestly vangaurd sites need to be nerfed more than 10%. After switching from mission running to incursions I remember thinking to myself, "If I was only making half this isk incursions would still be worth it". That's because quite honestly the rewards would still be rather high and the risk was almost non-existent. I also think there could be a correlation between the number of incursion pilots and amount of isk in the economy that goes beyond the fact that incursion pilots just make tons of isk. This is because incursion money stays in the economy, incursion ships rarely get blown up and even when those faction ships pop the mineral loss isn't much different than any tech-1 battleship.

Now for W-space. I feel like I'm beating a dead horse but the original poster either hasn't figured out everybody's point or is just ignoring the fact that there needs to be a correlation between risk and reward. Incursions are such a controversial topic because they offer a high reward for such little risk, making them an ideal investment. Wouldn't you like to invest your bank account in a stock you knew was going to make you tons of money at very little chance of a loss?. The argument posted against W-space is that it offers the same high reward as incursions? Well that's because the risk is much greater. In my opinion W-space isn't even lucrative enough for the amount of risk and the cost involved.

I live in a C4 and have a friend who's main character is in a large 0.0 alliance and he is always bragging about the isk that is constantly flowing into his wallet from running complex's and mining grav sites with Rorq support, both of which he can do all day long because they respawn. This isn't something that's possible in W-space. After clearing all the anomalies in system it took a few weeks for our home system to spawn another 4-5 sites, sitting at just 1 site for an entire week. If you're not familiar with W-space anomalies, a C4 site averages about 120mil in both blue loot and salvage (depending on your luck with salvage of course). Splitting that 3-ways between the minimum 3 pilots we use to run the site if nobody is dual-boxing that's 40mil a site. Relying solely on combat sites in our home system we would have only been able to make 200mil a person, for only 3 people, over the course of several weeks. We've also gone an entire 30-days without a grav site and lately we will only receive 2-3 other sites, either ladar, radar, or mag each week at most. Living out here solo someone might be able to pay to fuel their POS and make a little profit off just the resources given to them by our home system, provided they don't have to buy a PLEX for any of the alts they would need because you cannot solo C4 anomalies, but for a corporation this means that most of your income will be from raiding other wormhole systems which drastically increases your risk, cost - as you'll lose more ships, and time investment - as you'll have to spend more time scanning, more time shooting other players, and less time making isk.

My friend also lives fairly deep in 0.0 and has never been surprised by a red or even a neutral because of not only local but also because of intel channels, where enemies can be reported many systems away (because, again, they can be seen in local). This means, to the average member, there is less risk living in 0.0 than there is living in WH space. There are some offsetting factors I will concede, such as it being easier to fleet and take down POS's or even evict an alliance from space in 0.0 than it is in WH space, but to the average member who is mostly interested in himself and less invested in the welfare of his corporation (and yes, that is the viewpoint of the "average" EVE pilot) that's not a huge issue. This is all also ignoring the amenities that exist in K-space that don't exist in W-space such as refineries that aren't capped at 75%, personal hanger space, the ability to store a ship without everyone else in your corporation having access to it, the ability to repair your ship in station without having to refit an armor or hull repairer, jump clones, and even having a medical clone in your home system.

So a list of the different types of space, ranked from lowest to highest by amount of risk, would go high-sec, low-sec, null-sec, then W-space bringing up the rear. It follows that this is also the order in which these types of space should be profitable. However that is not the case and, as a W-space resident, I don't think it should be (I'm not saying that I should make more in W-space than someone does in 0.0). Yes, of course W-space should be much more lucrative than anything in high-sec or low-sec. Given the choice to vote between W-space being more or less profitable I would have to vote more, not as a biased W-space resident but as someone who has experience living out there and can tell you that it's rough. However according to CCP W-space was never meant for permanent habitation and the mechanics in W-space will not function correctly or yield any real reward if W-space becomes overcrowded. W-space needs to remain a lucrative but risky vast unending wasteland, sparsely populated by only the bold.

I agree with every point you made bar these two, ship destruction doesn't result in an ISK loss, it merely encourages ISK to change hands. Namely, it causes the ISK to be redistributed to miners and industrialists who constructed the ships that replace the ones that were destroyed.

Similarly, the mineral difference between pirate faction BS and T1 BS is irrelevant, that extra money goes to explorers, or mission runners who bought the BPC with LP.

Ship destruction is a necessary and vital aspect of Eve's economy, as it raises the velocity at which money changes hands, but it is not technically an ISK sink. Although an increased rate of trading does result in more money being taken out of the economy via production costs and transaction taxes.

Anyway, to everything else you said, very well put And I especially agree with the point concerning sov null sec, from what I've heard CCP have plans to replace local intel with a true intel tool and that change cannot come about soon enough.

Cry moar nub.


0.000000000000000/10

So we should just nerf ALL Isk faucets to the ground purely because they inject ISK into the economy? What are you smoking bro?

*Hi Sec Incursions are RISK FREE ISK, ever flown around a WH? Everyone and their Mom tryin to kill you and they have the freedom to do it, i.e. new entrances into WHs and NO LOCAL.

Actually the way I read it is that there is Worm Hole segregation & all the WHs Scots got booted so they are FREE of them

I daresay if he is outright reducing all income sources by 10%, he will be including NPC buy orders too.

Whether or not incursions get hit by a second nerf, to compensate for the changes to other professions, is a much more interesting question.