Ships & Modules

... what's the phrase again... ? "Work smarter, not harder." Grinding missions is a horrible way to earn ISK when you have a decent amount of skills and game knowledge under your belt.



Soooo... basically you want a T1 ship... with all the bonuses of a T2 ship... at T1 ship price.

Please explain to me how this will not relegate T1 ships as nothing more than "stepping stones" for these ships. Hell... how will this not obsolete Faction Navy ships?


I'm sorry... but your idea runs so counter to some of the dearest principles in EVE that you have a snowball's chance in hell of this ever becoming reality.

Not Supported.

edit:


You have one guy on the first page who potentially supports the idea. Everyone else has pointed out why this is bad and that the system is more or less fine "as is."

edit2:


So long as the person with 10 mil in Gunnery has all the skills relevant to firing a 'Geddon's lasers at level 5, you can have 1 billion SP in gunnery and still won't be any better.

My replies in bold inserted.

Your contempt is more than us mortals can ever hope for oh mighty, if impbalanced, OfBalance.

I wouldn't inflict that on people's mouse wheels for the sake of that.

The fact is even now you're not properly responding to my points, instead you try to paint me as being plain wrong or an idiot even though every other person here is echoing the same things I am - except for one person who just welcomed the idea of new hulls period.

I felt this last post of yours needed no answer tbh. If you insist: you said isk the way to get advantage I said its only a part of it. You are trying now to squirm out of your previous positions. Ok. So now that you have accepted that the flux of isk is only part of the story tell me why racial trainingn is permitted to be another part of the story and interacial training is not permitted. Or do not tell me if you dont feel like it, it i fine. Just dont get upset on me please.

I recognise and have said so many times in this thread that people in EvE are for many reasons phibic about change to what they hold as EvE ship balance truisms.

What all the raucus in this thread amounts to is:
" I have been told specialization is the way to go. I have done that. I am on my way to my Titan the last thing I want now is to have to learn new skills to get the best out of cruiser / frig and BS hulls."

That's what many people probably mean but don't say.

Be that as it may, true or false, the idea is there and I will not begrudge nays. Its your priviledge. Bullcrap rationalizations however I ll take issue with so do not post them if you do not like the response.

I can't really comment on that entire post, because it was based on the consideration that my post was about how "ISK was the only way to get the advantage". It never was. I said ISK was a central - but not the only - balancing factor concerning ship hulls. By making essentially better hulls compete with their lower tech counterparts for pricing, you're creating a huge power creep based on age / aggregate SP. It's a gap that new pilots won't be able to fill in short order, because they'd have to up their current training plan several-fold compared to what a new pilot needs now to be able to catch up to an old pilot in a specific role.

But, several people have said this besides myself, which you'd appreciate if you took the time to process what they're telling you. It isn't just me.

…except that it has been like that for ages and the reward has been good enough ever since.

Awarding people with bonuses for not specialising is a very bad idea and as Pheusia points out, the rewards are already skewed in favour of versatility — improving those rewards at this point is the exact opposite of the right way to go. In fact, if anything “pure” characters should be rewarded for their perseverance, since they accept the burden of taking the good with the bad rather than the good with the good.

The all-BS char, because it's actually useful and fun and because it entails such a wide swath of skills that it is universally applicable for every kind of job in the book, unlike the Nyx-only pilot. You're quite right — the scales are not even, and this is a problem, but they're not even for the exact opposite of what you're saying: they far too heavily favours cross-training.

So no, cross-training do not in any way need buffed rewards — specialisation does.

Here's the problem:

You seem to think I don't understand your suggestion. This is shown by your need to reiterate it constantly and say I don't understand constantly even when people are very, very clearly responding to your suggestion and showing they understand.

I have, this entire thread. Everyone has, this entire thread. Nobody likes it.


Here's the other problem:

"It does however fix current imbalance."

You're adamant that this perceived imbalance is real, but it isn't. This is what everyone is telling you. There is no imbalance to fix. If anything, cross-training is on the strong side.


Here's the third problem:

Nobody likes a "Discussion" thread where the OP blows everyone off who is trying to show them the other side of the coin.

Yeah, no, that's not really what I said, so I don't know what you're disagreeing with here.

There is no other form of cross-training.
Why do you disagree?

This is the reason my PvP pilot has yet to stick a single battleship skill into her brain. Three years and nothing but frigates and cruisers. I'm running out of frigate / cruiser level stuff to train though. Ohnoes. : < I don't regret training this way - the amount of stuff I can fly is mind boggling and I have a ship for every occasion.

Even though it would benefit me, I don't see a need for a "its like every ship but better" thing floating around. Also, where would it fit in lore-wise? Would the Jovians be making these ships?

I'm not sure that they would even be flown much anyway. Specialization beats generalization, and I would rather have CCP work on ships that fill a specific role and would actually be useful. The All Four Uber Race ship just doesn't sound like it would add much to the game other than a gimmick.