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Incoming titan adjustments

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Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#821 - 2012-03-13 21:58:24 UTC
Variable1 wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Ikoma Sunblazer wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:
The scan res number is balanced around multiple Cormack's sensor boosters, on the assumption that money is not a limiting factor for titan pilots, and therefore that people will shell out for officer SBs if that lets them continue do this kind of thing.



All things aside, this is a pretty hilarious assumption that doesn't make sense in context. With a base sensor strength of 5, you are talking about a few seconds difference between t2 and cormack out of a probable minute+ lock time.

Well worth the 4b+ sensor booster imo Lol


Gains you 25s against frigates (105 to 79, assuming 3 are fitted), 15s against cruisers (64 to 49) and 10s against battleships (44 to 33).

If you see this as a big difference, then it's worth balancing around the officer fit given that dropping 12bn on SBs is not a huge fraction of the outlay for a properly-fit titan. If you don't see this as a big difference, then balancing around the officer fit isn't a big deal because it's not having a major impact. Either way, it's a functional assumption Smile



1. lol'ing at 'assumptions' instead of actual in game data being used to make HUGE changes in game.

2. lol'ing at all Titan pilots being 'rich'. Titan pilots are probably botters. Titan pilots are RMT'ers. Titan pilots all fit Officer everything. Titan pilots standard fit can pop bs/cruisers/frigs. Do you even have the slightest clue?

3. lol'ing at the 2 types of people in this thread agreeing - goons and friends of goons (ie no clue)

4. lol'ing at the lack of work done on countering 700+ maels...

5. lol'ing at the welcome to BLOB land.

6. lol'ing that my tears are not as much for the nerf, but for the shear stupidity of the arguments used to create this nerf and the disbelief that CCP cannot see you for what you have become.

Sad days ahead perhaps, but most will try to keep up the honest fight against goonswarmonline, and continue to have their counters nerfed until quitting time. I will donate my stuff to anyone who can change the goon ethos of 'destroy eve whatever the cost'.


Onwards on upwards. :-) Tinfoil off.


it's well-known that -A- and Goonswarm are long-time friends

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#822 - 2012-03-13 21:58:46 UTC
Not going to bother reading nearly 40 pages of Goons giving knob gratification to get their way (obviously how they wanted it to turn out Lol), but can I ask this

Can we please get a PVP flag? Roll

Solves the whole issue of losers (like the guys getting stomped by titans cause they obviously failed to bring them to counter thin tank glass cannon Titans) no longer feeling like losers. Wander into a gate camp, its ok. AFK to jita in a Kestrel full of PLEX, its ok. AFK in a Hulk fit for cargo letting a damn destroyer take it out, its ok. No fear of getting your Officer fit CNR ganked cause its worth 5 billion in a 1/5 the cost hull, its ok. Cause you can no longer lose it, by completely avoiding the actions you used to take that made you a loser and a ******* idiot in the first place that you deserve to lose it.

/sarcasmn off

Can't dumb down the game anymore (Oh wait, we can. Lets request that PVP flag everyone!), just have to scream and whine loud enough to get your way. No one can find an obvious solution (like bringing their own massive Titan fleets instead of battleships and T3 cruisers) to meta game better then the guys who found a way to meta game better then the whiners; Titan pilots continued to use a Titan after it lost AoE doomsday, after it lost the ability to hit sub cap ships with DD, after it lost its drones, after it lost 20% of its hitpoints, they still found a way....but you couldn't find a solution but to whine because you were unwilling, unable, or refused to fly / bring a cap ship of your own. Yes, now the Titan pilots are the losers because you couldn't nut the **** up and put out (you could only take it like an internet porn queen and moaned loud enough, CCP had to metaphorically install sound proofing so they don't have to hear your loud screams Shocked)

To the CCP staff, really think how you are dumbing down the game because a portion of your player base can't handle getting their ass handed to them. Then think of the other portion and would you really make such a change, that it offends the other portion (like making Highsec and Carebears totally safe because one side wanted it, but the other doesn't and it totally offends them but you go ahead with it anyway because they scream about it)
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#823 - 2012-03-13 21:58:49 UTC
Machine Delta wrote:


Hey, we said bombers. Keep moving the goalposts bro.


Right, so say the average alliance can field 200 guys, how are those 200 guys supposed to keep the 1200 man fleet on the field long enough to let the bombers make a single run, and how much is left of that 200 man alliance after they engage the 1200 man fleet.


Scale that if you want to 400, or even 600 guys.


The counter only works if you can get them to stay in one place long enough for each bombing run, and if you were to say, whittle numbers while they formed, well, if you kill enough to matter, the 1200 man fleet won't see the field (thats morale winning, not a fleet comp beating 1200 guys) and if you don't then you're stuck in the same situation.


So tell me again how an average alliance that could normally field a 200 man fleet is to counter 1200 dudes with bombers.


Tell me how a small coalition that could scrape up 600 dudes is going to compete with 1200 guys.


The scaling mechanic is so out of whack that its simply not possible. Over 150 maels and carriers start getting vollied, once you reach the full alpha fleet, backed by 400 drakes, 100 collected scimmies, a small bomber group, and however many rifters you are left with a thing that is literally only currently countered by one thing in game: Titans.

The answer to what beats 1200 dudes is your own 1200 dudes, as there isn't much else thats going to matter.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#824 - 2012-03-13 21:59:25 UTC
Aqriue wrote:
Not going to bother reading nearly 40 pages of Goons giving knob gratification to get their way (obviously how they wanted it to turn out Lol), but can I ask this

Can we please get a PVP flag? Roll

Solves the whole issue of losers (like the guys getting stomped by titans cause they obviously failed to bring them to counter thin tank glass cannon Titans) no longer feeling like losers. Wander into a gate camp, its ok. AFK to jita in a Kestrel full of PLEX, its ok. AFK in a Hulk fit for cargo letting a damn destroyer take it out, its ok. No fear of getting your Officer fit CNR ganked cause its worth 5 billion in a 1/5 the cost hull, its ok. Cause you can no longer lose it, by completely avoiding the actions you used to take that made you a loser and a ******* idiot in the first place that you deserve to lose it.

/sarcasmn off

Can't dumb down the game anymore (Oh wait, we can. Lets request that PVP flag everyone!), just have to scream and whine loud enough to get your way. No one can find an obvious solution (like bringing their own massive Titan fleets instead of battleships and T3 cruisers) to meta game better then the guys who found a way to meta game better then the whiners; Titan pilots continued to use a Titan after it lost AoE doomsday, after it lost the ability to hit sub cap ships with DD, after it lost its drones, after it lost 20% of its hitpoints, they still found a way....but you couldn't find a solution but to whine because you were unwilling, unable, or refused to fly / bring a cap ship of your own. Yes, now the Titan pilots are the losers because you couldn't nut the **** up and put out (you could only take it like an internet **** queen and moaned loud enough, CCP had to metaphorically install sound proofing so they don't have to hear your loud screams Shocked)

To the CCP staff, really think how you are dumbing down the game because a portion of your player base can't handle getting their ass handed to them. Then think of the other portion and would you really make such a change, that it offends the other portion (like making Highsec and Carebears totally safe because one side wanted it, but the other doesn't and it totally offends them but you go ahead with it anyway because they scream about it)


you are stupid

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#825 - 2012-03-13 22:01:00 UTC
titans should be exempt from any changes and balancing because they are expensive ~end-game ships~

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Le Cardinal
ECP Rogues
#826 - 2012-03-13 22:01:05 UTC
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Hi everyone,

Goons are not happy with the effectiveness of large groups of titans against subcapital ships, so we have to make some adjustments.



Nice to see those ccp connections are working out for you. Well played goons. Putting Soundwave in charge of this is pretty hilarious considering his past history.
Tithi
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#827 - 2012-03-13 22:01:06 UTC
Andski wrote:
Tithi wrote:
Well now you've just traded "who has the most X" for "who has the most Y".

You saying "Well they should bring a matching subcap fleet" is no different from them saying "Well they should bring a matching supercap fleet."

I agree with this nerf, but I think some tweaking to carriers and dreads might be necessary to make them more useful against subcaps in fleet battles. Just a thought.


perhaps you should try PvP other than nopod matches in hisec before you comment in discussions about 0.0 warfare between alliances that matter


Perhaps you should not act like a douche for no reason. I agree with everything else you've said in this thread, tho.
Argus Sorn
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#828 - 2012-03-13 22:01:32 UTC
+1
Charles Case
State War Academy
Caldari State
#829 - 2012-03-13 22:01:46 UTC
Swearte Widfarend wrote:


Math is hard.

An MWD Drake (or MWD Maelstrom) has the signature of a Carrier. Ergo, the MWD Maelstrom or MWD Drake can be hit by a turret Titan. The proposed Titan changes don't change that fact.


I meant the idiotic conclusion of your post: "Because I didn't think CCPs goals was fewer folks on the cluster."

What do you think affects the number of folks on the cluster more having titans nerfed or not?

I'm sure the number of people connected will just plummet from now until April!
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#830 - 2012-03-13 22:02:18 UTC
Le Cardinal wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Hi everyone,

Goons are not happy with the effectiveness of large groups of titans against subcapital ships, so we have to make some adjustments.



Nice to see those ccp connections are working out for you. Well played goons. Putting Soundwave in charge of this is pretty hilarious considering his past history.


ahahaha CCP connections get real

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Koby Botick
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#831 - 2012-03-13 22:02:42 UTC
Shadoo wrote:

(wrote a lot of words)


And there should nobody be able to say, that a goon cannot appreciate a very well written post of an "enemy", at least in the context of the epic Grath whine and opposition in here. Well said. +1.
BlueMajere
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#832 - 2012-03-13 22:05:05 UTC
In true middle school style

I DARE CCP to respond to Shadoo's post.

I TRIPLE DOG DARE YOU (you can't back down from that)

Yeah. Good luck getting away with not answering after this callout.
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#833 - 2012-03-13 22:05:25 UTC
Weaselior, demonstrating his latent homosexual tendencies for the world to see.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
Courthouse
Perkone
Caldari State
#834 - 2012-03-13 22:05:36 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Machine Delta wrote:


Hey, we said bombers. Keep moving the goalposts bro.


Right, so say the average alliance can field 200 guys, how are those 200 guys supposed to keep the 1200 man fleet on the field long enough to let the bombers make a single run, and how much is left of that 200 man alliance after they engage the 1200 man fleet.


Scale that if you want to 400, or even 600 guys.


The counter only works if you can get them to stay in one place long enough for each bombing run, and if you were to say, whittle numbers while they formed, well, if you kill enough to matter, the 1200 man fleet won't see the field (thats morale winning, not a fleet comp beating 1200 guys) and if you don't then you're stuck in the same situation.


So tell me again how an average alliance that could normally field a 200 man fleet is to counter 1200 dudes with bombers.


Tell me how a small coalition that could scrape up 600 dudes is going to compete with 1200 guys.


The scaling mechanic is so out of whack that its simply not possible. Over 150 maels and carriers start getting vollied, once you reach the full alpha fleet, backed by 400 drakes, 100 collected scimmies, a small bomber group, and however many rifters you are left with a thing that is literally only currently countered by one thing in game: Titans.

The answer to what beats 1200 dudes is your own 1200 dudes, as there isn't much else thats going to matter.


armor hacs Armor Hacs ARMOR HACS
Mirmedon
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#835 - 2012-03-13 22:05:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Mirmedon
Quote:
I will donate my stuff to anyone who can change the goon ethos of 'destroy eve whatever the cost'.


Onwards on upwards. :-) Tinfoil off.


I will change the goon ethos, donate your stuff to me tia.
Win Sui
State War Academy
Caldari State
#836 - 2012-03-13 22:06:22 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Sirhan Blixt wrote:


Also, did it occur to any of you soon-to-be-ex titan blobbers that maybe the reason you've been seeing these large subcap fleets is because titans are hilariously broken? No. It doesn't. .


Mabye because I've been watching Goons use the "More must be better" approach for 5 years now.


If you removed all supercaps from the game would the CFC suddenly dissipate into the ether?


No, no it wouldn't, you've banded together because you lack the means to stand alone, and that horde mentality was threatened by something, so you've reacted to it by crying until that stop was removed from the game.

Now you're free in April to rule the universe (unless our Smear Soundwave campaign works).


Maybe switch to a game where your elite skills are rewarded? I bet you could run a mean WoW raiding guild. Or SWTOR?

Dunno. Or make some friends and stop being such an elitist prick. That might work too.
Le Cardinal
ECP Rogues
#837 - 2012-03-13 22:07:17 UTC
Andski wrote:
Le Cardinal wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Hi everyone,

Goons are not happy with the effectiveness of large groups of titans against subcapital ships, so we have to make some adjustments.



Nice to see those ccp connections are working out for you. Well played goons. Putting Soundwave in charge of this is pretty hilarious considering his past history.


ahahaha CCP connections get real


Now that was a fast reply. Sadly, with this heavy handed nerf, things are quite real.
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
#838 - 2012-03-13 22:08:09 UTC
Le Cardinal wrote:
Andski wrote:
Le Cardinal wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Hi everyone,

Goons are not happy with the effectiveness of large groups of titans against subcapital ships, so we have to make some adjustments.



Nice to see those ccp connections are working out for you. Well played goons. Putting Soundwave in charge of this is pretty hilarious considering his past history.


ahahaha CCP connections get real


Now that was a fast reply. Sadly, with this heavy handed nerf, things are quite real.

eve is real meight

maybe if your csm rep wasn't so busy drinking he could have stopped this
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#839 - 2012-03-13 22:08:11 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Weaselior, demonstrating his latent homosexual tendencies for the world to see.

latent?

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
Kerensky White
K-EDEN
Winger Aerospace
#840 - 2012-03-13 22:08:27 UTC
Shadoo comes in and makes what I think may be a good post that I want to like but it is Shadoo. Sad