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New dev blog: Rebalancing EVE, one ship at a time

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Emiko Luan
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1601 - 2012-03-08 23:57:13 UTC
Valei Khurelem wrote:
I was about to prepare myself for a wall of text rant about the way CCP are ******* up the balance yet again, but this actually looks fairly promising. The only problem is you're doing it on tranquility, if you want to keep the current playerbase you should make a seperate server for those who actually like this current balance system ( god knows why ) but you may as well cater to them first.

I'm actually impressed CCP, well done, just don't go the star wars galaxies route and you'll be fine.


You can't split the server. Tiericide is good, they just need to leave it on Sisi UNTIL IT'S READY, having it take slightly longer to get into battleships isn't really a bad thing.

What I'm more interested in is the new support skills, I can't wait for more skills, I have hardly anything left to train that's quick :P

+welcome to my world+ http://emikochan13.wordpress.com http://emikochan13.deviantart.com
Decus Daga
Unfit for Duty
#1602 - 2012-03-09 00:09:07 UTC
posting to remove notifications :P
Sephiroth Clone VII
Brothers of Tyr
Goonswarm Federation
#1603 - 2012-03-09 00:14:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Sephiroth Clone VII
I generally support the ideas proposed by ccp of bombing the tier system.


I'm a but neutral on putting destroyers and BC's into the main tree leading on to other things. Cross training racially is kind of cool, and I don't like it going away. Destroyers are kind of a odd support ship, now they may be skipped less. Seems odd to have a skill though for just one racial hull.

Looking forward to inferno.

Personally I prefer the current size system, of small (frig), medium (cruiser), large (BS), extra large (capital).

But guess could get used to 5 normal classes of sub caps that are linerar progressions and not having two 'independent' branching off points that go nowhere. But I am vexed to think of how to categorize the two new ones that are part of the 'real' progression, small/medium, medium/large?

BC's and destroyers also have few tech 2 variants. Where as cruisers and frigs have around 3 each with widely varying roles, even multiple in same tech 2 spec that have different variants. So they have less of a flair for training them long to unlock stuff.

Over all, much rage will be had in changing requirements, but it really doesn't matter. If you already trained you have less training to do as a noob. If you a noob deal wiz it. If you got bs 5, just consider yourself extra trained for one racial bs for more power and ability to use tech 2, and be happy you can cross train to other capitals much simpler, BS 5 is a serious forever skill. Its the kind of skill you train if you going to be gone for a month or more. The only reason I got it was because of ghost training and patience, no one else should have to do it, unless they really want to. To wish more people to have to train BS 5 is a horrible thing to wish on someone else. Its like the plauge it should go away, just because you had to deal with it old days doesn't mean future generations have to deal with it as well.

The big cool thing is removing teirs, and balancing roles. I don't want nerd skill calculators obsessing and detracting from that about how training something takes 5 more days in one spot, and 30 less in another to get to a capital by the odd chance if they made a alt to train to start to finish, which is unlikely because super nerds are bitter vets with all the junk trained anyway. Just deal wiz it, who cares, the real game is using space ships, and balancing them would be great, not so much doing spreadsheets on skills.
Perihelion Olenard
#1604 - 2012-03-09 01:36:42 UTC
After coming back from a couple years break I can say that I'd definitely welcome these changes. Ships forgotten now become useful again and have their own place. It's too bad it's such a long way off, though. I seriously can't wait for this.
Bhaal Chinnian
#1605 - 2012-03-09 02:50:56 UTC
forum QQ best QQ

'A Good Plan executed today is better than a perfect plan executed next week'-- George Patton
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
Ghost Legion.
#1606 - 2012-03-09 02:55:52 UTC
I like the reduction in training time these changes bring for someone that is focused on one race. While they do make crosstraining more of a grind, it does teach players quickly that focusing on something is better than dipping into everything. The more players that lose the "Level 1 is enough" before jumping into a ship the better.

In regards to the retraining, a rather simple but possible unpopular option would be just to give every toon currently training on active accounts 3m skill points to cover the BC 5 dealie. Then slap in a button that returns all skill points to a pool and all injected books to the hanger. This way they can then readd however they want.

Not the prettiest way to fix it, but its simply. It will deal with people unhappy and having to retain to fly more then 1 Commandship, gives people the option of reducing BS 5 to 4 for Carrier alts, and im sure theres some super keen 3m SP player that will love having their SP doubled.

Don't ask about Italics, just tilt your head.
Castor Narcissus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1607 - 2012-03-09 03:11:46 UTC
I'm loving this thread. Old vet's tears, trying to explain CCP how many years they spent training Destroyers/Racial BS/BC's to level V and how they want it refunded multiplied by x4. Lol
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1608 - 2012-03-09 03:18:06 UTC
May I propose a new line of skills:

Racial Gunnery
Racial Sharpshooter
Racial Advanced Weapon Upgrades
Racial Surgical Strike
Racial Mechanics
Racial Shield Management
Racial Hull Upgrades

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1609 - 2012-03-09 03:19:35 UTC
Introducing new skills simplifies and streamlines things, apparently!

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1610 - 2012-03-09 03:20:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
"In order to simplify ship progression, we're going to split these two skills into rank 6 racial variants and make them prerequisites for further training. This will benefit new players" - CCP Ytterbium, 2012

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#1611 - 2012-03-09 04:43:54 UTC
looks good to me, aside from the whole getting rid of battlecruisers. man I love that skill, sure it would simplify stuff for new players, well at least until they wanted to try out another race. having destroyers and battlecruisers as is makes it a lot easier to try training another race

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1612 - 2012-03-09 04:53:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Tyberius Franklin
Andski wrote:
May I propose a new line of skills

Racial Gunner
Racial Sharpshoote
Racial Advanced Weapon Upgrade
Racial Surgical Strik
Racial Mechanic
Racial Shield Managemen
Racial Hull Upgrades

:Start obvious troll counter proposal:
No, lets leave the as is, but make super carriers and titans just use one general skill across all races to be consistent. They're kinda like dreads and carriers just abit bigger and obviously don't deserve their own racial skills
:End obvious troll counter proposal:

Edit: But in all seriousness, is making those 2 classes function like all the others that big an issue to you?
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#1613 - 2012-03-09 05:45:26 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Andski wrote:
May I propose a new line of skills

Racial Gunner
Racial Sharpshoote
Racial Advanced Weapon Upgrade
Racial Surgical Strik
Racial Mechanic
Racial Shield Managemen
Racial Hull Upgrades

:Start obvious troll counter proposal:
No, lets leave the as is, but make super carriers and titans just use one general skill across all races to be consistent. They're kinda like dreads and carriers just abit bigger and obviously don't deserve their own racial skills
:End obvious troll counter proposal:

Edit: But in all seriousness, is making those 2 classes function like all the others that big an issue to you?

Just out of curiosity, you know that the only skill difference between carrier and super carrier is fighterbombers, right?

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1614 - 2012-03-09 05:49:26 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Andski wrote:
May I propose a new line of skills

Racial Gunner
Racial Sharpshoote
Racial Advanced Weapon Upgrade
Racial Surgical Strik
Racial Mechanic
Racial Shield Managemen
Racial Hull Upgrades

:Start obvious troll counter proposal:
No, lets leave the as is, but make super carriers and titans just use one general skill across all races to be consistent. They're kinda like dreads and carriers just abit bigger and obviously don't deserve their own racial skills
:End obvious troll counter proposal:

Edit: But in all seriousness, is making those 2 classes function like all the others that big an issue to you?

Just out of curiosity, you know that the only skill difference between carrier and super carrier is fighterbombers, right?

Yes, though really my post was more about the hyperbole than the actual comparisons in the ways the skills work.
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#1615 - 2012-03-09 05:56:57 UTC
Castor Narcissus wrote:
I'm loving this thread. Old vet's tears, trying to explain CCP how many years they spent training Destroyers/Racial BS/BC's to level V and how they want it refunded multiplied by x4. Lol



Why not? Benefits come from trained skill levels and not your total SP count, so it's not like we're asking to gain free new abilities. We just want to keep the abilities we have today and the only way to do that is to get the new skills at an equivalent level. If we get the new skills at a level corresponding to our old skill levels, all we get is a potentially more expensive clone and we retain the abilitities we have had for years. Anything less than that and CCP is removing our abilities for no good reason.
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
#1616 - 2012-03-09 06:34:00 UTC
CCP Ytterbium wrote:
  • Q: can we opt out for skills we don't want during the reimbursement process?

    • A: well, again, it depends on how it is done. We may just bluntly give all four variants at V if you had battlecruiser V for example, or maybe require that you also add the relevant Cruiser skill trained at level 3 to be eligible. On the latter case, just don't train the cruiser 3 skill, and you should not receive the new racial battlecruiser at 5. Not sure why one would do that however, it's like skipping free candy or cake while visiting your grandma.

    Example:
  • If we go for option 1: you will get Amarr, Caldari, Gallente and Minmatar Battlecruiser skills at 5 if you previously had the generic Battlecruiser skill at 5.
  • If we go for option 2: you will get Amarr Battlecruiser skill at 5 only if you previously fulfilled all conditions to fly Amarr Battlecruisers, which means having the generic Battlecruiser skill at 5, PLUS the Amarr Cruiser at 3.

    • To remind it again, there are other options to consider, but no matter which one which choose, you won't lose anything out of the skill reimbursement plan.

    You do realize that suddenly adding 6 million SP to everyone who happens to have 4 racial cruisers at 3 is rather broken?

    It's going to cause huge amount of whine due to unfairness, and the first option of giving it to everyone will cause huge amount of whine from people who suddenly have to pay more for their clones.

    If you're going to do this then do it like a man, reimburst the BC skill and inject the racial BC skills for anyone who is eligible. Then they can choose which racial BC to put SP into, and train up the rest at their own leisure.

    It's not like I'm at a loss as to what to train anyway.

    Nyan
    Tippia
    Sunshine and Lollipops
    #1617 - 2012-03-09 06:39:17 UTC
    Rakshasa Taisab wrote:
    You do realize that suddenly adding 6 million SP to everyone who happens to have 4 racial cruisers at 3 is rather broken?
    Aside from them suddenly having much more expensive clones, what's broken about it?
    Scatim Helicon
    State War Academy
    Caldari State
    #1618 - 2012-03-09 07:11:44 UTC
    Assuming this goes through, will it be the first time that prerequisite skilles for existing hulls or items have been retrospectively added? I thought that to date the only skill requirement changes had been reducing levels of training needed for particular items.

    Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
    Rakshasa Taisab
    Sane Industries Inc.
    #1619 - 2012-03-09 07:21:11 UTC
    Tippia wrote:
    Rakshasa Taisab wrote:
    You do realize that suddenly adding 6 million SP to everyone who happens to have 4 racial cruisers at 3 is rather broken?
    Aside from them suddenly having much more expensive clones, what's broken about it?

    The... uhm... what you said.

    And also there's going to be a lot of players who don't receive the boost, and if CCP announces it with enough time to train up then people will be driven to skilling something just in order to get included.

    Nyan
    Vaerah Vahrokha
    Vahrokh Consulting
    #1620 - 2012-03-09 07:54:52 UTC
    Andski wrote:
    "In order to simplify ship progression, we're going to split these two skills into rank 6 racial variants and make them prerequisites for further training. This will benefit new players" - CCP Ytterbium, 2012


    Someone stole my point Cool

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