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[December] Excavator Mining Drone yield rebalance

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domino 8
League of Extraordinary Ratters
#41 - 2016-12-07 16:33:42 UTC
Wait - you can mine in the entosis ship?
Overman
Malum Industria
#42 - 2016-12-07 16:34:40 UTC
michael chasseur wrote:
Overman wrote:
lol nerfed before people have even had a chance to recoup their investment. So many people are getting dicked by this lol.

GJ.

And a new generation of bitter vets are born..


Legit if you injected the 30ish days of skills to fly this thing thinking it wouldn't get nerfed, lol just lol



Lol nah. But a lot of guys did, so that's a bummer for them. I just don't even see the point of releasing these drones with those stats to begin with. Rorq use exploding was anticipated weeks before. Pretty negligent to release without balancing first TBH.
Mr Cellophane
Thunderwaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#43 - 2016-12-07 16:38:03 UTC
:insert angry goon here: Like others have said, increase the speed of the drones, make my life easier if your going to nerf yield.
michael chasseur
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#44 - 2016-12-07 16:38:46 UTC
Well yeah this nerf is crap. They should have nerfed the panic button or just removed it entirely. Then you keep the buff to nullsec income, give plenty of targets for roaming gangs, and still have a ship that can reasonably defend itself from THE FRIGATE MENACE.
Sten Taxi
Bees Nutz
Unlimited Epiphany
#45 - 2016-12-07 16:39:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Sten Taxi
Lol, you thought the mining yield is what needed to be nerfed the most?

http://i.imgur.com/DhdAucS.png
Tokyo Drifter
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#46 - 2016-12-07 16:40:19 UTC
Overman wrote:
michael chasseur wrote:
Overman wrote:
lol nerfed before people have even had a chance to recoup their investment. So many people are getting dicked by this lol.

GJ.

And a new generation of bitter vets are born..


Legit if you injected the 30ish days of skills to fly this thing thinking it wouldn't get nerfed, lol just lol



Lol nah. But a lot of guys did, so that's a bummer for them. I just don't even see the point of releasing these drones with those stats to begin with. Rorq use exploding was anticipated weeks before. Pretty negligent to release without balancing first TBH.


The numbers were not a problem, goons multiboxing rorquals and using them extensively is the only reason of the nerf.
Meanwhile PL gets jumprange buff to dreadbomb anyone more easily and ewar while PANIC is okay according to Fozzie.

Really makes you think.
Jay Amazingness
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#47 - 2016-12-07 16:42:06 UTC
i blame doom for getting this nerfed, also the invulnerable hexa-scram rorqs are not broken its just a creative way to use the ship.

CEO of serious space alliance I too am gay, a member of the Memeperium
Momiji Sakora
Omni Galactic
Central Omni Galactic Group
#48 - 2016-12-07 16:42:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Momiji Sakora
Just a minute, going to find the salt. Given that to even get that 32% yield means committing to be on the field for 5 minutes locked in place? I expect a good amount of yield for that kind of 3+bn investment.

Carriers can align out and make a decent amount of ISK, VNI/Ishtars can orbit and warp pretty fast if trouble arrives. But nope, a miner has to sit for 5 minutes locked in place for they dared to do the most looked down upon activity in the game.
Frances Voltaire
Eldorado Exhumers
Fractions of PI
#49 - 2016-12-07 16:43:06 UTC
December 7th! A day that will live in infamy as the great Excavator Nerf is announced.

All good, I stay in flight mode while boosting and mining. I did the math on this and was thrilled at what we got.

If my Crew has 4 miners a booster and a hauler [Pre -Ascension] Now my Booster is my hauler and can mine too! If I had four miners before, my Hauler is now a miner [Thats a 25% increase] now my booster is my hauler and can mine with T2 mining drones [At least a 10% increase] never hurts to get 3 functions out of one ship.

So go ahead! Nerf the excavators! I was never planning to spend 1B+ a pop to create shiny joy kills.

The only tears I have for this are tears of joy! Looking forward to the accompanying killmail nerf that follows this update :)

BTW: I love the new Rorqual undeployed, nimble and out of reach!
Overman
Malum Industria
#50 - 2016-12-07 16:45:42 UTC
Tokyo Drifter wrote:
Overman wrote:
michael chasseur wrote:
Overman wrote:
lol nerfed before people have even had a chance to recoup their investment. So many people are getting dicked by this lol.

GJ.

And a new generation of bitter vets are born..


Legit if you injected the 30ish days of skills to fly this thing thinking it wouldn't get nerfed, lol just lol



Lol nah. But a lot of guys did, so that's a bummer for them. I just don't even see the point of releasing these drones with those stats to begin with. Rorq use exploding was anticipated weeks before. Pretty negligent to release without balancing first TBH.


The numbers were not a problem, goons multiboxing rorquals and using them extensively is the only reason of the nerf.
Meanwhile PL gets jumprange buff to dreadbomb anyone more easily and ewar while PANIC is okay according to Fozzie.

Really makes you think.



Which was completely foreseeable. Hence my point. After 13 years it's ignorant AF not anticipate players to scale every possible revenue stream via multi boxing.

That's really my issue. Not this particular nerf but the lack of foresight is pretty staggering.
Gobbins
Pandemic Horde Hld.
Pandemic Horde
#51 - 2016-12-07 16:45:46 UTC
Unbelievable

1. So why would anyone siege 9 bil worth of rorqual to make 200 mil an hour post-nerf, when a 2 bil carrier will make 150 mil/hr while staying fully aligned?

2. By making the excavator cheaper won't most dual boxing rorqs just add a third rorq? the total isk committed to the belt will stay the same, and rorquals are not very hard to multi box - so what do you do then nerf it harder? All this does is makr Rorquals the multi boxer's isk printer while single boxing plebes will stick to carriers.

3. Why not balance the risk reward through **Risk** rather than nerfing reward? For example by nerfing panic mode, or putting a delay between recall and drones entering the bay. Rorquals ops are incredibly easy to disrupt due to how fragile the excavators are. It makes for really interesting game play and counter play and you go and say "oh no we can't have that"

I mean your recent changes have all been a mind boggling series of removing risk from everying:

- Citadels making supers untouchable while moving
- ECs making bpos untouchable while building/researching
- I mean citadels in general and god knows we've been taking advantage of them
- And let's not forget good old hi sec incursions printing equivalent isk to nullsec ratting, but without risk

Finally you had put something interesting in the game and you nerf it? What are you guys even doing?

Man I am so triggered I am sitting here agreeing with goons that's how butt-annhilated I am.


> Leave the big Reward, increase RISK by looking at the panic module OR by making excavators more vulnerable. <

Cripes.
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#52 - 2016-12-07 16:46:53 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey everyone. We've been keeping a close eye on how people are using the newly rebalanced Rorquals and it's been really exciting watching how well people have taken to the new gameplay.

We have decided that we need to make a tweak in our December release next Tuesday to adjust the balance of mining Rorquals and keep the mining economy in a healthy place.

We are planning two connected changes in this release:
  • Reducing the mining yield of 'Excavator' Mining Drones by 32%
  • Increasing the drop rates of the Elite Drone AI and Drone Coronary Unit rogue drone components

We are continuing to keep an eye on all aspects of gameplay around the mining foreman ships. I know some players are hoping that we would make adjustments to other areas of Rorqual gameplay (such as ewar use while the PANIC module is running) but we feel comfortable leaving those aspects alone for now and continuing to observe how the metagame evolves. We of course reserve the right to make more changes to this or any other aspects of the Rorqual in upcoming patches to keep the ecosystem in balance.

Thanks!


It needed a yield nerf, though I likely would have gone with a somewhat more conservative number.

It boggles the mind that the unadulterated idiocy of invulnerable ewar somehow warrants a wait-and-see approach, though.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Momiji Sakora
Omni Galactic
Central Omni Galactic Group
#53 - 2016-12-07 16:47:13 UTC
Gobbins wrote:
Unbelievable

1. So why would anyone siege 9 bil worth of rorqual to make 200 mil an hour post-nerf, when a 2 bil carrier will make 150 mil/hr while staying fully aligned?

2. By making the excavator cheaper won't most dual boxing rorqs just add a third rorq? the total isk committed to the belt will stay the same, and rorquals are not very hard to multi box - so what do you do then nerf it harder? All this does is makr Rorquals the multi boxer's isk printer while single boxing plebes will stick to carriers.

3. Why not balance the risk reward through **Risk** rather than nerfing reward? For example by nerfing panic mode, or putting a delay between recall and drones entering the bay. Rorquals ops are incredibly easy to disrupt due to how fragile the excavators are. It makes for really interesting game play and counter play and you go and say "oh no we can't have that"

I mean your recent changes have all been a mind boggling series of removing risk from everying:

- Citadels making supers untouchable while moving
- ECs making bpos untouchable while building/researching
- I mean citadels in general and god knows we've been taking advantage of them
- And let's not forget good old hi sec incursions printing equivalent isk to nullsec ratting, but without risk

Finally you had put something interesting in the game and you nerf it? What are you guys even doing?

Man I am so triggered I am sitting here agreeing with goons that's how butt-annhilated I am.


> Leave the big Reward, increase RISK by looking at the panic module OR by making excavators more vulnerable. <

Cripes.


+1
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#54 - 2016-12-07 16:47:40 UTC
bpos have always been untouchable while building and researching unless you were a goddamned idiot gobbins
Gobbins
Pandemic Horde Hld.
Pandemic Horde
#55 - 2016-12-07 16:51:55 UTC
Retar Aveymone wrote:
bpos have always been untouchable while building and researching unless you were a goddamned idiot gobbins


I thought to get the super fast research from a POS module you had to put the bpo in the module. I know you could do it remotely before and then they had changed that. If I got that wrong my bad.
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#56 - 2016-12-07 16:53:55 UTC
Gobbins wrote:
Retar Aveymone wrote:
bpos have always been untouchable while building and researching unless you were a goddamned idiot gobbins


I thought to get the super fast research from a POS module you had to put the bpo in the module. I know you could do it remotely before and then they had changed that. If I got that wrong my bad.

This is correct. However, if you were paying attention, you could cancel the research and scoop the BPO inside the 24h wardec timer, ensuring it did not come to harm.

The implementation of ECs actually ensures that jobs won't be cancelled, as there's no advantage to doing so, thanks to the BPO always entering asset safety. This means there's actually an incentive to hunt ECs with the drops of job materials (or even finished products!) without giving the producer a pressing incentive to cancel jobs.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
O'nira
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#57 - 2016-12-07 16:55:11 UTC
legit did you seriously not expect this to happen ccp?

like really?
Tarsas Phage
Sniggerdly
#58 - 2016-12-07 16:55:15 UTC
Klavas wrote:
It amazes me that you see an issue with null sec mining rates yet see no issue with invulnerable neuting hictors that can jump 10LY.

How does leaving that mechanic in place help game play?


Man, it's as if GSF members are mailed talking points every morning to spout en masse on the forums.
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#59 - 2016-12-07 16:57:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Retar Aveymone
also, if you didn't feel like risking your bpo to failing to login in time you just used your tier three caldari outpost or, if you were a highsec untermenschen, a station

nobody was ever putting anything above a cruiser bpo in their labs and leaving it be for a month
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#60 - 2016-12-07 16:58:05 UTC
Tarsas Phage wrote:
Klavas wrote:
It amazes me that you see an issue with null sec mining rates yet see no issue with invulnerable neuting hictors that can jump 10LY.

How does leaving that mechanic in place help game play?


Man, it's as if GSF members are mailed talking points every morning to spout en masse on the forums.


It's adorable that you guys think that THIS is some sort of notable amount of posting. It's positively restrained.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.