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What will be the AUR price of Skill Extractors? Show us your guess!
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stg slate
State War Academy
Caldari State
#121 - 2016-02-04 14:52:05 UTC
This drops in under a week, and they haven't told us yet, so I'm guessing they are going to take the 'greed is good' approach and around 60% of a plex price per extractor.
Thorian Baalnorn
State War Academy
Caldari State
#122 - 2016-02-04 15:11:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Thorian Baalnorn
Looking at it working backwards. Lets say a plex cost 1.3 bil isk and you can train 1.5 mil sp on an alt per month. The conversion would make each SP worth 867 isk. you will likely be able to get 20-40 extractors for the price of one plex(32.5 mil isk to 65 mil isk per extractor). Making them more expensive than this would make this a very seldom used item and way to expensive for a newb especially compared to buying characters.

Given the costs above each injector will cost on the market somewhere between 625 mil isk( 1250 isk/sp) and 1 billion isk( 2000 isk/sp). This would give the extracting player a profit of( at 65 mil isk value per extractor) 380 mil isk per month per alt at 1250 isk/SP or 1.5 bil isk per alt at 2000 isk/sp. I expect it to be around 2000 isk/sp for the first 6-12 months.

So my guess is you can get about 20-40 extractors for the price of a plex.
And an injector will cost you 1250 -2000 isk/sp ( Going to say its going to level off around 1500-1600 isk/sp)

Anymore than this and the demand is going to be minimal.

Sometimes you are the squirrel and sometimes you are the nut. Today, you are the nut and the squirrel is hungry.
Kalgeroth
Doomheim
#123 - 2016-02-04 15:22:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Kalgeroth
Thorian Baalnorn wrote:

Anymore than this and the demand is going to be minimal.


S P A C E ~ M O N O C L E

neverforget

#CCP
stg slate
State War Academy
Caldari State
#124 - 2016-02-04 15:32:35 UTC
Kalgeroth wrote:
Thorian Baalnorn wrote:

Anymore than this and the demand is going to be minimal.


S P A C E ~ M O N O C L E

neverforget

#CCP


Yeah this has got potential monocle-gate written all over it.
Jarsoom Blade
Blade's Legion
#125 - 2016-02-04 20:02:44 UTC
Gudu FlyingSoul wrote:
The players are giving too much information to CPP with their coments because the extractors have no value in themselves. From my point of view 5-8 dollars price is crazy and many players agree with those prices (oficial forums and reddit). If the extractor item is expensive, the objective of its implementation (improve and create content) will not be reached because most people could not afford.


First off, the extractors are expensive from your personal point of view as you've said, if they will be around 5-10 Euro/Dollars. That alone doesn't make the skill trading system's objective unreachable. In fact the implementation of the skill trading system regardless of cost already brings content; getting ISK for an extractor or injector, trading with people, socializing, helping others, etcetera. Also improvement as you've said, since before there wasn't a system like this and now there is. Regardless of if you can afford the extractor or injector, there is now the option to get SP outside of training time.

Second, "the players are giving too much information to CCP with their comments", this is childishly ridiculous. Us discussing this new feature is giving feedback to CCP. Feedback is great. If I were to be in CCP's shoes I'd much rather hear the players expectations and feedback on this new feature so I can deliver a product which my customers, players, are willing to purchase and support. What you're insinuating is that we keep our mouths shut and hope for the best, basically. That's not how it works.

Can't wait to hear about the pricing of the extractors in any case. When the price is released it will tell you if you have to go make some extra ISK for them, or drink fewer beers at the pub to buy aurum, if you're choosing to use the SP trading system (because you don't have to!).

"Two things I've learned lately. One: don't get jammed. And two: stationary ships don't react well to 1400's" - John Rourke, Clear Skies 2
Joel Vaille
State War Academy
Caldari State
#126 - 2016-02-04 21:44:03 UTC
1 shrute buck.


or about 3 for 1 plex and 7 for 2.
Gudu FlyingSoul
Alfa Clon
#127 - 2016-02-04 22:00:33 UTC
Jarsoom Blade wrote:
Gudu FlyingSoul wrote:
The players are giving too much information to CPP with their coments because the extractors have no value in themselves. From my point of view 5-8 dollars price is crazy and many players agree with those prices (oficial forums and reddit). If the extractor item is expensive, the objective of its implementation (improve and create content) will not be reached because most people could not afford.


First off, the extractors are expensive from your personal point of view as you've said, if they will be around 5-10 Euro/Dollars. That alone doesn't make the skill trading system's objective unreachable. In fact the implementation of the skill trading system regardless of cost already brings content; getting ISK for an extractor or injector, trading with people, socializing, helping others, etcetera. Also improvement as you've said, since before there wasn't a system like this and now there is. Regardless of if you can afford the extractor or injector, there is now the option to get SP outside of training time.

Second, "the players are giving too much information to CCP with their comments", this is childishly ridiculous. Us discussing this new feature is giving feedback to CCP. Feedback is great. If I were to be in CCP's shoes I'd much rather hear the players expectations and feedback on this new feature so I can deliver a product which my customers, players, are willing to purchase and support. What you're insinuating is that we keep our mouths shut and hope for the best, basically. That's not how it works.

Can't wait to hear about the pricing of the extractors in any case. When the price is released it will tell you if you have to go make some extra ISK for them, or drink fewer beers at the pub to buy aurum, if you're choosing to use the SP trading system (because you don't have to!).


Well... I have no problem about discuss a feature, that's great, but the "price feedback" is a waste of time, CCP should be able to establish a reasonable price without help . Either way English is not my native language but reading my two-almost-consecutive posts and re-reading your anwer... An aggressive attitude towards my opinion, that does not hurt anyone, is the only thing childishly ridiculous here Roll ... Relax... you will live longer Blink
Jarsoom Blade
Blade's Legion
#128 - 2016-02-04 22:35:27 UTC
Gudu FlyingSoul wrote:
Well... I have no problem about discuss a feature, that's great, but the "price feedback" is a waste of time, CCP should be able to establish a reasonable price without help . Either way English is not my native language but reading my two-almost-consecutive posts and re-reading your anwer... An aggressive attitude towards my opinion, that does not hurt anyone, is the only thing childishly ridiculous here Roll ... Relax... you will live longer Blink


Sorry that you feel my comment was aggressive, it wasn't meant like that. English is not my native language either, not that that matters, really.

Feedback is never a waste of time. A company can of course select a price on their own easily, but it's not about us helping them. Hearing what your customer's expectations are of your product is great feedback for any business. Satisfied customers stay with you, so it's smart to play on their expectations. If we all think the price is going to be around let's say €2,50 for one extractor, and we get all hyped up about it, only to be massively dissapointed when for example one extractor is going to cost €10, players would feel fooled and be pissed about it.

In any case, we'll see. I predict one extractor is going to be around 200mil ISK on the market anyway.

"Two things I've learned lately. One: don't get jammed. And two: stationary ships don't react well to 1400's" - John Rourke, Clear Skies 2
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#129 - 2016-02-04 23:15:57 UTC
Gudu FlyingSoul wrote:
Jarsoom Blade wrote:
Gudu FlyingSoul wrote:
The players are giving too much information to CPP with their coments because the extractors have no value in themselves. From my point of view 5-8 dollars price is crazy and many players agree with those prices (oficial forums and reddit). If the extractor item is expensive, the objective of its implementation (improve and create content) will not be reached because most people could not afford.


First off, the extractors are expensive from your personal point of view as you've said, if they will be around 5-10 Euro/Dollars. That alone doesn't make the skill trading system's objective unreachable. In fact the implementation of the skill trading system regardless of cost already brings content; getting ISK for an extractor or injector, trading with people, socializing, helping others, etcetera. Also improvement as you've said, since before there wasn't a system like this and now there is. Regardless of if you can afford the extractor or injector, there is now the option to get SP outside of training time.

Second, "the players are giving too much information to CCP with their comments", this is childishly ridiculous. Us discussing this new feature is giving feedback to CCP. Feedback is great. If I were to be in CCP's shoes I'd much rather hear the players expectations and feedback on this new feature so I can deliver a product which my customers, players, are willing to purchase and support. What you're insinuating is that we keep our mouths shut and hope for the best, basically. That's not how it works.

Can't wait to hear about the pricing of the extractors in any case. When the price is released it will tell you if you have to go make some extra ISK for them, or drink fewer beers at the pub to buy aurum, if you're choosing to use the SP trading system (because you don't have to!).


Well... I have no problem about discuss a feature, that's great, but the "price feedback" is a waste of time, CCP should be able to establish a reasonable price without help . Either way English is not my native language but reading my two-almost-consecutive posts and re-reading your anwer... An aggressive attitude towards my opinion, that does not hurt anyone, is the only thing childishly ridiculous here Roll ... Relax... you will live longer Blink


Yeah because setting prices is a one and done thing. Roll

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#130 - 2016-02-04 23:34:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Teckos Pech
Jarsoom Blade wrote:
Gudu FlyingSoul wrote:
The players are giving too much information to CPP with their coments because the extractors have no value in themselves. From my point of view 5-8 dollars price is crazy and many players agree with those prices (oficial forums and reddit). If the extractor item is expensive, the objective of its implementation (improve and create content) will not be reached because most people could not afford.


First off, the extractors are expensive from your personal point of view as you've said, if they will be around 5-10 Euro/Dollars. That alone doesn't make the skill trading system's objective unreachable. In fact the implementation of the skill trading system regardless of cost already brings content; getting ISK for an extractor or injector, trading with people, socializing, helping others, etcetera. Also improvement as you've said, since before there wasn't a system like this and now there is. Regardless of if you can afford the extractor or injector, there is now the option to get SP outside of training time.

Second, "the players are giving too much information to CCP with their comments", this is childishly ridiculous. Us discussing this new feature is giving feedback to CCP. Feedback is great. If I were to be in CCP's shoes I'd much rather hear the players expectations and feedback on this new feature so I can deliver a product which my customers, players, are willing to purchase and support. What you're insinuating is that we keep our mouths shut and hope for the best, basically. That's not how it works.

Can't wait to hear about the pricing of the extractors in any case. When the price is released it will tell you if you have to go make some extra ISK for them, or drink fewer beers at the pub to buy aurum, if you're choosing to use the SP trading system (because you don't have to!).


A high in game price could result in a thin SP market. If the goal is a liquid market...then a lower price would be better. I'd say, setting the price above $5 would lead to a thin market.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Dibz
Doomheim
#131 - 2016-02-04 23:47:33 UTC
stg slate wrote:
This drops in under a week, and they haven't told us yet, so I'm guessing they are going to take the 'greed is good' approach and around 60% of a plex price per extractor.


The longer they leave it, the higher the price is going to be Shocked
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#132 - 2016-02-04 23:53:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
Teckos Pech wrote:

Yeah because setting prices is a one and done thing. Roll


Do you sometimes have this feeling when you see a discount price and still think its overpriced?
---> NEX store

ᴇᴠᴇʀʏ ᴘᴀʀᴛ ᴏғ ᴀ ɢᴀᴍᴇ ʜᴇʟᴘs ᴛᴏ ᴛᴇʟʟ ᴀ sᴛᴏʀʏ 📕

ᴡʜᴇʀᴇ ɪs ᴀɴɢʀʏ ᴄᴏɴᴄᴏʀᴅ ɢᴜʏ ᴡʜᴇɴ ʏᴏᴜ ɴᴇᴇᴅ ʜɪᴍ

ᴏsᴘʀᴇʏ 🚀

≡⋁≡ ♥
Dr Mibbles
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#133 - 2016-02-05 11:45:59 UTC
Let's break this down;

ArrowThe current ISK cost of AUR is 350,000 ISK per AUR
ArrowThe current isk cost of SP (on an account funded by Plex) is an average of 800 ISK per SP (400m ISK per 500k SP)
ArrowThese two numbers will determine the market price of the Skill Injectors, and the Skill Extractors

So the ISK cost of the extractors would be as follows:

Arrow 50 AUR = 17.5m ISK
Arrow 100 AUR = 35m ISK
Arrow 250 AUR = 87.5m ISK
Arrow 500 AUR = 175m ISK
Arrow 1000 AUR = 350m ISK
Arrow 2000 AUR = 700m ISK
Arrow 3500 AUR = 1225m ISK

Then, you add the cost of the SP to arrive at the total Injector price (assuming people sell AT COST, with no profit):

Arrow 50 AUR = 417.5m ISK
Arrow 100 AUR = 435m ISK
Arrow 250 AUR = 487.5m ISK
Arrow 500 AUR = 575m ISK
Arrow 1000 AUR = 750m ISK
Arrow 2000 AUR = 1100m ISK
Arrow 3500 AUR = 1625m ISK

So, how much money will this make CCP?

If they price at the 50-500 AUR range, it should become a commonly bought mass-market item and a strong revenue stream, particularly in the 250 AUR range where the market value of an extractor should settle around 500m ISK. This is an important psychological barrier for many players, and on the borderline of 'affordable' for most players, for a small SP boost.

Pricing of 1000 AUR and above would, in my view, leave the injectors as a more rarely traded item. And pricing of 2000 or higher would mean they are rarely used indeed. You would have to be both a wealthy player and have little sense of value-for-money to be willing to part with more ISK for an injector than a Plex.

tl;dr: 250 AUR is the sweet spot for extractor pricing
stg slate
State War Academy
Caldari State
#134 - 2016-02-05 17:54:48 UTC
It's Friday and still no pricing announcement. This is a bad sign, be ready for 2500 arum extractors and tons of wasted development time on a service priced into obscurity Big smile
Dechala Simulus
Perkone
Caldari State
#135 - 2016-02-05 18:00:54 UTC
From the circumspect nature of the announcement, we're probably looking at 2k aur per extractor. If they were "reasonably" priced they'd have already made the announcement on the price.

Only reason to hold it this close is to limit the stress of having to deal with complaints all weekend :P
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#136 - 2016-02-05 18:15:08 UTC
Dechala Simulus wrote:
From the circumspect nature of the announcement, we're probably looking at 2k aur per extractor. If they were "reasonably" priced they'd have already made the announcement on the price.

Only reason to hold it this close is to limit the stress of having to deal with complaints all weekend :P


On the plus side, those of us who saw SP trading a potentially bad thing wont have to worry at extractors priced at 2,000 Aurum. The market will be ridiculously thin.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Dechala Simulus
Perkone
Caldari State
#137 - 2016-02-05 18:21:27 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Dechala Simulus wrote:
From the circumspect nature of the announcement, we're probably looking at 2k aur per extractor. If they were "reasonably" priced they'd have already made the announcement on the price.

Only reason to hold it this close is to limit the stress of having to deal with complaints all weekend :P


On the plus side, those of us who saw SP trading a potentially bad thing wont have to worry at extractors priced at 2,000 Aurum. The market will be ridiculously thin.


For sure; I might be interested if an -injector- costed out at about 700M per; but it looks like an extractor will cost out at about that. Which means nahhh, on my part.

Not mad, it's an extra bell/whistle for the game as a whole so no skin off my back, ill continue to play as I do and continue enjoying.

And it's their game, if some people find that 1.5ish bil per injector is a value for them, then rock on. Hell I like the skins in game, which have no appreciable value at all other than looking pretty to me, so glass houses and stones and all that.
stg slate
State War Academy
Caldari State
#138 - 2016-02-05 18:35:09 UTC
Dechala Simulus wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Dechala Simulus wrote:
From the circumspect nature of the announcement, we're probably looking at 2k aur per extractor. If they were "reasonably" priced they'd have already made the announcement on the price.

Only reason to hold it this close is to limit the stress of having to deal with complaints all weekend :P


On the plus side, those of us who saw SP trading a potentially bad thing wont have to worry at extractors priced at 2,000 Aurum. The market will be ridiculously thin.


For sure; I might be interested if an -injector- costed out at about 700M per; but it looks like an extractor will cost out at about that. Which means nahhh, on my part.

Not mad, it's an extra bell/whistle for the game as a whole so no skin off my back, ill continue to play as I do and continue enjoying.

And it's their game, if some people find that 1.5ish bil per injector is a value for them, then rock on. Hell I like the skins in game, which have no appreciable value at all other than looking pretty to me, so glass houses and stones and all that.


I'll be annoyed if time was spent on this and it was priced into uselessness; its not like there isn't enough work to go around.
Dibz
Doomheim
#139 - 2016-02-05 18:41:57 UTC
stg slate wrote:
It's Friday and still no pricing announcement. This is a bad sign, be ready for 2500 arum extractors and tons of wasted development time on a service priced into obscurity Big smile


I would be very disappointed if the extractors were in that price range. I've been looking forward to shifting some skills between two of my characters - somewhere between 10M-15M SP. I'm not space rich, so I'll have to pay cash. If the cost would go into three figures CCP can do one.
Dechala Simulus
Perkone
Caldari State
#140 - 2016-02-05 18:42:06 UTC
stg slate wrote:
Dechala Simulus wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Dechala Simulus wrote:
From the circumspect nature of the announcement, we're probably looking at 2k aur per extractor. If they were "reasonably" priced they'd have already made the announcement on the price.

Only reason to hold it this close is to limit the stress of having to deal with complaints all weekend :P


On the plus side, those of us who saw SP trading a potentially bad thing wont have to worry at extractors priced at 2,000 Aurum. The market will be ridiculously thin.


For sure; I might be interested if an -injector- costed out at about 700M per; but it looks like an extractor will cost out at about that. Which means nahhh, on my part.

Not mad, it's an extra bell/whistle for the game as a whole so no skin off my back, ill continue to play as I do and continue enjoying.

And it's their game, if some people find that 1.5ish bil per injector is a value for them, then rock on. Hell I like the skins in game, which have no appreciable value at all other than looking pretty to me, so glass houses and stones and all that.


I'll be annoyed if time was spent on this and it was priced into uselessness; its not like there isn't enough work to go around.


I mean, 1.5+B probably won't cost it into uselessness, if it gets into the 2b+ range I think the market will end up being -extremely- thin, and then talk about whether the cost/benefit of developing the extractors was worth it. But time will tell.

Based on nothing at all, if injectors are around 500 aurum per, there will probably be a vibrant market for them. Above that you'll probably see hits to the market at a pretty steep rate. With 2k Aurum per probably being the "dead" zone for them.

Again, not saying it's bad, the cost is the cost and no matter what it plays out to be I think it'll be okay. But just thinking out loud about how active the market will be on these. Also how much CCP wants them to impact the game.

Time will tell (fortunately not too much time either!)