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Dev blog: Skill trading in New Eden

First post First post First post
Author
Masao Kurata
Perkone
Caldari State
#1921 - 2016-02-06 16:18:20 UTC
The AUR price is ruinously low. The majority of SP extraction will be currently unneeded SP and it will be sold no matter how little profit is in it, making the injectors little more expensive than extractors long term. The bulk price of 800 AUR/extractor means that with the low margin on injectors, buying injectors is not only faster than buying multiple pilot training certificates, it's cheaper too. The long term effects of this on CCP's revenue and the health of the game will be disastrous, you need to double the AUR price.
Shova'k
The Bank Of Jita
#1922 - 2016-02-06 16:21:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Shova'k
Sarina Aideron wrote:
I still can't believe that CCP is doing this. All the promises after the summer of rage, to never sell anyting for AUR that gives a direct advantage over other players, were emtpy talk. CCP makes the game less hardcore every year.

Also, what about all the talk about careful balancing and previsional planning of features .. Has CCP not thought about all the ways skill trading can be abused by rich players/alliances? They can now:

  • easily switch doctrines
  • instantly replace SP losses from T3s
  • lure new players with injectors
  • hoard injectors as "gold" item
  • instantly use the newest overpowered toys/doctrines (i.e. Ishtar fleets before nerf)
  • etc


I liked most of the changes CCP made in the last years but the skill trading feature ... WTF CCP. Could it be that there was a recent change in leadership? Some new producers or managers from EA maybe? Because skill trading looks like a typical EA cash grab.


extractor is the only part that requires aurum does not give any one an advantage it removes sp derp the injectors are isk only on the open market.

even then no real advantage is gained since you still have to know what the hell your doing to utilize the sp in the first place as it has been said many times in this threads 90+ pages player skill/experience > skill points. it's like some one one buying a fake medical diploma isnt gonna make them a skilled surgeon...
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1923 - 2016-02-06 17:01:31 UTC
Masao Kurata wrote:
The AUR price is ruinously low.

..

The long term effects of this on CCP's revenue and the health of the game will be disastrous, you need to double the AUR price.

Well, this needs to be paid attention to

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Josef Djugashvilis
#1924 - 2016-02-06 17:25:27 UTC
Vile Swan wrote:
CCP I'd like to say on behalf of the whole game. Thank you for F*****g garbage price you put on the extractors. It will only cost $100 to get a new toon to 15 million skillpoints bahahahahaha. LONG LIVE CCP.


I just hope that the whole rotten system becomes so expensive that absolutely no one uses it Smile

This is not a signature.

Boe Harknes
The FreeThought Society
#1925 - 2016-02-06 18:35:33 UTC
Im still not sure what the difference between this or buying a character off the bazaar. Either way it is a way to convert real money to game power. Still doesnt change the fact that a crappy pilot is still a crappy pilot and wont last very long in game.
Tristan Agion
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1926 - 2016-02-06 18:46:56 UTC
*slow clap*

Next time I think CCP is doing something right, I will just shut my face and leave the floor to the haters. Lesson learned.
Tamara Jade
Anonymous Four
#1927 - 2016-02-06 19:16:42 UTC
OUCH, the cost of an Skill Extractor is about 300 mil ISK. I guess the injectors will be around the 700 mil ISK price. A bit expensive for gaining 10 days of training.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1928 - 2016-02-06 19:46:39 UTC
Masao Kurata wrote:
The AUR price is ruinously low. The majority of SP extraction will be currently unneeded SP and it will be sold no matter how little profit is in it, making the injectors little more expensive than extractors long term. The bulk price of 800 AUR/extractor means that with the low margin on injectors, buying injectors is not only faster than buying multiple pilot training certificates, it's cheaper too. The long term effects of this on CCP's revenue and the health of the game will be disastrous, you need to double the AUR price.
That's pretty presumptuous regarding the potential value of SP don't you think? The mandated price may taper demand some, but it's likely going to have some negative effect on supply compared to if it were more trivial as well. Also the initial rush of "waste" SP will meet the initial desire for SP that's been pent up here. I don't think these will have a marginal cost for a while.
Berrice Silf
Academy of the Imperial Guards
#1929 - 2016-02-06 19:58:20 UTC
Tristan Agion wrote:
*slow clap*

Next time I think CCP is doing something right, I will just shut my face and leave the floor to the haters. Lesson learned.


Its not Haters mate, after 11 years you get to see when one of the CCP dudes decides to have one of these HUGE brain fart moments and they release information then stay totally silent on certain important details of said eureka moment. It becomes a please realize what your doing .... not !!!

Instead of just biting the bullet and selling them to everyone for a set fee you get this convoluted crap that now the price has been released a few days before it goes live all those poor sods who were hailing it as the second coming of EvE have realized they've been conned again.

Well played Rise, Maybe the masses would be better to remember next time - Fool me once shame on you, Fool me twice shame on me Big smileBig smileBig smile
Soltys
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1930 - 2016-02-06 20:30:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Soltys
Tamara Jade wrote:
OUCH, the cost of an Skill Extractor is about 300 mil ISK. I guess the injectors will be around the 700 mil ISK price. A bit expensive for gaining 10 days of training.


It's like if they desperately wanted everyone to not use this feature.

If we mapped this cost directly to the character bazaar - 2 plexes is 7 (seven) extractors = 3.5m sp. Then the transfer fee for a 35m sp character would be 20 (twenty) plexes. Assuming they wouldn't try to emulate diminishing returns somehow.

How many people would be using character bazaar then ?

How is this sp trading thing supposed to be better / more flexible / whatever alternative to bazaar ?

Jita Flipping Inc.: Kovl & Kuvl

Tamara Jade
Anonymous Four
#1931 - 2016-02-06 20:36:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Tamara Jade
Soltys wrote:
Tamara Jade wrote:
OUCH, the cost of an Skill Extractor is about 300 mil ISK. I guess the injectors will be around the 700 mil ISK price. A bit expensive for gaining 10 days of training.


It's like if they desperately wanted everyone to not use this feature.

If we mapped this cost directly to the character bazaar - 2 plexes is 7 (seven) extractors = 3.5m sp. Then the transfer fee for a 35m sp character would be 20 (twenty) plexes. Assuming they wouldn't try to emulate diminishing returns somehow.

How many people would be using character bazaar then ?

How is this sp trading thing supposed to be better / more flexible / whatever alternative to bazaar ?



Basically what they are saying is PLEX is going up to 2 bil soon and toons sold on the Bazaar should go up in price as well. The Bazaar is way underpriced.
Berrice Silf
Academy of the Imperial Guards
#1932 - 2016-02-06 21:54:42 UTC
Now this turd is going live, remember what it said at the bottom of the original blog.

Oh, and one last note on the Bazaar, it won't go anywhere for now

Why let folks give whole toons away for a measly 2 plex when we can ream them dry on 500k packets Roll
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1933 - 2016-02-06 22:21:23 UTC
Berrice Silf wrote:
Now this turd is going live, remember what it said at the bottom of the original blog.

Oh, and one last note on the Bazaar, it won't go anywhere for now

Why let folks give whole toons away for a measly 2 plex when we can ream them dry on 500k packets Roll


They say you can't polish a turd but you really can...of course, that means you just end up with a shiny turd....
Zozoll Neblyn
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1934 - 2016-02-06 23:05:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Zozoll Neblyn
So is it 4.3 extractors per PLEX?

And I think the number was 223 Injectors to get from 0 SP to 80 m SP.

So 52 PLEX for the extractors, plus whatever the SP themselves cost.

And I guess SP is about 2 mil per month for a farm, so maximum price would be 1/4 PLEX to convert an extractor to an injector, so for 223 injectors we're looking at 56 PLEX for the SP. ... But that is an absolute max price.

So 108 PLEX buys you an 80 m SP character with a name chosen by you, and no corp history. A pay 2 win player buys PLEX for $17.50 each, unless they wait for a PLEX sale.

So if you are Pay2Win you're looking at paying $1,890.00.


So... if Warren Buffet decides to start playing Eve after this goes into effect, he's going to get quite a head start!
Moac Tor
Cyber Core
Immediate Destruction
#1935 - 2016-02-06 23:17:49 UTC
Tamara Jade wrote:
OUCH, the cost of an Skill Extractor is about 300 mil ISK. I guess the injectors will be around the 700 mil ISK price. A bit expensive for gaining 10 days of training.

They'll be around 500 - 600mil assuming PLEX at 1.2B.

Roughly 275mil for an extractor, and around 300mil for the 500k SP.

My guess is they will stabilise between 500mil to 600mil.

Certainly if they go anything over 600mil then farmers will be jumping in.

A PLEX should buy a newbie 1M SP (for this they will have to use CC but then that was always obvious to anyone with common sense).

I'd say CCP has got the price about right, too low and it is easily abusable by the big alliances, and too high and it is prohibitive for the masses.

I still think this skill trading proposal is a stupid idea and detrimental to the game and is not at all very eve-like, but pricing at 800aur to 1000aur was the only option that CCP could realistically go with.

When they said it was going to be equivalent to the cost of using the bazaar I must admit I took it with a pinch of salt, this is priced way over cost of doing business in the bazaar.
Kaldi Tsukaya
Deveron Shipyards and Technology
Citizen's Star Republic
#1936 - 2016-02-06 23:34:43 UTC
Still well enough affordable for T3 pilots to keep an injector or two with their med clones.

Still would have liked an isk sink somewhere in this plan.
Oh well, back to business...

Daniela Doran
Doomheim
#1937 - 2016-02-07 00:02:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Daniela Doran
Moac Tor wrote:
Tamara Jade wrote:
OUCH, the cost of an Skill Extractor is about 300 mil ISK. I guess the injectors will be around the 700 mil ISK price. A bit expensive for gaining 10 days of training.

They'll be around 500 - 600mil assuming PLEX at 1.2B.

Roughly 275mil for an extractor, and around 300mil for the 500k SP.

My guess is they will stabilise between 500mil to 600mil.

Certainly if they go anything over 600mil then farmers will be jumping in.

A PLEX should buy a newbie 1M SP (for this they will have to use CC but then that was always obvious to anyone with common sense).

I'd say CCP has got the price about right, too low and it is easily abusable by the big alliances, and too high and it is prohibitive for the masses.

I still think this skill trading proposal is a stupid idea and detrimental to the game and is not at all very eve-like, but pricing at 800aur to 1000aur was the only option that CCP could realistically go with.

When they said it was going to be equivalent to the cost of using the bazaar I must admit I took it with a pinch of salt, this is priced way over cost of doing business in the bazaar.

Well this is one of the things I was hoping for if they insisted with this SP trading garbage and that was to raise the prices soo high that the scrubs would have to work overtime (and maybe sell some of their personal belongings on Ebay) to pay for them, LOL.

I condone this decision by CCP because at the very least, it'll reduce the cancerous effects that SP trading will have on Eve and prolong its lifespan.
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#1938 - 2016-02-07 00:05:48 UTC
Good thing it will not look like a extremely overpriced f2p paywall in a subscription now. Now it will look like an extremely insane overprised f2p paywall in a subscription game. Good job!
Dracnys
#1939 - 2016-02-07 00:13:06 UTC
The high aurum price and decreasing yield for high SP characters means that the character bazaar will be much cheaper than buying injectors. People who want to buy a lot of SP will continue to buy a character.

So this limits the SP injectors to people who just need a little SP to do get into a new ship, use a module or whatever. This is not very impactful to the overall balance of the game. So actually the high price makes me less worried about the consequences of SP trading, because it's so inefficient.
Zozoll Neblyn
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1940 - 2016-02-07 00:58:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Zozoll Neblyn
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Good thing it will not look like a extremely overpriced f2p paywall in a subscription now. Now it will look like an extremely insane overprised f2p paywall in a subscription game. Good job!


The result would be that the game doesn't get unbalanced by it. Nobody who isn't super rich is going to be willing to buy enough injectors to "win". Maybe get a few weeks ahead without waiting.


But it's not a situation where, if you don't pay, you lose. Not even a situation where refusing to pay puts you at a significant disadvantage.

If the price were like $50.00 for a 80 m SP character, then you'd have to pay or you might as well not bother to play. But at $1890.00 I think it's a safe bet you won't get gank swarmed by an bunch of 80m SP pay players who started last week.

Not unless a Harvard Fraternity gets into Eve, or something.