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An ISK or RL rich player can buy SP, irrespective of where it comes from. sure no net SP are added to the game but the rich will be able to accumulate SP faster than the less well off.

This isn't pay to win as there isn't really a win in EvE beyond goals you set yourself, put it is definitely pay-for-advantage and the rich will exploit and control it as best they can at the expense of the less rich.

Exactly as occurs in the character bazaar.

It is clearly not "pay to win" regardless of your goals. This term describes the situation where you can only purchase an in game advantage with RL cash.

yep yep


example of pay to win in EVE would be

ammo you can only get with money that gives you a much higher chance of hitting target or does more dmg
a ship you can only get with money that has superior stats to normal ships (example, Fleet Issue that can only be bought with rl money)


skill injectors are more similar to XP boosters in GW2, WoW, or Premium account(for bonus exp)

its similar to a cerebral accelerator, except gives the exp now, instead over the course of your first month.



will having more SP than the enemy make you always win? no. cause it depends heavily on ships both people bring, weapons, builds, and numbers on both sides.

SP helps you be able to use stuff, or use it more effectively, but it isn't a auto win.

not to mention, you can buy SP injectors with isk you earn in game, and thus (unlike XP boosters in other games) its more accessible without money. (and more at the mercy of the playerbase to change its price)




as Scott says here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0M7jkv3xkQ


his 60mill SP character can be beaten by a 10mill SP character depending on what ship/build both are using.

(though a 60mill SP character vs a 1mill SP character who can't use the basic weapons....would be a pretty big stretch. at 10mill your pretty set up)





honestly, arguing that XP booster like items are P2W is like arguing that having a superior computer is P2W.

i predict first day that thing is on eve will have a few player with maxed out skill point.

1mill you can't use much in the way of weapons, ships, systems, or such.

10mill. your pretty decently set up in several ships

You can kill people with 16 minutes of skills after creating a character.. Not sure why that matters though.


Will they be sold on the test server for 100 ISK each? :)

its not even close to pay to win the only possibly way to pay to win in eve is to pay another player to out right train you in how to not suck at the game. having skill points and knowing how to use them are huge difference every person i know who has dropped real life money on plex to convert to isk in order to buy a high sp char got their ass kicked in pvp every time untill they either rage quit or decided to learn how to play. it's not even pay to win for people who are good at the game since they already have a character with sp all it does is provide them with alts. the most this does is pay to save time.

P.S. im not for or against this just speaking the base layer facts. the only aspect i actually like is the ability to remove some skills i wish i never trained lol

All skills V = 500 million skillpoints or thereabouts.

A character training every year without interruption from when the game was released in 2003 would have 250 million or so by now (2016). This character would require 1666 injectors to get to 500 million. 840 million skillpoints would be destroyed to create these injectors. And if it costs 1000 Aur per extractor (that's my guess), the cost just in Aur is $8,300 to extract the skills.

If you're talking about an Average Joe with 60 million skillpoints (3 years of playing) trying to max out, that's 2900 injectors, $15,000 to extract.

But let's say that the guy doesn't care about extracting, he'll just find unlimited numbers of injectors on the market in Jita, because the playerbase is big and can provide them. At the predicted cost of Aur+1/4PLEX, it would cost the 2003 character $16,000 to buy enough PLEX to buy the injectors he needs from Jita, and it would cost the Average Joe $30,000 cause he needs more injectors.

Since some of the recent arguments seem to like to equate this to the character bazaar I guess you will not mind this new improvement replacing it? As in we shutter the bazaar in the near future?

No, they are not the same. That point was made by Rise in the first post. He disliked getting a character with its own baggage. You know, consequences?

On the other hand the consequence of buying the sp packets will be the cost. Part of that cost will be determined by CCP in the cost of the Extractors and part by the dynamic player market (what do YOU think your points are worth?) CCP is NOT selling skill points, so stop saying that. They went with the ancient wisdom of 'In a gold rush the man who gets rich is the one selling the shovels'. That is what the Extractors are, the shovels.

Is this for the new players? No. I actually recommend not telling new players about this at all for fear of the impression being made. 'Oh hi, yeah, have a couple of weeks for free. What? Oh yeah, this is a subscription game so after that you have to pay (or someone has to pay if you are good enough to make the value of a Plex in game) What? Yeah implants speed things up a little, yeah there IS a faster way . . .you just buy skill points on the market. No, that is not part of the sub fees. Yes, it is a bit pricey but if you buy a Plex to turn into Isk then you can buy them in game. Yes, Plex can be used to buy things in the game but we don't call it a currency. Oh you can also buy Aurum with Plex. Aurum is a currency you cannot trade or transfer. Wait . . . where are you going? come back?"

Oh I admit there are some who will buy into this idea in a big way. The term for them is whales, I believe.

That is the balancing act CCP is betting on. That the increase revenue will exceed any losses via disillusioned players leaving. As I said before, I am staying, not because I agree with this plan but because I hope that the game will weather this decision, one way or another. I have tried to put a lot into the game and the gaming community. I have friends here. I cannot just walk away when things get rough. My play style may be impacted? I'll adapt. People will suddenly be better than me? News flash, lots already are and I keep playing anyways.

With great trepidation I will be paying my first subscription fees in three years come this April. But pay them I will.

See? That is how an optimistic anarchist HTFU's

m

Mike. It is no different than trying to explain pvp to a new guy that just got owned by smaller, less expensive, ships. Or traveling down a low sec pipe to get camped on three separate occasions in the same play session (yes, it does happen very often) and wants this BS explained.
I've learned that with newbs you tell them only as much as they can handle atm, because Eve is just too big, with too many layers.
On top of this all, it will be easier to circumvent the total frustration a new player feels when he repeatedly feels like the ship he needs is always a week, weeks, months, or half a year away.