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Dev blog: Skill trading in New Eden

First post First post First post
Author
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#401 - 2016-01-19 02:26:24 UTC
Exhumers 5, your days are numbered. My alts have need of those skills.
Random User83
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#402 - 2016-01-19 02:34:41 UTC
Oh yes... OH YES... OHHH YESSSSSS
all of those pointless mining skill points put towards useful things, like engineering and gunnery....

I'm a strong independant alt that don't need no main...

Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#403 - 2016-01-19 02:52:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
It's official, Kil2 really is the moron who killed EVE. Not only can't he balance for ****, he also introduces ships he doesn't even know what they'll do and will require help from players to fix. And now he dropped this bomb on us. Well done clown.

- edit -

Not going to stand for it: I'll delete my YT channel with guides and stop helping newbies in Rookie, I don't want to play p2w games and I don't want to lure others into one either.
Daimon Tar
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#404 - 2016-01-19 03:05:22 UTC
I like it. Ive got skills I've wasted points in that I can give an alt or give to a friend and diminishing returns will mean there less SP in the eve-universe every-time its used. Choices are a good thing.

Its a shame this thread is a salt mine though. God forbid a new character have something easier than a bitter vet.
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#405 - 2016-01-19 03:07:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
And when the Goon/Horde RMT machine gets into gear just remember: we told you so. Just like we told you so with the T3D.
Querns
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#406 - 2016-01-19 03:30:07 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
And when the Goon/Horde RMT machine gets into gear just remember: we told you so. Just like we told you so with the T3D.

What, exactly, is the tipping point here regarding a goon RMT machine? Why would it be now, and not back when Technetium was hemorrhaging ISK in untold quantity?

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#407 - 2016-01-19 03:31:03 UTC
Querns wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
And when the Goon/Horde RMT machine gets into gear just remember: we told you so. Just like we told you so with the T3D.

What, exactly, is the tipping point here regarding a goon RMT machine? Why would it be now, and not back when Technetium was hemorrhaging ISK in untold quantity?
The tipping point is how convenient it is for the current argument. Tech is old news.
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#408 - 2016-01-19 03:33:20 UTC
Querns wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
And when the Goon/Horde RMT machine gets into gear just remember: we told you so. Just like we told you so with the T3D.

What, exactly, is the tipping point here regarding a goon RMT machine? Why would it be now, and not back when Technetium was hemorrhaging ISK in untold quantity?


Explained here
Querns
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#409 - 2016-01-19 03:35:06 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
Querns wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
And when the Goon/Horde RMT machine gets into gear just remember: we told you so. Just like we told you so with the T3D.

What, exactly, is the tipping point here regarding a goon RMT machine? Why would it be now, and not back when Technetium was hemorrhaging ISK in untold quantity?


Explained here

That's pretty insane, man. Why would we use SP injectors when we could just sell ISK directly?

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#410 - 2016-01-19 03:40:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
If you had read it: isk isn't a limiting factor, SP is. Also Isk can be legitimately gotten via plex so there's a lot of competition in that. Alliances like yours have so much isk there's nothing for them to spend it on, it's wasted pretty much so this SP trading is one of the few good options to syphon some off that away. You simply need to create the demand and then supply them.

1 lure newbie into alliance
2 do the "well, if you could fly [insert ship/module] then you could join in these awesome fights"
3 sell SP
4 ....
5 profit
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#411 - 2016-01-19 03:43:55 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
If you had read it: isk isn't a limiting factor, SP is. Also Isk can be legitimately gotten via plex so there's a lot of competition in that. Alliances like yours have so much isk there's nothing for them to spend it on, it's wasted pretty much so this SP trading is one of the few good options to syphon some off that away. You simply need to create the demand and then supply them.

1 lure newbie into alliance
2 do the "well, if you could fly a [insert ship/module] BC then you could join in these awesome fights"
3 sell SP
4 ....
5 profit
Isk can be had via PLEX, injectors can be had via isk. There is already a fully EULA biding route here for an item which itself reinforces the value of isk.

If the competition from legal means works against isk sales, why wouldn't it work against injector sales using the same method?
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#412 - 2016-01-19 03:48:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
If you had read it: isk isn't a limiting factor, SP is. Also Isk can be legitimately gotten via plex so there's a lot of competition in that. Alliances like yours have so much isk there's nothing for them to spend it on, it's wasted pretty much so this SP trading is one of the few good options to syphon some off that away. You simply need to create the demand and then supply them.

1 lure newbie into alliance
2 do the "well, if you could fly a [insert ship/module] BC then you could join in these awesome fights"
3 sell SP
4 ....
5 profit
Isk can be had via PLEX, injectors can be had via isk. There is already a fully EULA biding route here for an item which itself reinforces the value of isk.

If the competition from legal means works against isk sales, why wouldn't it work against injector sales using the same method?


It seems you don't want to read, because it doesn't suit your agenda.

Lets say I have 2 trillion and (thus) I really don't give a fck about isk, but I do care about RL money. I'll buy SP from the market and give that to you, while you give me something irl. I STILL will have "too much" isk, now I also have RL cash.

It's more difficult to persuade people to use RMT when there's an official way (sell plex for isk outright) of doing it. Using SP trading adds some extra variables and steps that will make it easier for people to do/use RMT.
Roc Wind
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#413 - 2016-01-19 03:50:41 UTC
I am not an active player but I have been training my character since 2011. I spend 5 years to reach 100 m skill points and what makes me continue to be an EVE player is that in EVE the skill points is priceless, only the time matters. Hi, CCP, I am an old player and if you just evaluate me by the money I spent in EVE I will be very sad. In the past I could introduce to my friend the EVE game proudly because it is sophisticated and need real time to learn skill, but now I can only say it is good because you can get skill very quickly. I miss the time I got up in midnight to update my skill, I miss the time I traveled everywhere with my laptop in order to update my skill and I miss the time I lost my internet and begged my friend to help me update my skill. I treasure the skill points because you can't buy it, just like you can't buy the time. I felt EVE was like the real life, only time will teach me how to be a mature man. Now, honestly speaking, I can't stand some new guys could catch up with me on the skill points with some ISK. Once money could dominate a society in most aspects, no matter virtual or real, the society will be no longer suitable for living.

I think it is time to leave my favorite EVE after you implement this mechanic. I have no reason to stay in this cruel and money-mad world.
Amarrchecko
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#414 - 2016-01-19 03:53:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarrchecko
I like the whole "the way we are doing this means it's all still player driven" thing. It makes me feel a tiny bit better than if ccp just got rid of monthly subs and plex, and instead just sold sp packets and ships/mods directly for $$$.

Straight
Alea
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#415 - 2016-01-19 03:55:56 UTC
I'm not sure how I feel about this, it doesn't feel like a step forward it feels more like a money grab right before the ship sinks.

I have to admit I am butthurt, I have what I have because I worked for it and I take pride in that.

Depending on how cheap or expensive this new endeavor becomes I fear this may bring in more WoW kiddies and with that even more crying about how hard the game is, will CCP then nerf all the things even more to keep the cash cow alive a little bit longer.? What ever happened to HTFU.? I guess it should now be PTFU.. (Pay the feck up).

This is honestly the best game I have ever played but it's ever so slowly falling from the top spot.

Whomever is making the last few years decisions on what changes are to be implemented in this game, must hate Eve with all their being.

Zee Zaugg
Zero's Legion
#416 - 2016-01-19 03:58:47 UTC
Erotisk Folkdans wrote:
Zee Zaugg wrote:

Lots of players will lose a lot of expirience. We all had to claw our way into better ships, dying and learning along the way.


Ooh I was waiting for this one. You really can't stand the thought of new players getting something you didn't get, can you? They must be denied! Please CCP, don't let new players be competitive!

They can die in their new ships and get experience just as easy. You just can't kill them as easy.

I would suggest before you fall asleep tonight, think long and hard about all those new players having fun with a little more sp. Quicker than you had. Hurts, doesn't it?

Pathetic.


Not really pathetic at all, though youre quite a ***** for saying it in the way you did.

The truth is, this is game breaking across the board. I dont pvp much, i dont care about grinding noobs to dust. In fact, Im a newbro trainer. It would make my job significantly easier if this was implemented. that does not make it a good idea. I say this in complete honesty, the most fun i EVER had in eve was as a noob in a noob corp doing noob things.

I still remember being a hero by bringing a caracal into that SoE noob arc with the cruiser at the end that shield tanked. Everyone was in frigs and they couldnt break his tank, we were all new, and there were like 4 of us. couldnt do it. Luckiiy my skill training had just finished for caldari cruisers, so i got my caracal and broke the bastards tank and we finally finished the arc.

I had lots of expiriences like this, learning this game and improving while you still see the universe with the new player beer goggles we all lose somewhere along the way. Taking this expirience away is a crime. Players can be competitive, players cn be able to fight back faster, but taking away the new player expirience is criminal.

And aside from that, im really more worried about the higher sp characters. they are the ones who will buy the most of these injectors, and they are the ones who will set the prices. They dont need the boost. I dont need the boost. A small step stool is acceptable, but an amount of sp only limited by the depths of your pockets, which for far too many players are way too deep, is a horrible idea. The strong will get stronger, and the only way for new players to catch up will be to pay for PLEX until they can cheat their way to incursions. Its not right.

Set a limit to the number of Injectors possible per character, dont make this mistake.

Id also be curious to know which forums CCP was reading that made them think this idea was widely accepted, as a vast majority of what I read was quite negative.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#417 - 2016-01-19 04:07:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Tyberius Franklin
Gregor Parud wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
If you had read it: isk isn't a limiting factor, SP is. Also Isk can be legitimately gotten via plex so there's a lot of competition in that. Alliances like yours have so much isk there's nothing for them to spend it on, it's wasted pretty much so this SP trading is one of the few good options to syphon some off that away. You simply need to create the demand and then supply them.

1 lure newbie into alliance
2 do the "well, if you could fly a [insert ship/module] BC then you could join in these awesome fights"
3 sell SP
4 ....
5 profit
Isk can be had via PLEX, injectors can be had via isk. There is already a fully EULA biding route here for an item which itself reinforces the value of isk.

If the competition from legal means works against isk sales, why wouldn't it work against injector sales using the same method?


It seems you don't want to read, because it doesn't suit your agenda.

Lets say I have 2 trillion and (thus) I really don't give a fck about isk, but I do care about RL money. I'll buy SP from the market and give that to you, while you give me something irl. I STILL will have "too much" isk, now I also have RL cash.

It's more difficult to persuade people to use RMT when there's an official way (sell plex for isk outright) of doing it. Using SP trading adds some extra variables and steps that will make it easier for people to do/use RMT.
I read it the first time (look further down on the page from the post you linked). It makes no more sense now than it did then. Why would someone, as a buyer who is somehow deterred from RMT due to legal means being present, buy RMT'd injectors from you when the isk I'm buying from CCP via PLEX instead of RMT isk gets me the same legally?

It doesn't matter how many trillions your hypothetical seller has or how much real cash they want, the legal way already exists for those who don't want to RMT.

Agendas indeed. Buying things on the market, the very purpose of getting isk, legal or otherwise, is somehow enough of an obfuscation to make RMT more appealing for injectors than isk itself?. Right.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#418 - 2016-01-19 04:15:23 UTC
are we really going to use the "its for the new players angle"?


because if as a new player the only way to be on the same level as other new players is to shell out cash its ridiculous.


and don''t say "they can use isk" if its cheep enough that a new bro can make enough to get use out of them then they are just going to be bought as soon as they go on market by the people with isk.


the fact that they take a set time to produce means that even if the aurm price is low the isk price is going to be very high the only people able to afford these off the market are going to be bitter vets and people with the cash to sell plex
Niraia
Starcakes
Cynosural Field Theory.
#419 - 2016-01-19 04:15:42 UTC
Sad day for old players, but I hope you enjoy your money.

Ein Herje
Indirect approach
Fraternity University
#420 - 2016-01-19 04:17:22 UTC
Yes I can understand to a certain extent where CCP is coming from with this, it will be awsome to get more players into the game, but don't you also think that there should be a cap so that older players don't feel like it's all been a waste for them, subscribing all this time getting all those skills up there?

Say something like 60-80 mill skillpoints you can make an awsome whatever pilot with that. (I think)
I don't care about the finance, I want CCP to earn money I have nothing against that, but let it still be
something special to have accumulated 100 of millions of skillpoints.
The old players have carried the game this far by keeping their subs active you know.
And the new brave eve pilots as well of course. (I am not referring to any entities ingame.)

But yes pay to win is always bad for any game.
Someone at CCP should just figure out how much skills it takes to get dreads or carriers skills to lvl 4
everything included reps cap transfer and siege/triage and cap it right there.Also do the same for the
industry aspect of the game try to find somewhere lvl 4 something something industry wise add it together
divide by two and theres your cap.

Well I know that there are many aspects of eve that I have not included it's an awsome game with lots of possibilities.
I read some of the forums and people who welcome this say that ah yes and still you can always go to the character bazaar and get a 200 + mill char instantly. I doubt it that someone who started playing eve yesterday has 150+ billion to buy these high skillpoints chars.

I welcome it with open arms if there would be implemented a cap for it.