EVE General Discussion

Please don't steer this thread to what PvE and PvP are, and what not. Most people don't know the terms and what they mean in EvE.

The biggest problem with most of these suggestions is how stupidly easy it is to game each and every one of these. Remember the old bounty system? People would go be the most annoying a-hat possible and borderline grief people (actual grief not imaginary grief) just to get people to put bounties on them. Then they'd have an alt kill them and bam, they'd get all the money. GG. Anything you'd try to add where PvE rewards would be dependent on direct PvP interaction would be gamed so hard it's rather amusing actually. And where you have the game 'matchmake' people you're taking away form the freedom of the sandbox. I mean really, COD in space?

PvE players don't want to PvP or they would be PvPing. However some of them may not be making an informed decision, as in they've never PvPed and never will but they might like it oh if only they'd try! So the solution should not be to force them to do something they don't want to, but to try and emulate or demonstrate the experience in a familiar setting. That way the experience is positive, as an example (not me personally, I pvp before burners) A player choses to take on more challenging PvE, aka burners for example, and in doing so experienced how OH works, how 1v1 or 1v3 frig combat works, how logi works, how points and scrams work, etc. They start understanding this big scary monster called PvP and see it's not all that scary and that it can be fun and exhilirating. Far more so than mindlessly grinding through thousands of slow, samey BS room after room after room, etc.

Then they can go and try stuff like FW and THAT experience will then be more positive because they now have a lot more tools at their disposal and more importantly knowledge on how stuff works. It's not a frustrating case of 'wait, why/how did I die'.

After all, why does it matter HOW someone got into PvP? Just so long as they get into PvP if thats the gameplay they like (even if they don't know it yet).

PvE will never be exactly like PvP, but they just need to get it close enough that people are willing to try actual PvP.

Exactly. And yet when CCP adds new PvE (Burners Drifters) they do so in ways that would force PvErs to PvP (wormholes, lowsec...).

Sometimes it's not that CCP doesn't does something, but that what they do doesn't makes sense from players perspective.

EVE is a pvp game. When a person who is a PVEr comes in to it, they should do so with this understanding. I embraced it the very 1st month I played, a guy came in to my cosmos mission and tried to steal my loot but I got there 1st. Luckily i was introduced to the game by another PVEr who understood the nature of EVE and so was warned about it before hand.

EVE PVE is and has always been for PVErs who aren't afraid of PVP or PVPrs. It's for people who not only want to fill an imaginary wallet with imaginary isk or fill a can with imaginary treasure, but also for PVErs who like to thumb their noses at PVP types while doing those things.

You problem isn't with CCP's version of PVE (which fits into their pvp/social interaction game called EVE), it's that you and people like you are incompatible with it and thus made a bad choose to start playing this game in the 1st place. Rather than face up to that choice, you lobby CCP to correct your mistake for you, by shifting the very nature of EVE PVE away from something that fits into EVE and towards something that would fit into some other game that isn't EVE.

On behalf of real EVE PVErs everywhere, i say "NO".

How do burner missions force you to go to low sec and wormholes to PvP?

I can kind of see the Low sec thing, some agents tend to send you to LS for burners about 90% of the times. However some agents never send you to LS for burners ever. My advice would to find an agent that wont send you to LS.

That said if the LS is quiet then there is nearly 0 risk in running the missions there. I did so for a good month+ and never saw a soul. LS is not insta death when you jump into system. Well, not most anyway :P

Regarding the Wormhole thing though, I think you are misinformed. burners cant send you to wormholes, ever.

EVE is not a pvp-only game, and if it were to become so, it would fade into a pale shadow of itself. WoT and such are nice pvp-only games, but they are cardboard cutouts when compared to EVE.

We say "EVE is real", but we forget what that means:
-there are wars
-there are farms
-there are 'cities' (busy places)
-there are 'countrysides' (quiet areas)
-there are police
-there are places without police
-there are 'safe' places
-there are 'almost-safe' places
-there are sheep, wolves and sheepdogs all at once in a tenuous balance
-there is, above all, a place for everyone, every playstyle - for without variety, we lose depth of experience for all of us


Many people in this thread have expressed a desire to remove or reduce that complexity. Indeed, CCP has done so over the years in the name of smoothing the learning curve.

We need high-sec to remain largely as it is - a safe haven for noobs, a place with some predictability, a place for older players to to rest in when they need a break, a place to easily build things so that they can go out and get blown up (although null needs some love here also!).

High-sec isn't just about keeping the sheep in the game until they turn into wolves - they can't and won't all make that transition.

High-sec could use a little help, but anything drastic will likely just confuse and confound the many people who live there that never read anything outside of the client. So I'd say to keep it relatively small.

My 2 isk

Facpo don't even have to be removed, just swap the facpo response/'legal target as a result of low sec status' criteria around.

Currently, as sec status drops, facpo start going after the pirate (-2.0 and they'll respond in a 1.0, -2.5 and they'll respond in a 0.9, and so on) and only at -5.0 will you finally become a legal target for all players to shoot.

Swap that round, players should be the first responders before NPC's get involved. Having npc's get involved first without player being allowed to doesn't mesh with what this whole game is about in my opinion. Swapping these round* would make it so that there is a sec status window (-2 to -5) where there is interesting content being had without overwhelming NPC's making it one sided. Hell, I'd stay in that window of sec status just for the content and fights.

*(and maybe fiddling with the costs of concord tags to entice pirates to hover in that window)

As someone who works in investment management, with the absence of regulation/required financial documents that are audited by a ruling authority, this would be pretty difficult to do.

EVE's economy is much, much 'free-er' than real life

Lapsus calami. Was meant to write "Drifters".