EVE General Discussion

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think highsec needs to be nerfed. More specifically, the amount of ISK you can make in highsec needs to be nerfed. I personally feel like incurisons are much too profitable (more so than nullsec ratting, and even null incursions) to be in highsec.

Throw **** at me if you want.

As one of the most stubborn and creative carebears in the forums, I will answer that question.

I want to keep doing what I've mastered in order to pursue goals I haven't mastered yet since the tools to build them don't exist.

So, in the short term, that's more missions. I will keep running them no matter the what, so new missions are necessary. I may be worng but I think missions creation tools were overhauled so they weren't a nightmare frorm ancient times, but in the case that mission system still is a godawful time sink that breaks the back and will of developers, maybe it should be replaced (same kind of content, go there shoot them, get monies) but developed in more sensible ways.

Yet, in the longer term, shooting NPCs should be a gateway to other stuff: influencing players who don't PvE, much as PvPrs can influence players who don't PvP, and "content generation".

EVE's selling point it's competition and player generation of content. Yet most people engage in activities who don't compete and don't generate content, and then they quit. Maybe, just maybe, if there was a gateway to compete and generate content from a PvE foundation, some of that people would keep playing the game in their way, but with CCP's goals.

The key is, some players will never shoot other players no matter how hard anyone tries. But maybe they will mess with them in less direct, adrenaline pumping ways.

Some kids box. Others play chess. Yet the EVE sandbox only contains fistfighting tools. This is the single thing that puzzles me most of EVE.

Competing missions would be cool. I like the idea that successfully completing objectives in your own mission would mess up the other guy's progression.

Another progressive thought is missions that enable/require PvP content. Why not a ganking mission, or a 'get x kills' mission? Or even head-to-head missions similar to duels or burner missions? Or even bounty-hunting?

Some really out of the box ideas could make missioning a logical step in the NPE by enabling head to head and teamplay content.

Edit.
CCP could even get players themselves to create missions/concepts for content. Save them alot of development time and effort and reward those who like to create.

I would make High sec more immersive. My opinion is that HS people don't play the game for the social side and they definitely dont play the game for pvp. They basically want a cool single player game within a MMO world. (which is probably why star citizen is so popular). The limit of pvp for High seccers is market pvp (which is probably fun i guess) and ganking (which for the gankee is likely not that fun)

- that means adding more CQ stuff, add some news videos people can watch on things happening in the game, add a trophy room to display achievements. (note this could also be cool for pvpers... I know id love to store some heads on spikes).

- a window that shows a zoomed in view of what their ship is shooting at. Missions are boring cause all people are doing is shooting at red x. If you had a window zoomed in on what you were shooting at it would be more immersive and cooler.

- I would add some more graphic stuff as well, like a hanger where industry people could see their ship or product being built.

- and finally.. make the ui customisable so all the pretty graphics of eve is not hidden behind layers of multi redundant UI. let players choose what elements of ui they need and let them hide the rest.

PvP and social eve is why I play the game so it pains me to say this but... The majority of HSecers are never going to get drawn into the low/WH/null social and pvp side of eve. They dont want it. All we do is force them out of the game permanently by trying to encourage them to go to other areas of space.

Honestly, burner missions is VERY much the right direction. Anyone running lv4 missions that have not done so yet need to look into burners.

I recently started working on Cal Navy standings for reasons(tm). Luckily I had enough Caldari standings to start straight away with Lv3s so grabbed a blitzing T3 and got my standings up to to do Lv4s again. This in itself was a nice change of pace and some of the missions can be somewhat challenging and/or frustrating if you're not face rolling them with a Mach. However once I hit Lv4s my faction standing obviously hasn't quite caught up with my corp standing so I can't just decline missions as per normal blitzing left and right.

Now here's the interesting bit. Being forced to do all those missions that I can't blitz and that I haven't run in over 2 months brought into focus not only how horrendously mind numbingly boring most normal lv4s are, but just how much burner missions have changed running lv4 missions in general and for me specifically. It's night and day. Every second of running a burner mission you're doing something, paying attention to something etc. especially if oyu want to maximise your profit. There's also the constant threat of making one mistake and losing your 100mill investment. It's not as much as say, a 700mill-1bill(or more) missioning BS but it still stings, just not enough for you to quit the game. It's a loss you can quickly recover from. The reward/risk formula feels almost perfect honestly, whereas normal lv4s the reward is kinda meh and theres NO risk short of you literally falling asleep. Heck even then there's fits for if you suffer from narcolepcy.

Basically it doesn't matter how many skillpoints you have or how shiny your fit, if you make one too many mistakes you're dead.

The engagement is the important part though. Yes, the missions are still the 'same', but thats ok because it requires your attention ever second of the fight, every fight. You have to monitor OH on your guns/hardeners/paint/scram/etc. or make sure your range is always right, or manage your drones from super aggressive ai or just keep launching sacrificial bait drones, keep cap charges going or remember to OH your ASB. It incorporates so much of what makes PvP fun and great while still keeping the predictability most hard core PvE players want. It's fast, stimulating and engaging.

More burners is not THE only answer, but it sure as hell is PART of the answer. Please keep making missions that require specialized builds and OH! And if you haven't tried them yet you are missing out big time.

There's plenty of challange and risk as you skill up fly to normal lv4 missions properly but as you said, it's only a year then what? what about everyone that is already over a year old and has good skills? Burners are there exactly when most people who do run lv4 missions start getting bored of them.

And actually they are one of the better attempts at PvE-PvP connections. The big one being they require OH to run effectively/semi-safely. No other missions require it. For a lot of mission runners they don't even HAVE thermodynamics trained. Just the fact that burners get people to train what has always been a PvP only skill in the first place and gets them to use it regularly and gets them familiar with it is MILES ahead of anything incursions has EVER done for PvE-PvP connections. There's also some fits that make use of scrams to shut of MWDs of the enemy ships for example. A lot of really good stuff.

Then theres the fact that burners are all Frigate/Cruiser only (so far). This is what the majority of small scale PvP happens in. The action is fast and intense, agian just like PvP.

Burner missions is the best thing that's happened to get PvE players to start playing and thinking like PvP players. It's a huge step in the right direction. Some PvE players will never ever PvP, there is nothing anyone can ever do about that. however there's a lot of PvE players that can and will PvP but the gulf between the two seems to big for them. This kind of incremental steps (that are totally optional btw, that's super important) is the right way in getting people comfortable with pvP mechanics and maybe get them interested.

It is most definitely Part of the answer.

The removal of concord effectively turns all of HS into LS but without being able to use cynos. It would so drastically change HS, and Eve really, that I don't know if Eve would survive. It's mindboggling to even suggest it. Go sit on jita undock and count the number of freighters that come and go. Now imagine 90%(more? less? does it matter?) of them not making it to where they're going or never reaching Jita.

Effectively remove almost everything on the market in Jita, Amarr, Rens, Hek, Diodixie and every other major and minor trade hub.

Also
- No more mission running in BS.
- No more doing anything in solo BS anywhere at all really.
- Mining? Hah.
- Every remotely popular station will have dozens of nados alphaing anything that doesn't have an instant undock day in and day out without any repercussion whatsoever.
- Station games? see above.
- Inties everywhere tackling everything that isn't nailed down. Hell I'd just find a freighter/orca/BS/miner/anything really and just tackle it with longpoint(s) turn on my MWD and orbit and go afk. What's the guy gonna do? I'm faster than his drones and he cant hit or tackle me.

That's just a tiny smidgen of a taste of what effect the removal on concord would have.

Somehow I don't think you really thought that through.

+1

The problem with high sec is that human beings live there lol. No matter what CCP designed high sec to be, players will come in, find their own niche, and then declare that niche to be the reason for that place to exist, ignoring some very simple facts.

Like the fact that guns still work in high sec, so thinking of it as 'safe' space was stupid to begin with. I find it funny that some people struggle with their native language so hard (most EVe players are English speakers) that they can't tell the difference beteen "HIGH Sec" (which exists) and "COMPLETE Sec" (which doesn't.

Ultimately, the players who live in high sec and thus rely on it's mechanics are the worst people to ask about high sec, they have a vested interest in high sec being what they want. A whole lot of people who live in high sec think they want one thing when the fact is, they don't really know.



+1 again.

It sticks in my damn craw to hear these people who really don't even PVE that much claim that CCP has ignored PVE. It's an outright and actual lie, hell from where I'm sitting (as someone who actually PVEs), CCP has stuff the game with more and more PVE at the expense of PVP and adding new features for years now. When I started there were missions, Belt Rats some complexes and exploration content, and COSMOS and that was damn near about it.

The people who complain about PVe are unrealistic dreamer types who think they know what industry professionals should be doing, while most have never had to create anything close to what CCP has to.

The funniest thing is that CCP did make all this new PVE they say want, most of the people begging for it would even use it (recreating the "Walmart Syndrome" in game), because PVErs don't want excitement (if we did, we'd be PVPrs), they want comfort and predictability.

This is why even with all these Drifters and sleepers and incursions and clone soldiers and new AI etc etc most of us who PVE are still running "stupid AI" Anomalies and missions created pre-2005, we choose to.

uuuuh no. I'd get concorded within what, 10sec in a 1.0 system if I sat in a nado alphaing everything on the undock, I'd get concorded before I was able to GO afk if I tried to point a miner (or anything) Most freighters make it through to Jita plenty fine, etc.

Actually removing concord would be the same thing as having every person in eve be a war target for every other person in eve all the time forever. Good way to get rid of war dekking amirite?

Does that sound like a good idea to you?

Or, EVE could radically change: remove PVE altogether, and reward PVP richly so it's self-sufficient. Give rewards to corps who declare wars or are declared against, give per-fight bonuses to all participants, etc. So what if people grind PVP instead of missions, so what if they "abuse" the system and "get rich". You're getting them to PVP in a PVP game.