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[Galatea] First batch of sov capture iterations

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Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#461 - 2015-08-19 17:05:32 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:

Is this really the fault of CCP, or the alliance leaders who blue up everything in sight and NIP the rest?


It's still CCP's fault, yes. It lies on them to incentivize conflict. If nullsec personal income weren't so lousy, people might find it worth fighting over more than Sort Dragon's wife, or other such personal dickery and flag waving.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Kystraz
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#462 - 2015-08-19 17:09:39 UTC
This sov iteration would be better if it also included the 5 LY jump freighter adjustment to encourage local production. That way if you wanted to troll space, you'd be encouraged to live and work near the space you wanted to troll, instead of just shipping everything in from Jita.
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#463 - 2015-08-19 17:09:46 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
Querns wrote:
Speedkermit Damo wrote:

There was nothing awesome about sitting in 10% TIDI, clicking your mods over and over again, wondering if they are going to to actually function.

There was nothing awesome about being sitting on a Titan for hours then told that fleet is cancelled yet again because the rallying cry of a certain alliance leader was "no fun allowed"


Considering your corp has only been in an Imperium alliance for 6 months, I call bullshit on this anecdote.


I bet you clowns think the sun revolves around you too.

I'm not sure I understand the accusation here.

A guy posting on a forum claims that he was part of "weaponized boredom" tactics and didn't get a fight. The Imperium is the most widely-known user of said tactics, and unless specifically qualified, the status quo demands that any mention of "weaponized boredom" automatically means "the Imperium."

However, curiosity leads towards the poster's in-game corporate affiliations, and lo and behold, the poster's corporation has only been in the Initiative for 6 months, which is well past the point where his anecdote could have possibly taken place. As such, the poster is outed as a storyteller and a liar, possibly with an agenda that bears little value to the conversation.

How does what you said and what I'm implying connect?

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
Speedkermit Damo
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#464 - 2015-08-19 17:10:44 UTC
Querns wrote:
Speedkermit Damo wrote:

There was nothing awesome about sitting in 10% TIDI, clicking your mods over and over again, wondering if they are going to to actually function.

There was nothing awesome about being sitting on a Titan for hours then told that fleet is cancelled yet again because the rallying cry of a certain alliance leader was "no fun allowed"


Considering your corp has only been in an Imperium alliance for 6 months, I call bullshit on this anecdote.


Call it what you like son, I and others have been in other corps and alliances.

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.
Icycle
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#465 - 2015-08-19 17:12:39 UTC
afkalt wrote:
Have the newbros kill them:

[Atron, newbro kill farming]
Overdrive Injector System II
Small Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
Damage Control II

5MN Cold-Gas Enduring Microwarpdrive
J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I
X5 Prototype Engine Enervator

Modal Light Electron Particle Accelerator I, CN Antimatter Charge S
Modal Light Electron Particle Accelerator I, CN Antimatter Charge S
Modal Light Electron Particle Accelerator I, CN Antimatter Charge S
[empty high slot]

Small Auxiliary Thrusters I
Small Auxiliary Thrusters I
Small Auxiliary Thrusters I



All Meta barring the OD (lol hull upgrades II) and the DC (lol hull upgrades IV).

4743/6781m/s with heat.

Feed the newbros delicious kills Smile


My point exactly. Heck you dont even need the tech 2 stuff. You can easelly do this with tech 1 only.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#466 - 2015-08-19 17:13:38 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Tallardar wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I agree, null has been stagnant, that's why we've all agreed that a change is needed. Unfortunately that change is seemingly an attempt to make it even less likely that a large scale battle will occur.


Right, except no one was close to doing that nor trying to for over a year before the sov changes came out anyway.


This is a bit inaccurate. "Fleet Fights" aren't just Asakai and BR-5 type deals, plenty of fleet fights involve only sub caps, and plenty happened over the coure of the last year. The Mittani website and EVE news detail those kinds of fights all the time.

I've been in only 2 mid sized scraps since Aegis began (one involving my old alliance INIT fighting my new alliance lol). And that's it, the rest have been "Aegis style bullshit Nibble fights" (that phrase shall be copyrighted soon lol). I still find it odd that (from my perspective as someone who likes fleet fights) CCP could take a system of occasional fair sized to big fights and make them less occasional lol.


Is this really the fault of CCP, or the alliance leaders who blue up everything in sight and NIP the rest?


CCP.

That "everyone is blue" thing has never been true, when I was in INIT and we were associated with HBC there was plenty to shoot, ,and people are shooting still. Of the two of us, I'm in the alliance with fewer blues,so if it was the fault of 'alliance leaders', those leaders are only enabled by YOU (line members who given alliance leaders power by existing).

Why would you complain about this while sitting comfortably in an Imperium Aligned group I do not know. It's a lot like protesting the burning of fossil fuels while owning a gas station.
Speedkermit Damo
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#467 - 2015-08-19 17:14:42 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Speedkermit Damo wrote:

I think resources need to be more scarce so people fight over them again. They also need to deplete over time. Moon-mining needs to cease to be an AFK activity.


No offense, but this is an extremely bad idea. Take the idea to it's logical conclusion.

Existing players are, in your opinion, too wealthy. So if you tightly restrict resources, those players will use their existing wealth and assets to lock down the newly scarce resources, and we'll be right back where we started, except the "have nots" are in an even worse position.


You're probably right about that.

However my point that Alliances don't fight because there's not really anything they need to fight over is valid I think. They have everything they need already.

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.
Tappits
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#468 - 2015-08-19 17:17:27 UTC
This is just a change for changes sake.

It does not address the problem of Why Would you attack some one,why would you Defend something

until something changes so the WHY is not a WHY its all for nothing.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#469 - 2015-08-19 17:20:38 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Speedkermit Damo wrote:

I think resources need to be more scarce so people fight over them again. They also need to deplete over time. Moon-mining needs to cease to be an AFK activity.


No offense, but this is an extremely bad idea. Take the idea to it's logical conclusion.

Existing players are, in your opinion, too wealthy. So if you tightly restrict resources, those players will use their existing wealth and assets to lock down the newly scarce resources, and we'll be right back where we started, except the "have nots" are in an even worse position.


You're probably right about that.

However my point that Alliances don't fight because there's not really anything they need to fight over is valid I think. They have everything they need already.


They don't fight because, for the few years, there has not been anything to fight over besides bragging rights, flag waving, various dickery, and irl grudges.

That's all sov has been, for the most part. And it's reached a critical mass where people are tired of fighting for trumped up reasons, and what do we do? We introduce jesus lasers, to add even more boring to something that is functionally pointless to begin with.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Speedkermit Damo
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#470 - 2015-08-19 17:21:19 UTC
Might be time for CCP to dust off that no-sov option they were looking at.

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.
Icycle
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#471 - 2015-08-19 17:23:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Icycle
Luckelly for us we dont have many blues and completelly surrounded by reds. We got more targets than we can shoot.
Maybe thats the secret to play the game and quit whining why no one will engage you?
Reset standing, get thousands of targets and get into a ship. Its your fault, not CCP.
Nobody wants blobs or TIDI. It destroys the game. In the old days this game had so much to offer cos there was no blue donut. Now its all about who has the largest coalition. Its perversed and I hope CCP mans up about it some day really destroys this blue blobs that has done nothing for the game but drive it to the ground Big smile
Mischa Gau'ss Tesla
The Night Watchmen
Goonswarm Federation
#472 - 2015-08-19 17:25:27 UTC
Orca Platypus wrote:
Now let's see another example of gewn tears we all love so much!

Mischa Gau'ss Tesla wrote:
From my point of view, fozzie sov has just been a miss for now:
Before it, taking a system was starting a war, putting major fleets, firepower, a lot of man and effort on taking big objectives. Taking a system was something, you had to fight for it... Now, people just come with one or two fast ships and orbit a sov structure 250k off... no fighting, no strategy, no effort.

1. Ummmm... have you tried that in, you know, system people actually live in?
And if you're not using that system, you don't need to own it. Working as intended.

Mischa Gau'ss Tesla wrote:
What i liked and still like in eve is it's variety, and a thing that has been removed by fozzie is the actual BIG part of eve, two (or more) alliances fighting in huge fleets to get control of space. This is the so called blobbing, which is, even if you don't like it, a way of playing. Small gang always existed in ganking, factional warfare,... big fight just tend to disappear, just like dread, titans and other carriers will become useless (which is a shame, fighting around those ships is interesting, the fact they need support fleets making giving the fight a great aspect and making coordination critical).

2. "BAWW NOBODY FIGHTS MAH BLOOB BLOOB"
Why don't you try deploying on someone's staging system and see if there'll be no major fight for it. Hint: gudfait in 3...2...1...

Mischa Gau'ss Tesla wrote:
Empires where build by man followed by a thousands, not by some lonely pilot orbiting in a system. People like TLOTR because of it's big epic fights, star wars because of the huge fleets fighting around the deathstar; and the efforts of Frodon and Luke were supported by a lot of lives, they did not just took the control by themselves!

Fozzie sov on an other hand offers good ideas, but in a bad way. If entosis was limited to the biggest classes of ships, if there were a risk to take to entosis a system then it could be good... fozzie sov just need to bring the meaning of war back to new eden, for now, it just takes the meaning of "run".

3. Frodo has captured the uncontested mt. Doom in 2v1 fight against Gollum, working as intended.
Fozziesov will be a war once alliances downsize to what they occupy. We'll come to burn Deklein then - and there will be a fight for every system in it. Unless you drop it like the fountain, that is.

Mischa Gau'ss Tesla wrote:
My suggestions:
- limit entosis to bigger ships (BC's ad over);
- bring back the fight, for example by giving "control points" when an ennemy entosis ship is destroyed, or just for destroying ennemies,... plenty of ideas can be used here, just think about it BEFORE releasing the new system...

What is bad in actual system:
- one lonely interceptor or recon can still entosis a system while being hard to catch... just because of speed and range;
- no fights for a system, in most of the case it is just a time attack;
- the actual system seems to not have been thought through...

Oh and before some whiners say it: yes, i'm from the imperium/cfc, and yes, I see blobbing as a way of playing, and yes, number is a force, that i think should be the most important in a mmo (MASSIVELY MULTIplayer online ;) ).

Ty for your reading! o7


4. Suggestions are just copy from the propagoonda and not worth reading.

5. But the tears! "qq we cannot use numbers qq give me ez numbers F1 win qq". I wonder what is stopping those number from spreading out and occupying all those systems to chase the trolls away and grind ratings? Can't handle the trollceptor?
Keep the delicious tears coming.


1. Yeah people tried to entosis some of our systems at the begin, and stopped because it was boring for everyone... even them. What some guys do now is coming to see if anything reacts, which we do not do every time, but when timer ends, if we come to defend we see noone coming or the lonely guy running cuz he can't do **** alone, just as before fozzie... so not working as attended.

2. Why would we attack, we got all territories we need... But don't worry, we might do it soon or later.

3. Frodo did this because the last stand of free races was diverting the eye from mt. Doom... and this last stand regrouped most of the free people's armys. Downsizing big alliances is a good idea, we did it by "dropping" foutain as you say, but well, come to us and fight, you could do it before fozzie, and fozzie does not encourage it.

4. Oh phoque, i'm not a goon and do not even read their forum posts most of the time... oh wwait, I fogot, all Imperium/CFC is goon, my bad ^^

5. I am just exposing the fact that it as no sense to promote a way of playing that just takes a trolling guy to "take" a system... I often go defend by myself with no fleet because there is no need to fight, those guys just run away... you are crying more than me over "goon blobbing everywhere", as a reminder (again) this is a multiplayer game, if you can't play as a team, well this is more of your problem :)

See ya in space with your ceptor o7
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#473 - 2015-08-19 17:29:41 UTC
Icycle wrote:
*yammer yammer*


Hush. I doubt even CCP fails to see past your self interested tripe. You're not going to convince anyone in the thread that didn't already agree with you, either.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Aurthes
Shadow State
Goonswarm Federation
#474 - 2015-08-19 17:34:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Aurthes
Its a good step in the right direction, but not nearly enough.

---

I do have some thoughts on getting players more engaged with the new sov system. MinigamesAttention

Why should we have to ALT-TAB out of game to play something else when maybe CCP could instead provide some mini-games that you could play with other members of your fleet?

While 1% of the fleet is doing entosis, the others could play

  • Poker - where you could gamble with ISK with other members in your fleet...maybe extend it to an in fleet casino
  • Eve Tanks - fleet is split in half and fights to last man standing
  • PacCommandNode - Pretend you could eat the big pill and instantly consume a node
  • Bonus Room
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#475 - 2015-08-19 17:40:08 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
Might be time for CCP to dust off that no-sov option they were looking at.




IMO this is what should have happened. In an interview fozzie said it came down to aegis-sov or "no-sov". Whatever coin they flipped was a bad coin.
Icycle
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#476 - 2015-08-19 17:49:16 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Icycle wrote:
*yammer yammer*


Hush. I doubt even CCP fails to see past your self interested tripe. You're not going to convince anyone in the thread that didn't already agree with you, either.


it was not about agreement, it was about fit. I was busy to make a fit. I tend to backup my statement instead of just spew something.
Tallardar
Doomheim
#477 - 2015-08-19 17:52:41 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Speedkermit Damo wrote:

Is this really the fault of CCP, or the alliance leaders who blue up everything in sight and NIP the rest?


It's still CCP's fault, yes. It lies on them to incentivize conflict. If nullsec personal income weren't so lousy, people might find it worth fighting over more than Sort Dragon's wife, or other such personal dickery and flag waving.


I agree with this.

Pandemic Horde Tutorial Videos | Monthly Nullsec Recap
Hendrink Collie
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#478 - 2015-08-19 17:53:24 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
Might be time for CCP to dust off that no-sov option they were looking at.




IMO this is what should have happened. In an interview fozzie said it came down to aegis-sov or "no-sov". Whatever coin they flipped was a bad coin.



Maybe we are all being rused and fozzie's plan all along was to make null into a no-sov system. The way to make us accept this was to roll out a system a vocal minority of players hate with a passion. Pirate

Then again, I'm open to this no-sov concept. Could be very interesting....
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#479 - 2015-08-19 17:54:53 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
here is the real issue I think.

Most alliances are not short or resources or isk. the biggest like PL or Goons have more isk then they know what to do with. Many vet players seem to be extremely rich.

I think resources need to be more scarce so people fight over them again. They also need to deplete over time. Moon-mining needs to cease to be an AFK activity.
How will making resources more scarce help? All that does is stop players without isk from making as much as those that already have too much.

Also, most of us haven't made our isk from null. The vast majority of the isk I've made has been from trading in highsec. I'd be unaffected by nerfs to nullsec income.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

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Arrendis
TK Corp
#480 - 2015-08-19 17:55:16 UTC
Warmeister wrote:
Skia Aumer wrote:


Diagnosis: OP.
Treatment: on top of suggested MWD-jamming feature of enthosis, maybe reducing its cargo and increasing strontium consumption on enthosis would do a trick. Tackling interceptor - yes, shuttle - yes, cyno-shuttle - no, sov-shuttle - no.

it's only OP when no one shows up to defend.
if someone did show up, all they need is an entosis module to successfully prevent ceptor from capturing sov.


Let's not be dumb here.

The first notification goes out when the 'warm-up' cycle finishes. The defender's entosis link doesn't actually start contesting the capture until its warm-up cycle has finished. So on a newly taken system, the defender will have...

4 minutes.

So you undock... and hope you don't tidi yourself... and now you've got 3 minutes, 40 seconds (just timed the undocking in a system w/no tidi and only 10 people).

warp time can be another minute.

2 minutes 40 seconds to react. Yeah. that's gonna promote fights.