These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Upcoming Feature and Change Feedback Center

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[December] Module Tiericide – Shield Rechargers and Others

First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Mikkir
SHINKETSU Inc.
#141 - 2015-08-20 18:41:59 UTC
I'll just join the chorus and and say that if I EFT a ship and it includes a shield flux or a shield recharger I know I did something wrong. The shield flux just don't pay off when you consider that max shield hp is so important so you don't get knocked past your max recharge point, and shield rechargers are just very weak for the bonus they provide and you should fiddle with your fit until you can get a hardener or another extender before using one.
Faelune
Tous Pour Un
#142 - 2015-08-29 13:03:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Faelune
All those modules consume too many capacitors and give light renforcement without counterpart.
Anyone who know how it works will choose the offensive way by fitting dps, and to skill the ship, to skill the hull and to skill the natural armor despite the shielding.
therefore the shielding is only good for all drones.

Some exception can be provide by some fregateers inside some records from burners missions. But it implies certificates 5 for all aspect of one type of fregate to finish the mission.
Surely not an example of usefullness for all time and space of combat from a random pilot
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#143 - 2015-08-30 11:47:59 UTC
Any idea when the tentative release date for these is?

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#144 - 2015-08-30 14:19:56 UTC
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:

Leading to (I speak for myself) me not using either. I always have something better to do with my precious mids than to fit a boost amplifier or a recharger -- in fact I'm hard pressed to find any free mids for tank so it boils down to either an ancillary booster or a shield extender. (active or buffer). I do not know where you guys find these free mids, but I'm looking at Scram, Web, Propmod and maybe a Tracking computer/Dampener/Whatever useful and unique module I fancy. MAYBE.

That's three - four midslots and I haven't even fitted ANY tank yet. With a bit of luck I have 1 more midslots for tank. Ancillary booster of course, or maybe a shield extender. Most certainly no regular Shield Booster because that would require a Cap Booster (also a midslot) for sure. MWD and tackle ate all my cap. And if I drop my EWAR module/tracking computer, I might even fit an adaptive invul.


[Lachesis, Heavy Tackle]

Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

Warp Scrambler II
10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
Pith B-Type Large Shield Booster
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Shield Boost Amplifier II

Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M

Medium Core Defense Capacitor Safeguard II
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II


Hammerhead II x5


Shut up and let the real men talk.

~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#145 - 2015-08-30 15:01:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Brokk Witgenstein
Your point? Fail lachesis is supposed to convince me of anything?



Edit: "fail" in the sense that your Recon is supposed to fit EWAR / bonused points. Yours does not. Obviously you have free mids under those circumstances -- because you're abusing the vessel's purpose.
Media freak
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#146 - 2015-08-30 15:28:17 UTC
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
Your point? Fail lachesis is supposed to convince me of anything?



Edit: "fail" in the sense that your Recon is supposed to fit EWAR / bonused points. Yours does not. Obviously you have free mids under those circumstances -- because you're abusing the vessel's purpose.



Warp Scrambler II


what's this then?
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#147 - 2015-08-30 17:14:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Brokk Witgenstein
Look, I'll humour you one more time. Guy links a recon, with lots of mids. Guy has a shortpoint - great. Don't we all? Did I not say so in my own post?

What I fail to see, is WHY he links this Lachesis, what he's trying to prove or what it has to do with anything.

Random guy was also rude in a 17 yo fashion, so I didn't feel a need to elaborate or put any genuine effort in replying. The fact he has to come up with a recon already proves the point: most vessels do not have sufficient mids to make use of multiple stacked shield modules to finally make it work. It took him no less than 4 (four!) mids to fit his tank, on top of a rig and a capbooster (another mid) just to resolve the cap issues. And this is supposed to invalidate my point about ancillary boosters? Did I not clearly state a regular Shield Booster almost certainly requires a Cap Booster as well? This man's post is supposed to invalidate the fact you need more than 4 mids to have any shield tanking options at all?

I didn't think so.

What I'm looking at, is an expensive close-range brawler -- with AB and no web I might add, so quite vulnerable to being tackled and shot by a T1 cruiser plus interceptor himself. I called fail at first glace and I call fail now.

He certainly sounds awfully sure about both his fitting skills and his manhood, but showing me a fit with 4-5 mids dedicated to tank, 2 rigs also dedicated to tank on a 200 mil recon to do a T1 cruiser's job only serves to illustrate the case I presented earlier. I guess I should thank him for that.
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#148 - 2015-08-31 20:42:04 UTC
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
Any idea when the tentative release date for these is?

It looks like CCP has dropped the ball on Module Tiericide.

There has been no dev response on this thread for 6 weeks, and it has been over two months since they supposedly started work on rebalancing shield rechargers et al. Even allowing for player feedback, this set of changes should have taken only a couple of weeks, at most, to finish up - it requires no code changes nor graphics changes; just a few simple changes to the database.

And, there have been no dev posts for Module Tiericide changes to other modules, afaik

I think that CCP needs a release schedule for Module Tiericide - there are a lot of modules in the game which still need work and CCP hasn't even gotten to the tougher ones yet. If they can't push out at least one set of Module Tiericide changes per each release, it is going to take decades to get done... if ever.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#149 - 2015-09-01 20:04:17 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
Any idea when the tentative release date for these is?

It looks like CCP has dropped the ball on Module Tiericide.

There has been no dev response on this thread for 6 weeks, and it has been over two months since they supposedly started work on rebalancing shield rechargers et al. Even allowing for player feedback, this set of changes should have taken only a couple of weeks, at most, to finish up - it requires no code changes nor graphics changes; just a few simple changes to the database.

And, there have been no dev posts for Module Tiericide changes to other modules, afaik

I think that CCP needs a release schedule for Module Tiericide - there are a lot of modules in the game which still need work and CCP hasn't even gotten to the tougher ones yet. If they can't push out at least one set of Module Tiericide changes per each release, it is going to take decades to get done... if ever.


They put in a new SOV system and made tweaks to it while going through the traditional vacation period. Could it possibly have affected the release of tiericide on some mods who are arguably in need of some redesign anyway?
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#150 - 2015-09-01 20:43:37 UTC
Since when is using a Lach as heavy tackle not using it's strengths? Last I checked it got a bonus to range on Warp Scram and Disrupters.
Media freak
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#151 - 2015-09-01 21:25:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Media freak
Estella Osoka wrote:
Since when is using a Lach as heavy tackle not using it's strengths? Last I checked it got a bonus to range on Warp Scram and Disrupters.



since he was trying to make a point. I mean that scram is only tackling things at 18km without links or OH. 21km with OH and 28 with links and OH.

I mean its guns only go out to 18km which is null including falloff.
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#152 - 2015-09-03 02:07:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Sizeof Void
Frostys Virpio wrote:
They put in a new SOV system and made tweaks to it while going through the traditional vacation period. Could it possibly have affected the release of tiericide on some mods who are arguably in need of some redesign anyway?

Not likely. Changes to shield rechargers et al would certainly not have any direct effect on the new FozzieSov system. And, unless the whole team went on vacation together for 6 weeks, that is probably not a valid excuse, either.

Technically speaking, Module Tiericide involves rather simple database changes. A single database programmer can typically implement these sorts of changes with a few lines of database code - not more than a couple of hours work, at most.

Also, Module Tiericide is not supposed to be about "redesign", but, rather, simply reducing complexity by removing unnecessary metas. Sure, there is going to be some minor rebalancing involved, but it isn't meant to be extensive or comprehensive - certainly, they have done absoultely nothing to address the continued worthlessness of many T1 meta 0 modules, in previous Module Tiericide passes, and have repeated stated that the tiericided modules will be revisited for rebalancing in the future. Thus, it is also unlikely that this particular pass of Module Tiericide needs extensively more redesign work and/or discussion.

I think it is much more likely that the devs who were supposed to be working on Module Tiericide were pulled off to do other work (or left the company) and, as a result, no one is currently working on it.

Which is why I said that it looked like CCP had dropped the ball on Module Tiericide.

I'd be more than happy to see a response from a dev to prove me wrong, along with a release date for this round of Module Tiericide changes and a rough schedule for the rest of Module Tiericide. :)
Tyranis Marcus
Bloody Heathens
#153 - 2015-09-05 21:26:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Tyranis Marcus
I have to say, I was really opposed to module tiericide from the beginning. Everything about it.

Now that I've finally gotten in some decent playtime, reworked some old fits, and made up some new fits, I really like what you guys are doing.

Not sure how it affects the newbro market, but from where I'm sitting things are looking pretty nice. The meaningful options that were mentioned are definitely there.

And...with that, the loss of the old names doesn't even really sting, anymore.

Do not run. We are your friends.
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#154 - 2015-09-06 08:32:14 UTC
The fact that these changes didn't ship with Galatea suggests that CCP is rethinking these modules and we'll likely see more than minor tweaks to the stats.

I consider this a good sign but think they should release the power relays in Vanguard and set the Flux Coils and Rechargers aside while they try to figure out a legitimate role for them.
Faren Shalni
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#155 - 2015-09-06 09:12:30 UTC
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:


What I'm looking at, is an expensive close-range brawler -- with AB and no web I might add, so quite vulnerable to being tackled and shot by a T1 cruiser plus interceptor himself. I called fail at first glace and I call fail now.

He certainly sounds awfully sure about both his fitting skills and his manhood, but showing me a fit with 4-5 mids dedicated to tank, 2 rigs also dedicated to tank on a 200 mil recon to do a T1 cruiser's job only serves to illustrate the case I presented earlier. I guess I should thank him for that.


D-scan immunity, bonused scram range, tech 2 resists, better sustain tank and reasonable Dps

Plus a knowledge of where said pilot flys I can tell you this is a gank lach for w-space. In this situation he needs to take on the target (he would probs utilise a warpin to get into scram range) and the sleepers on grid, which can be upwards of 700dps in a C3 just from the site

Asb would not have enough sustain to keep the lach alive to allow him to kill the target or hold on long enough for backup to arrive. A buffer tank would fair even worse.

In the scenario that he would use this ship damps would have no use, a web would have use and there is argument to have one but his choice is perfectly acceptable.

No a t1 cruiser could not do this job, a ceptor maybe but it's harder, the main advantage is the dscan immunity so the target doesn't know you are there until he is on grid. (We used to use arazus for this but the lach does it better)

(Omg I can't believe I'm sticking up for trinkets)

So Much Space
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#156 - 2015-09-20 01:06:40 UTC
Thats because you looked at it (maybe even looked that i have used it - and to great effect) and used your logics. Brokk just assumes that spending 4 slots on tank is bad. Believe me, we have tried tackling rattlesnakes with cruisers, and there's not much at all besides the Lachesis which does this job as well as it.

~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
Chance Ravinne
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services
WiNGSPAN Delivery Network
#157 - 2015-09-20 20:37:03 UTC
I'd like to see tiericide move forward, just hoping it will be soon.

You've just read another awesome post by Chance Ravinne, CEO of EVE's #1 torpedo delivery service. Watch our misadventures on my YouTube channel: WINGSPANTT
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#158 - 2015-09-20 20:40:57 UTC
I think they have been sidelined. Unfortunate. At this rate it will take literally years. The current mixture is confusing for new players.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#159 - 2015-09-20 22:39:18 UTC
Chance Ravinne wrote:
I'd like to see tiericide move forward, just hoping it will be soon.

Did this come up at the summit at all?

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#160 - 2015-09-21 00:04:11 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
god, can you get to the actual relevant modules like turrets, tackle mods, ewar? who actually cares about these.

or forget the whole thing and do some ship rebalancing, stuff that'll actually fix the game.

no kidding. these bearing changes are about 5 ************** years to late.

Amarr Militia Representative - A jar of nitro