Market Discussions

Motie people are still putting newly introduced plex onto the market. Players are still obtaining and consuming plex. Players holding onto plex - does not stop others from introducing new plex into the game. There is no shortage of PLEX being consumed and leaving the economy as many 'wealth reserves' were converted into aurum to pick up skins; to make use of power of two promotion etc.

Within this thread exists testimony of players purchasing and putting plex into the market. The volume of PLEX trading hands is large; there is a healthy amount in circulation for this time of year. PLEX is a player produced comodity; it only enters the eve universe when an individual pays a premium in real world currency for it to enter the market.

The demand for plex is ever increasing as EVE ages and its price in part correlates with this demand. Your disatisfaction with other players sometimes dealing with plex in a fashion you deem outside of its expected usage; does not change any of these facts.

Explain the link between a variable amount of plex being stored and how you feel CCP must intervene. I am having trouble following the jump. For what reason do you feel plex which is not in circulation is affecting anything when it does not exist as far as the market is concerned? Is it that you are concerned players are paying more for plex than they might have if all existing plex were available to the market at all times until consumption? If so; of what matter is it if PLEX costs more so long as players are still buying it?

Your theorized case of people quitting is not supported by any statistics. Every year players complain about the winter prices of PLEX- Every year the doomsayers suggest they will quit the game - In reality what appears to happen is they shed extra weight (unsub alt accounts) and resub those accounts as ISK and conditions permit. What does however happen is more players discontinue subbing via PLEX and instead pay for their subscription via credit card which allows CCP to realise any potential profits sooner rather than later (which is the case with consumables gamers purchase whose real world costs are not realised until the consumables are actually consumed).

Simply put; I don't agree that players are quitting in droves due to ISK cost of plex. I don't think CCP is losing any money with plex being 1.2B as opposed to say 300m. Should you be able to better support a link between damage being done to the game and the amount of plex being stored than one previously mentioned idea might be of some value. As far as bubbles are concerned; I will repeat once more

Plex goes up and down throughout the year. over a period of multiple years plex rises, the demand for plex has increased each year (CCP stated such). But no; plex will not die; there are yearly variances in price but it will always go up until a point where which the game dies.

You're attributing a loss of concurent players to PLEX which is simply not true. Phoebe; Sov and various forms of bitching have lowered concurent players in the cases where players are actually leaving the game- in other cases people are cutting the fat until a time where which they find use in their alts and sub them again. The game has undergone massive changes which fundamentally completely change the way the game is played. People left because they were unhappy and because when your friends quit - you quit. When you've had your group for several years and people leave; you leave too because you are left with nothing. Those players may or may not return; but PLEX will hardly have anything to do with it.

Please tell me how any human being, in their right mind will use their reserves to keep alts or multiple training going, on a regular basis! At the current vastly inflated value of plex.

Because most people are rational.
The actions are as we witness.
Yes, they cut the fat.

And there is no guarantee, those alts, that training, or those people will suddenly discover their mothers credit card.
People reasonably will pay for their mains, but their alts? Hibernated. And all the extras that people get tempted into paying for them, is lost to CCP

And do not ignore human nature, each month, people consider, "is this worth playing?" "Is it worth playing for?" "Do I need this industry/scanning alt?" Now Plex available for a sensible amount of isk, will get them over that hump, let them keep going until they have a good day, plex at 40 hours grinding for some, Just to dual train, or keep an alt alive, does not exactly encourage them to hang around. " Good riddance " I read players saying " We didn't want those lightweights anyway? " " no poors! Others earn 300million an hour! Plex is cheap! Buy now or Get out!" Whilst such ideas are intended to support the price pumping of Plex I think that CCP's accountants might just disagree.

Let me repeat, Pilots services, as a class are different to every other commodity in Eve, their existence is existential to the prosperity of CCP and they will not permit them to be manipulated and distorted either deliberately or through misunderstanding their nature as a tool intended to be redeemed , indefinitely. To think otherwise assumes stupidity on behalf of CCP, and to believe they are incapable of acting in both their own best interests and the health of the game.

If this affects peoples ability to pump and dump, there will be little sympathy.

For whatever reason you cannot understand PLEX is worth more than 1.2B isk. its your inexperience and towards matters regarding economics; demand and any number of related facets. As such you are in for a very dissapointing time with EVE - because what you want - is not going to happen period

Plex will rise year in and year out and will not cease to rise on a yearly basis until the game dies. Your unsupported bubble theory where the sky falls because plex is at a value more than its worth - is ridiculous. Its price is within normal bounds for this year. Rises in winter; Falls in summer. Its not the housing bubble; its not tulips its not the credit crunch. This is EVE love it or hate it.

*Snip*, please remain civil when posting towards all members of the eve community - ISD Atomic Dove

sic:

"You are dealing with people; some of whom have studied EVE onlines economy for several years. Still others believe the sky is falling and will say to all doom is here and the world will surely crumble. You are combating an economy which has been molded over a decade - with little to no knowledge or experience in the area and an inability to seperate our world from the real world. If the real world suffers economic collapse; it recovers. If EVE suffers collapse it ceases to exist as it can no longer make payroll.

The ideas you have forumulated are very short sighted and based on a lack of understanding of EVE - I can see you don't have the knowledge; experience or dedication the EVE staff consists of. your 101 course might be the beggining of a life of knowledge and attunement in the way of real world economies and you will likely pick up bits along the way which would allow you to better understand our economy - but a decade from now you will laugh at your self and what little you knew and how shortsighted you were. I am not saying you need to complete your doctorate before you comment; but realise you are competing against doctoral level knowledge of real world professionals. You no doubt know of EVEs fame and its reliance on economists - on world renown economists whose work here is well regarded and respected.

If you want to tackle the issue at least think about it for a few months for a few hours each day; because you are fighting a school of thought which it was built on; that studied the economy every day for just short of a decade. A paid professional in the field whose work was EVE; whose joy was EVE - whose life was EVE. If you want to present ideas; present ideas that work in eve and cut the rhetoric. Whatever you do; don't cite examples from last semester; last year or what you picked up paying attention in class. Because they don't support your ideas or oppiniions. Use good quality sources that are relevant - cite other occurances in EVE; in video games.

Tulips are the first page in the book of a different genre; try the last page - read that; than read the series on EVE; the volumes and collections - than read the work of Dr. Eyjolfur - Study EVE s economy and than come up with an idea. I am getting caught up in the lack of any relevant idea and the bad examples which do not demonstrate or assist your points - not the price of plex.

You are new to our game; Our Economy; I don't hold that against you - I hold your short sigtedness and inappropriate citing of sources against you. They don't forward your oppinion and exist as nothing more than gradeschool rhetoric. You should at least take a course on EVE before trying to fix or bankrupt it.
"
*Snip, please do not distribute personal or privileged information from another player, those types of actions are highly frowned upon. -ISD Atomic Dove

Good Evening,

While the subject of and resulting situations occurring with an inflated P.L.E.X. ISK price comparative to historical prices are certainly interesting please remember to remain civil upon this forum in your interactions with one another.

Debate each other points away, but remember that there are still rules to guide interactions so that everyone can have an enjoyable environment.
I have gone through and removed some inappropriate comments and made some general housekeeping for this thread

Keep it classy in here guys.

You missed the bit where I said there is no right price, there is either a good rate of conversion right through the system from entering the game to redemption or there is not, the price will settle so long as tere are no blockages such as wealth storage or manipulation of the item.

When the rate slows to levels where plex is only redeemed as a secondary item and is mainly used for other uses, THEN action needs to be taken. If the rate if redemption is active and healthy and a majority of use relative to the total in system, Then it can be 1,3,5,100 billion, it doesn't matter.

So there is no right price, it varies according to need, if this is manipulated by player behaviour, then a balancing force needs to be applied

Well, If you cannot see that pilots services are different from the wider economy, then there is not much to say, If you believe that even the most right wing economies on the planet do not have some checks and balances on essential services, then I guess that the FED should just be sold to Goldman sachs, together with the documents signing you over officially as a serf to exploit?

That'll take care of those meddling socialists!

I have not unsubscribed because of Fozzie Sov, in the contrary I like it with some tweaking here and there. The People that are crying like babies about it are specific groups, who cannot dominate as they used to and the extremly biased reddit congregation, which is a direct projection of the former and their spin.
BUT I have cut down an alt account due to plex prices. I am not spending any unnecessary ISK on the market anymore to have more potential buffer for my main account if the manipualtion is going on further. Does that tell you something? And no! I am sure not the only one wo needs to act like this.