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Dev Blog: Long-Distance Travel Changes Inbound

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Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#1621 - 2014-10-01 22:30:31 UTC
Komi Toran wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Gilbaron wrote:
Quote:
Yes, caching is going to be something of a thing, but the amount of caches you need to get good coverage of the bulk of the cluster is large (somewhere on the order of 1 per region), and the effort involved in restocking them is distinctly non-trivial.


It's cute how you think that we can't/wont do that.

This is nothing but a massive nerf to attackers. I have always been a fan of your game design ideas and decisions. But this is complete and utter bullshit that goes exactly in the opposite direction of where things should go. We need things to attack that are not sov. Not reasons to not attack anything at all.


We know you *can*, if you apply yourselves. The intent is that you will find that you don't *need* to and you actually don't *want* to either.

Oh, rest assured, players will not *want* to. Just as players do not *want* to take a high SP-character, spend 120 Billion ISK, and then lock it away in a POS for the rest of its existence. Just as players do not *want* to manually fly a freighter from Metropolis to Jita and back again. Just as players do not *want* to grind anomalies day-in, day-out to make ISK. Players do a lot of things in this game they do not *want* to do, and they do them because it allows them the capability to do what they actually *do* want to do.

If caching is advantageous, then it will be done, whether players *want* to or not. And the non-trivial nature of it makes it all the more attractive, as an organized logistics train will still make it feasible, even easy, for a large group to maintain supply. Smaller groups simply won't have the infrastructure to compete.

Simple fix would be to make the fatigue apply to the ships crew, or the ship itself also.
Mijou Star
ICE is Coming to EVE
Goonswarm Federation
#1622 - 2014-10-01 22:30:41 UTC
CCP Stand Strong with your self... I Love The Changes... Just like so much Lol


Also the crying that is going on is lovely too.
Lady Spank
Get Out Nasty Face
#1623 - 2014-10-01 22:30:48 UTC
Shadow' Broker wrote:
Dear CCP;

Can I have the Skillpoints refunded for training Jump Drive Calibration 5. Please?

OopsOops You have robbed me of 2+ Months subscription which I have payed with my Credit Card.OopsOops


If the only thing you did in two months is increase your skillpoints then that is your own problem.

(ಠ_ృ) ~ It Takes a Million Years to Become Diamonds So Lets Just Burn Like Coal Until the Sky's Black ~ (ಠ_ృ)
Carribean Queen
Vadimus Quarrier Works
#1624 - 2014-10-01 22:30:49 UTC
Welcome To EVE Online, Cyno Alt Subs Online.
Nazri al Mahdi
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1625 - 2014-10-01 22:31:09 UTC
Min Mar wrote:
I'm sorry to say that you are (once again) penalizing the small entrepreneurial groups with your changes and it's going to kill the game.

My current JF route is slightly over 30 LYs and requires 3 jumps with maximum skills. As I understand it, I am now going to need seven (7) jumps to get to my destination, aside from cool down timers. Please do not tell me to use gates, that is simply absurd since I can't have a subcap fleet with me every time I need to bring fuel/supplies back to null.

I am sure there are many pilots who have to jump even longer distances with JFs and while I understand your logic for trying to slow down bat phone deployments, this change will impact the average null bear in a detrimental way for the game. Why are JFs being penalized in the same way as SCs or caps?

I am afraid that if this change goes through as announced, I'll be looking for something else to do with my spare time. It was fun while it lasted.

You're a logistics pilot. Stop pretending it was ever fun at all. Now, supplying Drones will be impossible at best and torture at worst.
Joshua Milton Blahyi
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1626 - 2014-10-01 22:31:43 UTC
Heat-seeking Moisture Missile wrote:
Knerf wrote:
Sooo basically every major alliance will pick their entrance system to live in so they are close to resources. Any alliance that wishes to have sov has to get past those powerhouses hugging high sec?


definitely a concern.


Take WH's behind them. Make them jump to deal with your moderately sized fleet.

Then attack the staging system while they are stranded with timers.

After these changes they can't be everywhere at once. Make them choose what to hold, take what they won't or can't defend.
Kenneth Skybound
Gallifrey Resources
#1627 - 2014-10-01 22:32:00 UTC
Schmell wrote:
Quote:
The length of this timer is a number of minutes equal to your jump fatigue (before being increased by that jump!), and you are unable to make another jump of any kind until this timer expires.


Can you clarify this please? Does that mean that if i take a jumpbridge with any ship, i will be unable to jump through gates, or this "jump of any kind" is only about jumpdrives/bridges?


You can ALWAYS jump through gates under this system.
Sparith Jeda
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1628 - 2014-10-01 22:32:06 UTC
We wanted change and here it is. I think this will be great for breaking up nullsec and encouraging local/smaller conflicts that don't involve everyone on the map. But we are EVE players and no one knows what we will do with what CCP gives us until they do so only time will tell.

Props and thanks to CCP for not being afraid to do whats necessary. I just hope you aren't conned by the player base into adjusting the changes too much.
Brian Cohen
Brian Cohen Mining Corp
#1629 - 2014-10-01 22:32:48 UTC
Is this a joke?

Does CCP really want null-sec dwellers to play Elite - Dangerous?
Or would they rather them play Star Citizen?
One thing they won't be doing is renewing their subs / aquiring Plex to play EvE.

Maybe CCP have found a tax break in a loss making game and are trying their hardest to reduce their revenue to claim it.
Or they're trying really hard to reduce server load.

It's only going to end in tears.
Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#1630 - 2014-10-01 22:32:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Arsine Mayhem
Octoven wrote:
Force projection IS the catalyst for many large scale engagements, the problem you are running into CCP is not that there are too many large fights and not enough smaller ones, its that you keep making changes like this and forcing vet players out of the game. Well mathematically when you reduce number of players that equals LESS SMALL ACTION!



Large fights? When was this. You're all carebears, and have everyone blue or treaties.

You don't need to jump your capitals because you don't use them.

I like tears though,
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#1631 - 2014-10-01 22:32:58 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
MASSADEATH wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:


Ok fine....if they are willing to pay you just for the right to farm, with no involved force projection or protection, then you can carry on. But I think part of the expectation of renters is that the sov holder takes action to make the rented area safe, including hotdropping when necessary. The goons definitely made defense fleets to hunt down MOA. These changes make it a lot more painful to move around, and will at the very least force the renters to more actively protect themselves, putting downward pressure on the rental fees, and somewhat financially harming the large nullblocks.


We use fast cruiser gangs, if someone tries to take sov we deploy the main fleets. This isn't going to be hard to adapt to.



AND ohh noos the locals drop a carrier fleet on you.....since they are local and you all die... sound familiar ? It should...its what you do to us everytime we catch a good target....




Exactly. Now instead of being able to scramble the full Goon fleet on top of you within 5 minutes, they will need to fight you with whatever they have locally and some fast warping cruisers. If you plan it out and have some big ships on the scene, you will actually have the heavier firepower in the engagement. Instead of the Goons being able to project their entire fleet into each system, they will need to learn to fight back with a limited local defense fleet.


Nope, defense fleet forms, warps to Titan, jumps to ratter cyno BECAUSE RATTER IS IN RANGE.

Nothing changes except the guys trying to attack the big guys have trouble calling in THEIR back up when things go boobs up (like the epic battles of the past).
Leon Anneto
Northen 96.
#1632 - 2014-10-01 22:33:04 UTC
stop changing what already works . this is by far the stupidest thing and better be a joke. R.I.P EVE
Aleks Cave
TheAuthority
#1633 - 2014-10-01 22:33:12 UTC
Ok, lets try some brighter topics:

The Nazis: Fact of Fiction?
Nazri al Mahdi
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1634 - 2014-10-01 22:33:45 UTC
Zalzakk wrote:
Please give jump freighters same treatment as you gave to black ops, dont nerf their range because it hurts small groups more than large.
THIS!
Ehud Gera
Wildcard.
Boundary Experts
#1635 - 2014-10-01 22:34:13 UTC
Amyclas Amatin wrote:
Zalzakk wrote:
Please give jump freighters same treatment as you gave to black ops, dont nerf their range because it hurts small groups more than large.


ANY change aimed at "making life hard" for a large well organized group will hurt smaller groups more.


But changes that make having a large well organized group impractical make more space for smaller groups to exist and thrive.

It seems CCP is not trying to Nerf big groups like all the GSF and PL tears are crying about. They're trying to make it less attractive and less possible to BE a big group that is sprawled across space so that small groups can actually exist in Null SOV.

Not that i'm against JF's retaining their current range and keeping Jump logistics possible. Just saying that I think you're bending this to make the overall change look bad for small groups when it's really not.
Schmell
Russian Thunder Squad
Against ALL Authorities
#1636 - 2014-10-01 22:34:46 UTC
Oh well, another thing just came up.

Apparently you can now roam with carrier, like nidhoggur, which makes around 500m/s on mwd, and with proper fit and implants can warp at 3.89 au/sec (which is higher than warp speed of CRUISERS, not even mentioning lovely handicapped battleships). How the hell you are supposed to counter that in SMALL scale engagements?
Soridar Ravencroft
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1637 - 2014-10-01 22:34:46 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
ArmyOfMe wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
ArmyOfMe wrote:
Alp Khan wrote:


"Implemented a plan to change EVE Online from a MMO game to a full-time job for players, crashed subscriptions numbers which resulted in EVE Online getting shut down."

So far the only thing that has crashed sub numbers in this game is caused by a giant blue donut..... But yeah, i guess goons feel the need to blame ccp for that one as well.

Not a single **** was given to the ammount of goon tears in here.


Just to point out, this change just gave us a huge advantage.

Not sure if you'r actually beliving what Mittens have been telling you guys, or if you, unlike the rest of the guys in your alliance just has way less understanding of how things work, but it seems a lot of eve is willing to prove you wrong.


We dont depend upon our super fleet. From the moment this hits our massive subcap numbers and deployment of our sigs across our empire will show.


For all of those with short memories or just the clueless, brief statement of historical fact...

Until B-R goons where considered mostly a subcap armada with poor cap skills and a poor and untested supcap force with no balls to use them.

So if you think taking goons caps away scare us...(sorry laughing)...you are in for the same steam roller that has hit every other power that thought they could face the swarm.
Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#1638 - 2014-10-01 22:34:59 UTC
Leon Anneto wrote:
stop changing what already works . this is by far the stupidest thing and better be a joke. R.I.P EVE


N3 tears - best tears.

We always see goon tears.
Mr Omniblivion
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1639 - 2014-10-01 22:35:00 UTC
Also- CCP should have just removed EWAR immunity to supers and let everything else stay as-is. That would be a better change overall than this implementation.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#1640 - 2014-10-01 22:35:09 UTC
Mijou Star wrote:
CCP Stand Strong with your self... I Love The Changes... Just like so much Lol


Also the crying that is going on is lovely too.


it will be...once you folks realize what really happened after you suffer the bad affects you thought others were about to suffer lol.