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I'm all with ya bro - Someones got to spake truthz to Power!

And who knows maybe the sheeple will start to wonder that maybe the bull their being feed isn't as great as they were told it was?!

Null needs fixes 4 sure... but this is one developer trying to make EVE 2 within a live game - and that's Vitleysa!

I seem to remember that being from mostly pubbies, but whatevs.

yes and if they don't like our comments they will just remove them.

way to go lets hear it for censorship !

300 pages will we see 300 pages today?


Good God.


Well at the least, CCP surely hit a nerve.


And there is so much protesting that it's making me wonder if the status quo might have been too comfortable and too easy for too many.

Still, "jump fatigue" strikes me as arbitrary and "magical" as the SOV mechanics themselves.


For the love of God, just let all ships warp around without gates and dump all SOV mechanics. If we are going to shake things up with arbitrary "magic", then let's go Full Monty. The proposed changes are half baked in the wrong direction. Limiting the reach of nullsec assets is the wrong way. Maximize the reach of everybody instead.

Don't let the door hit you in the vagina on the way out.


Seriously, getting across the entire universe in like 4 minutes is stupid. These changes are ******* awesome.

My small alliance's operations are effected severely by this change. We're going to have to give up moons (we do have a few moons of lesser value in NPC space) since our JF pilots are going to have a tough time reaching them. Our capitals can't jump like they used to. We're a small alliance this isn't the end of our world. We can adapt to this.

The problem is there are aspects to this change that simply aren't thought through and those are what is hurting my alliance the worst. We're a Black Ops based Alliance. We use Black Ops for both PvE (Prospects are amazing null sec gas miners) and PvP. Personally I've trained 8 characters across 4 accounts to light Covert Cynos. We have max skill black ops bridging characters. Other players have altered training paths to do black ops work and fly recons and light covert cynos themselves.

Its taken a significant amount of time for our small alliance to get to this point, and now we're essentially being told that you should do something else. We're not N3 or the CFC or even the CVA. We don't have the numbers to adapt on a dime.

If these changes stay as is for Black Ops, the fleet can only bridge out and back once with 0 fatigue before delays. I can't tell if anyone in the fleet has more than 0 fatigue to even try to manage it as the FC. This change removes our entire play style. It'd be like CODE losing HS ganking or Marmite finding out they can only wardec one alliance at a time for us. My alliance has to completely re-specialize and at this point personally I'm not certain I'm willing to.

Tears or not, with no changes what is the role of the black ops BS and black ops fleet ships (bombers/recons) after this change? Are we getting SP reimbursement for Cyno 5? Jump Portal Operation on non titan trained characters? Are black ops going to get other unique abilities to make up for the nerf, or are we getting a tank upgrade so they can stand toe to toe with T1 line battleships? This is what I mean about changes not being thought through. Theres no role for an entire class of ships now.

With changes how many bridges/jumps can I expect to make in a day? a week? I'm not against stricter planning on ops but right now its more planning my Black OP (singular) for the week/month.

I like the changes coming in play. I might be one of a few but I'm all for making space larger. Making getting from point a to point b take longer. Make Jita less important and make living in null more remote. Allow new alliances a chance to attack renter space and be able to take it because we pvp pilots will be damned if we have to fly 45 jumps through gates in dreads to save renter isk we never see. I wanna see renting end. I wanna see battle and fights matter more. I wanna see more isk farming and carebearing happening closer to home so when I roam a fleet I got stuff to kill. I wanna 30+ people in most system I travel though in null.

Its a harsh nerf bat to the balls with the logi side. Maybe a mod for JF and Rorquals to give them an extra LY of jump range would be nice. But overall whats happening in other regions greater then 50 jumps from me should be of no concern. I wanna focus on protect my boarders and playing this game...............It is a game........

Shin

To add to the bandwagon unsubbing here... carrier/dread pilot for a couple years now... Already stripping down all my caps and getting ready to resell in null. Check your local markets. And yea, unsubbed 8 of 9 accounts. I'll unsub this one once I get done selling all my now useless caps.

Because no one wants to sit there staring at the fatigue bar, unable to defend what was established, or even change alliances and bring your key selling factor/merc support platform through space when you will be forever going "Why are we only going 25mph in a 65mph?"

Also, did anyone even think of how badly you've now screwed over mercs?

It's interesting that a large corporation is stating (in the painfully dry dissertation quoted below) 'This will make us even stronger, therefore I'm in complete disagreement.' The truth is that this will shatter the power blocs that exist. If there is only one attack, on one front, at one time, then yes caches of ships will work as an effective defense.

But multiple attacks, on all fronts, all of the time, and well, a fleet can't be everywhere at once. FCs are not a dime a dozen, and competent FCs will be slim pickens for multiple theaters of war. Smaller fleets, inexperienced FCs, different enemies on all sides and there is a word for that...surrounded.

Small corps and alliances WILL be able to carve out a segment of null as their own, and battles like Akashi (or whatever the system was) will be replaced by small, constant, skirmish warfare, with the occasional constellation grab. Blue donut, enjoy the reign while it lasts.

-D
****Start Dissertation here***

• CFC/PL/{whatever big enough} tears, cry more! etc
• This has to be awesome, if so many nullsec coalitions are so pissed! We will kill them all and take their space.

Well, at least the last point - that's not going to happen. Why? A lot of ppl probably don't realize this is boosting the defending site even more. Now has the defender the upper hand, after this release.. a lot of null sec regions will turn into fortresses extremely hard to conquer...

Because of the nerf of the jump range, it will be much easier to get defending cap fleets to the battle. While the attackers will need to travel large distance in most of the cases.

The attacking side will need much more effort to bring their fleet into the fight. They will probably need to stage closer exposing themselves to the defending site, which can annoy them more conveniently their staging system:

Example: CFC is now under attack. Attackers are staged in Tartoken. They can pick time when to bridge to our territories and they are safe at Tartoken, because it is low sec, it is quite far away and it would be extremely boring to camp nearby system and it would take significant effort to do that.

After the update, they will need to go closer to get to our home system quickly enough to not give us time to do the large formup preventing them to do their job. And then they will need to travel by gates in our territory WO ability to hit us instantly where it hurts.

... but... but ... It will be harder to keep your large empires running!
Yes, this is true. The logistics is already boring... because we need to transfer huge amounts of stuff. But we will do it, it will be just "Extremely annoying 101". Probably more JF alts will be required -> more accounts. It could be CCPs intention to boost their income from subscription fees.

But your capitals will be limited considering the distance they can jump!
Yes, it is again true. But there are many options for nullsec coalitions with huge income to bypass that simply by creating caches of ships... more jump clones... etc. In fact, this update is significantly increasing their importance. We don't need to be afraid of getting hotdropped so we can safely deploy caps to the fights while having an eternity to get them safe if needed - before the enemy cap fleet will get even half the way to us.


I think that this change will only help to preserve the current status quo. Large coalitions won't attack themselves in the full scale war because the attacking side would risk losing its regions when staged on the other end of the map - or they will need much more effort to keep them safe while being staged.

The small guys will be just beaten to death when trying to attack.


It takes really a long time to train character to fly them effectively, so a lot of guys will be mad about it. Some SP reassignment after all planned changes will be announced would be probably handy. So this pilots would have an option to get rid of their cap skills and use them as they wish. - - It would be fair if presenting so significant nerf.

We can expect even more cap and supcap usage for the everyday matters like ratting, plexing etc. The fear of being hotdropped will be really lowered - for the coalitions with the large territories. The small guy will be here beaten again. While holding only small space next to someones borders you will be likely hotdropped while all the ratting supers/caps in the deep blue territories will be near to completely safe.


I really agree with intention behind this change. I really support manufacturing things locally and not transporting them from jita making milk runs - and this will get really harder, more time consuming -> discouraging ppl to do it.

Yes! But please first think about providing us with resources so we can do it WO need to import them from jita.



A lot of small groups living in null sec will be unable to supply their towers or ppl because of the JF (and carrier) 5LY jump range. In many cases they will need to go through enemy territories and even worse - in some cases through territories held by one of the large coalitions, making themselves a juicy target to kill. Again, the small guy takes one for the team. Large coalitions can provide easily 100+ protection fleets for the milk runs, small guy can't.

How to help them:
It could be interesting to provide new rigs allowing carriers jump to original distances WO fatigue, but with really significant impact in the carrier abilities -> tiny dps, significantly lowered HP, no remote reps, not removable for at least 48hours - it will prevent to project force and carriers have too small cargo for the needs of large coalitions.[/quote]

So in summary:

Having strategic assets will be move at a strategic pace is good. (You didn't see the Atlantic Fleet being able to warp across the planet to defend Pearl Harbor from attack.)

The question remains as to whether or not Jump Freighters and Blops, and any other number of ships are strategic assets and should be forced to travel at the same pace of operations as strategic assets.

Is a JF a strategic asset? Probably not.
Are stealth bombers strategic assets? No.

Putting JF's on fatigue schedule likely has to do with other in-game objectives. It would be nice to see some people give thought to how they will work around limits on JF service. Our corp/alliance is looking into moving compressed ore via cloaky hauler and building our large volume items (ship hulls, cap boosters, etc...) on-site and not ship them in from Jita. Other mods are still going to be shipped in but in cloaky haulers. In fact, it'll probably put less strain on our logistics guys doing it this way since you can haul more ship's worth of minerals in a cloaky hauler than you can haul ships in a JF.

Will large volume items have to be built locally? Is this a bad thing if they are?