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Dev Blog: Long-Distance Travel Changes Inbound

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Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#3041 - 2014-10-02 11:11:47 UTC
This is really good news after all these years. Stay on target CCP, don't soften the deal. In fact I do think that fatigue should be even more of a factor so that jumping/bridging becomes a limited option, a decision to be taken with great care that actually has consequences.

I'm also, again, enjoying all the "nono, it doesn't affect us but all those other people will be royally fcked so I'm protesting against it for them, not for us. No really". It's so obvious, it's so glorious.
Roman Kalashnikov
VooDoo Warriors
#3042 - 2014-10-02 11:13:01 UTC
Nothing lasts forever.. Sorry for the time spent on the game. I think that half of the players this patch was removed. Wait a few hours to play.. CCP is not worth it to spend 2 hours waiting..
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#3043 - 2014-10-02 11:14:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Kagura Nikon
Arronicus wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Arronicus wrote:
JIn wai wrote:
With out trying to be fascious does this not now make Super-carriers un-killable in low sec?

As an example, I'm pvping in my Nyx with my fleet.

We hit a gate and engage a hostile fleet. The fights going south and we're loosing so I de-agress (something which should not be hard in a supper) and jump through the gate.

I wait 20 seconds de-cloak fire my Capital ECM and then jump to a waiting cyno.

Aka we're back to Motherships rule low sec, if supers can use jump gates. So in low sec I would argue capitals should not be able to use gates as we can't use bubbles.



This is incredibly easily remedied by allowing heavy interdictors to interdict stargates, preventing capital size+ ships from passing through them. If you cant kill the heavy interdictors or stop them, you shouldnt be able to escape.



The focused point of the Hic already covers that.


The focused point of a hic does not prevent ships from passing through a stargate, no.


A few hics at the other side DO. You cannot expect to kill a super carrier with a SINGLE hic anyway. If you are fighting a super while you are unprepared the super SHOULD escape.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
EVIL SYNNs
Dark-Rising
Wrecking Machine.
#3044 - 2014-10-02 11:14:32 UTC
Game was dropping subs, now! ... Now a chance for life!

Lets take back null !!!!

Good change would read again! (from an old timer who lived in null before jump freighters, when our alliance didn't have a carrier, who watched 10 freighters head from YOUWHAT to fountain core for an invasion they must have planned for months)

THE I CAN BE ANYWHERE IN EVE BUTTON - BE GONE!
Selexid
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#3045 - 2014-10-02 11:15:11 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:

The only thing you will see less is Supercarriers and Titans on not critical fights. But the archon blobs will remain EXACT as before.



Perhaps you are right, but perhaps after the big blue donut gets bigger and fatter some dudes will realize they dont need the big blue donut to survive. (in my understanding that is why we have a big blue donut - to be able to hold space).

And since dropping a random carrier with 20 SC 5 regions away cant be done as easily, maybe they will split on smaller entities to move to the aforesaid region to be able to drop the poor sucker if that is their game.
Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
#3046 - 2014-10-02 11:15:17 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Selexid wrote:
Lurifax wrote:
This will change nothing for the renter empires and the blue donut!


Well then how will the renter overlords will be able to defend all their space when multiple smaller entities attack them all over the shop? Remember no more insta teleporting 5 regions away for that tower.



EXACLTY as they do today. They put a crapton of subcapitals and move their capitals to get close to the more likely group to escalate to usage of capitals. As soon as they can they provoke a jutland battle with FULL force crush COMPLETELY and utterly the enemy because it will be ALONE with its fleet agaisnt he full massed fleet of the defender empire, while his allies cannto come to help. On next day they do the same against the other group.

You may be sure these groups will have 300 archosn stationed on every troublesome corner of their empire, and they will SHUTTLE travel or interceptor travel in 20 min there, get into their archons and obliterate the attacking fleet that cannot be reinforced because of these changes.


Peopel wake UP. This will make even more STUPID to spread your forces. Force concentration is not counterable in this game, so the empires will still focus ALL Their force and the other groups trying to attack from different flanks will have a FAR HARDER time fighting back.

The only thing you will see less is Supercarriers and Titans on not critical fights. But the archon blobs will remain EXACT as before.


The archon blob is a direct issue with sentry drones, remote reps, and capital logistic ships. That can be addressed in the Capital Ship Balance pass.

Its a strategic move of assets. While you can stage all these ships everywhere, it would be exceedingly difficult (because while alliances have their cache and stores of stuff, most people still have "their nyx" and "their own dread".

Yaay!!!!
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#3047 - 2014-10-02 11:15:24 UTC
Roman Kalashnikov wrote:
Nothing lasts forever.. Sorry for the time spent on the game. I think that half of the players this patch was removed. Wait a few hours to play.. CCP is not worth it to spend 2 hours waiting..


Now you'll just have to find your fights closer by, but that would require not having set everyone within 30 jumps blue! *gasp*
Tyby
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3048 - 2014-10-02 11:16:46 UTC
Draahk Chimera wrote:
A small throwback to the time when 0.0 was awesome: Pool yer isk, have one guy go to trade hub in a freighter and buy, escort said guy home. You know, actually play the game.


one question:
how big that escort will have to be to escort a freighter from m-o to h-pa in venal, tru the middle of the entire CFC?
True Sight
Deep Freeze Industries
#3049 - 2014-10-02 11:17:35 UTC
Alternative Suggestion
If unspecified, assume current mechanics

  • From now on, ship cannot simply jump to any Cyno/Beacon within the range of their maximum jump radius
  • When a Cyno module is first activated, only ships within 1ly are able to jump to it
  • After 1minute of being active, ships within 2ly can jump to the beacon
  • After 5minutes, ships within 5ly can reach the beacon
  • After 8minutes, any ship who's jump-range can reach the ship can jump to the beacon


What impact this actually has

  1. Ships cannot instantly jump to a cyno, hot-dropping an opposing force from their maximum jump range, as it would take minutes for the beacon to become "bright enough" for them to reach
  2. The effective travel remains the same as today, but will simply take longer
  3. Sudden, rapid deployment becomes increasingly tricky to coordinate, either groups would triple the amount of jumps done in order to use the cyno fields faster, or they would have to try and very intricately time the activation of the cyno's with the capacitor recharge of the moving fleet.
  4. Carriers jumping maximum distance chains would only be able to reach the next cyno after it had been active for 8 minutes, giving opportunities for defending forces to interrupt cyno's, see an advanced warning of the path lighting up on the map (eve-map could show cyno strength as brightness for example).
  5. I could explain how this mechanic works to a new player in a couple of minutes without him having to break out a calculator, start crying and deciding he never wants to do anything that triggers jump fatigue.
Davader
Space Cleaners
The Gorgon Empire
#3050 - 2014-10-02 11:18:46 UTC
What could be better than oceans of tears and that smoke of burned asses from members of current claim holders coalition?

The idea of jump fatigue, 5 ly max distance and caps jumping by gates looks really fresh against the background of current zero space swamp.

Hope, that the enormous torrent of whine won't prevent CCP from applying the changes, that would be real run.

P.S. I own a super and a few simple cap pilots myself, so I'll be affected by that very heavily as well.
wyliana virras
The Deities
#3051 - 2014-10-02 11:19:20 UTC
I see the light on the end of the tunnel. Its grey(scale)ish...
Rob Kashuken
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#3052 - 2014-10-02 11:20:22 UTC
Well, one thing's for certain. Wormholes just became a strategic asset.
Selexid
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#3053 - 2014-10-02 11:20:29 UTC
Tyby wrote:
Draahk Chimera wrote:
A small throwback to the time when 0.0 was awesome: Pool yer isk, have one guy go to trade hub in a freighter and buy, escort said guy home. You know, actually play the game.


one question:
how big that escort will have to be to escort a freighter from m-o to h-pa in venal, tru the middle of the entire CFC?


Depends on the time of the day.
CA Ambraelle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3054 - 2014-10-02 11:20:36 UTC
Ncc 1709 wrote:

all these people crying about logistics.
Do the math!

going from cobalt edge to empire will take about 9 mins in a jump freighter or rorqual after the patch. just takes a few more cyno's and a 1 min wait at each jump

theres also wh;s to get your snuff into your little home.

stop complaining and figure out how to abuse it and use it to your advantage. theres plenty of advantages to it


True.
Despite being one of the guys crying about logistics I do AGREE with your statement.

And as i wrote before I do not mind the upcoming changes in general.

There is only the one issue that bothers me:
A shorter max jump range for JF resullts in the necessity to fly detours around gaps > 5 ly.
So you not only increase the travel time but also the fuel cost for logistics.
If that issue was solved somehow I would be happy with the long-distance travel changes.
LtCol RTButts
Abandon AII Hope
#3055 - 2014-10-02 11:21:14 UTC
sorry, but i have a RL and a family. there is not enough time left to wait for some more timers to move **** from A to B, especially when the timers can reach days, weeks, month, years ....

you can reach in under 10 jumps the end of the EVE universe....

R.I.P.
Gossi91
Orden der Freischar
The Vanguard Syndicate
#3056 - 2014-10-02 11:22:16 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
Roman Kalashnikov wrote:
Nothing lasts forever.. Sorry for the time spent on the game. I think that half of the players this patch was removed. Wait a few hours to play.. CCP is not worth it to spend 2 hours waiting..


Now you'll just have to find your fights closer by, but that would require not having set everyone within 30 jumps blue! *gasp*


Give it up, he couldnt play eve if he istn in capitals Cool
True Sight
Deep Freeze Industries
#3057 - 2014-10-02 11:22:53 UTC
Davader wrote:
What could be better than oceans of tears and that smoke of burned asses from members of current claim holders coalition?

The idea of jump fatigue, 5 ly max distance and caps jumping by gates looks really fresh against the background of current zero space swamp.

Hope, that the enormous torrent of whine won't prevent CCP from applying the changes, that would be real run.

P.S. I own a super and a few simple cap pilots myself, so I'll be affected by that very heavily as well.


You realise... those big claim holders become... even better at protecting their space, their space has 100 titans and 200 super carriers in an area where it's now even harder for an invading force to contest than it was before.
Josef Djugashvilis
#3058 - 2014-10-02 11:23:37 UTC
javer wrote:
congratulations ccp you just had 4 less paying accounts to your name and keep on sticking your head into the excrement and you can have 0 paying customers at the end


Not so my good sir.

I for one will not quit over these proposed changes.

This is not a signature.
LtCol RTButts
Abandon AII Hope
#3059 - 2014-10-02 11:23:38 UTC
Ncc 1709 wrote:
all these people crying about logistics.
Do the math!

going from cobalt edge to empire will take about 9 mins in a jump freighter or rorqual after the patch. just takes a few more cyno's and a 1 min wait at each jump

theres also wh;s to get your snuff into your little home.

stop complaining and figure out how to abuse it and use it to your advantage. theres plenty of advantages to it


you were not good at math and reality in the past but anyways, seems we will see some funny killmails soon again from you. would be not the first time your corp is loosing a complete JF fleet.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#3060 - 2014-10-02 11:23:53 UTC
Selexid wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:

The only thing you will see less is Supercarriers and Titans on not critical fights. But the archon blobs will remain EXACT as before.



Perhaps you are right, but perhaps after the big blue donut gets bigger and fatter some dudes will realize they dont need the big blue donut to survive. (in my understanding that is why we have a big blue donut - to be able to hold space).

And since dropping a random carrier with 20 SC 5 regions away cant be done as easily, maybe they will split on smaller entities to move to the aforesaid region to be able to drop the poor sucker if that is their game.



Nope... sorry but they have already shown they are cowards. They will just tighten even more their relations so they are sure their borders are secure.



Until the sov by presence and economic usage is implemented, nothing will change.

The time to deploy supers might be too might to just gank a lone carrier. But is irrelevant on a war sacale. PL/NC and CFC will still deploy full force (and by that i do not mean all they have, they do not do that today, I mean all that a node can handle) whenever they have a war scenario.


So while these changes will make Supercarriers solo hunting carriers a thing of the past, they will have zero impact in strategic warfare. THerefore will not change null sec stagnation.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"