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Module Tiericide. Aren't we losing something here?

First post
Author
J'Poll
Perkone
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-09-25 21:37:09 UTC
Thead Enco wrote:
Mass exodus to Riot = Lack of creativity left at CCP.



So, Grrr LoL???

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

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J'Poll
Perkone
Caldari State
#22 - 2014-09-25 21:39:19 UTC
Caviar Liberta wrote:
Cartheron Crust wrote:
I await the day when I can pilot a spaceship called:-

Gallente Blaster Cruiser I
Gallente Drone Cruiser I
Gallente Damping Cruiser I
Gallente Remote Repair Cruiser I

Or the T2 variants.

Gallente Blaster Cruiser II
Gallente Drone Cruiser II
Gallente Damping Cruiser II
Gallente Remote Repair Cruiser II

Spaceship tiericide coming soon(tm). Straight



Gallente Blaster Cruiser I --->Thorax
Gallente Drone Cruiser I --> Vexor
Gallente Damping Cruiser I --> Celestis
Gallente Remote Repair Cruiser I --> Exequror

Gallente Blaster Cruiser II --> Deimos
Gallente Drone Cruiser II --> Ishtar
Gallente Damping Cruiser II --> Lachesis
Gallente Remote Repair Cruiser II --> Oneiros


Please put Sarcasm to 1 in front of your skillqueue

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Mixu Paatelainen
Eve Refinery
#23 - 2014-09-25 21:47:39 UTC
Would just like to add, the only acceptable use of the word "ample" is in reference to a milkmaid's bosoms.
Hal Morsh
Doomheim
#24 - 2014-09-25 21:49:50 UTC
These items were used ccp >.>
Not EVERYBODY has gone down the "super epic pro elite must fit cap boosters" way. Those core agumentations were also important. You could get a few mills if one dropped at a random site, so not only did you manage to dumb them down, but you managed to nerf the loot at sites and the market behind them. Death by a thousand cuts anyone? When I was a newbie and I got one of those core augmentations I made myself 3 mill...

I guess it doesn't actually matter though, if they start doing this to everything I might worry. I just prefer they not get rid of the meta system, and I think that is the reason people are freaking out about such a small change. Just having meta items gives the game complexity, the market is more rich and people looting anything from pve to pvp wrecks get to look forward to certain types of items, and mix up their fits a bit.

It just doesn't seem right to be ridding of the meta items, and with them gone off invention then this. Well.. I'm done typing lol.

Oh, I perfectly understand, Hal Morsh — a mission like this requires courage, skill, and heroism… qualities you are clearly lacking. Have you forgotten you're one of the bloody immortals!?

Zel Juk
Doomheim
#25 - 2014-09-25 22:05:37 UTC
Not sure why everyone's mad. The names, which aren't final, have only been discussed in relation to a very limited range of items.They will test the player response and gather feedback for more important modules such as guns and tank.

Talk about picking your battles.

As for the dumbing down argument, purposely putting obstacles between the players and information available to them isn't the sign of a complex game, its a sign of bad design. Its not dumbing down if the information is already there but is just hidden behind a arbitrary system of info boxes. If CCP come up with a naming system that amply describes the potency of the module while maintaining some level of creativity, then the game will be all the better for it.
Jennifer Maxwell
Crimson Serpent Syndicate
#26 - 2014-09-25 22:08:56 UTC
Zel Juk wrote:
Not sure why everyone's mad. The names, which aren't final, have only been discussed in relation to a very limited range of items.They will test the player response and gather feedback for more important modules such as guns and tank.

Talk about picking your battles.

As for the dumbing down argument, purposely putting obstacles between the players and information available to them isn't the sign of a complex game, its a sign of bad design. Its not dumbing down if the information is already there but is just hidden behind a arbitrary system of info boxes. If CCP come up with a naming system that amply describes the potency of the module while maintaining some level of creativity, then the game will be all the better for it.

Missile launchers are, contrary to what CCP seems to think, important modules.
Jon Joringer
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#27 - 2014-09-25 22:15:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Jon Joringer
Module teircide is a great idea -- having different modules of the same type actually have uses is awesome. But I do agree that the naming convention is just going to be bland. Surely there is a way to work these new 'catch words' into the existing, more interesting and unique names.

Example: Focused Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor, as opposed to Focused Stasis Webifier (along side a whole slew of other 'Stasis Webifiers'). One remains interesting, one does not. Shouldn't be too hard to keep the unique module names in the game.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#28 - 2014-09-25 22:20:23 UTC
The loss of something pointless (or even detrimental) is generally called a gain.
Tara Ro
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#29 - 2014-09-25 22:22:21 UTC
I don't know, I kind of liked all the different modules. Having to decide which one to fit, sell or reprocess was kind of fun for me.

But, it's still too complex. I'm sure that we will eventually end up with three modules (to avoid confusion).

1. Engine - makes your ship go
2. Weapon - for pew pew
3. Defense - makes your ship last a few seconds longer

This also has the side benefit of fitting in line with other games, i.e. Stamina/Mana/Health. So it's a win win.
Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
#30 - 2014-09-25 22:30:07 UTC
Jennifer Maxwell wrote:
A "200mm Prototype Automatic Cannon", or an "200mm Ample Autocannon"?
Now that I think about it, shouldn't that thing be out of the prototype stage by now?

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Marsha Mallow
#31 - 2014-09-25 22:34:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Marsha Mallow
Module tiericide and consolidating all the useless crap is a fine idea. Preserving daft mods with daft stats is, basically daft.

Opposing it using the "lore" and "immersion" angle is uhm misguided [daft] given that probably 5 people in the entire game feel passionate about the lore. And nodoby cares what they think. Because they are, uhr, well, frankly odd.

But I agree the new naming convention is a bit uninspiring. "Basic" vs "Prototype" - thanks for pointing out to the noobs that they are "basically" scrubs.

If we're going to go with egomods, let's do it properly.
> Adorable Noob [Reactor Control Unit] > Meta 0
> Peasant > Meta 1
> Scrub > Meta 2
> Uppity Scrub > Meta 3
> Elite Peasant Scrub > Meta 4
I'd go on but all of them would be obscene, insulting, abusive, and verging on cybertorture.

ed. Just checked the blog, and realised the proposed names are even worse than I imagined.
Quote:
The “named module” names that will be used in our Oceanus changes are:

Upgraded- Used for named modules where no specialization is possible
Compact- Used for named modules that specialize in reduced fitting cost
Enduring- Used for named modules that specialize in lower cap use or otherwise longer running time
Ample- Used for named modules that specialize in extra capacity
Scoped- Used for named modules that specialize in longer range
Restrained- Used for named modules that specialize in reduced drawbacks

Ripard Teg > For the morons in the room:

Sweets > U can dd my face any day

Nishachara
Stillwater Corporation
#32 - 2014-09-25 22:43:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Nishachara
Imho... they should not get rid of old meta modules :P
Yes, introduce new tiercided ones but keep the old ones as well.
Because someone who had just a tiny bit of powergrid or cpu, not enough for the biggest meta gun, maybe fitted the next in line.
Same is with all other modules.
Meta 4 is the most used but that does not mean that nobody uses lower meta items, they have their uses albeit rare, but for thight fits and special circumstances they are great and add diversity and more choice to the game.
And now you'll be able to either fit t1, or named t1 or t2 ( if you have it trained and it fits), you wont have that moment of resarching all the modules in one group, and finding just right one that fits with other just right ones for your specialized fit for ...something something darkside ... :P

Also i like unique names of modules, as Jon Joringer proposed, unique names should be kept with the prefix describing what type of module is and modules without a prefix should stay as old meta modules for people to use when and if they want and need.

More stuff to choose from even useless in 90% of situations is better then no stuff for 10% of situation.
And also, i personaly like even percievable complexity and that is what drew me to eve in the first place.
If there are 5 modules of some type from which most people use 2 or 3 at daily basis and other 7 rarerly it looks more interesting and complex, it does not matter if those 7 modules are unused.
You have a sense of a bigger universe, so to speak, with more various stuff in it...


Edit:
Marsha Mallow wrote:

Opposing it using the "lore" and "immersion" angle is uhm misguided [daft] given that probably 5 people in the entire game feel passionate about the lore. And nodoby cares what they think. Because they are, uhr, well, frankly odd.

What ?!
I feel passionate about the lore, and i know more than 5 people who like eve lore.
Why do you think game should not have back story and rich lore ?
Then we might as well have goddamned shayti lol (or what ever game is "in" in adhd spoiled brats these days) in space :P
Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#33 - 2014-09-25 23:31:41 UTC
Nishachara wrote:
I feel passionate about the lore, and i know more than 5 people who like eve lore.

Your alts don't count. P

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 

Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#34 - 2014-09-26 01:03:49 UTC
Cartheron Crust wrote:
I await the day when I can pilot a spaceship called:-

Gallente Blaster Cruiser I
Gallente Drone Cruiser I
Gallente Damping Cruiser I
Gallente Remote Repair Cruiser I

Or the T2 variants.

Gallente Blaster Cruiser II
Gallente Drone Cruiser II
Gallente Damping Cruiser II
Gallente Remote Repair Cruiser II

Spaceship tiericide coming soon(tm). Straight


heh, look at the art devblog, internally they are already GC1 GC2 GC3 GC4 Lol

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Vyl Vit
#35 - 2014-09-26 02:03:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Vyl Vit
I really don't care what it's called, so long as the name isn't confusing. What I care about you'll find on that all-important attributes panel. Yes, the description just to see if there's a stacking penalty. I compare attributes panels,
not clever names.

Paradise is like where you are right now, only much, much better.

Money Makin Mitch
Paid in Full
#36 - 2014-09-26 02:15:24 UTC
What was the rationale behind changing the values around on the officer co-processors? you basically just made the ****** ones good and the good ones ******.
Jennifer Maxwell
Crimson Serpent Syndicate
#37 - 2014-09-26 02:15:45 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
I really don't care what it's called, so long as the name isn't confusing. What I care about you'll find on that all-important attributes panel. Yes, the description just to see if there's a stacking penalty. I compare attributes panels,
not clever names.

The you wouldnt mind supporting us when we say we want it to stay unique and interesting, rather than be changed to uninspired and uniform, right?
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#38 - 2014-09-26 02:48:25 UTC
Jon Joringer wrote:
Module teircide is a great idea -- having different modules of the same type actually have uses is awesome. But I do agree that the naming convention is just going to be bland. Surely there is a way to work these new 'catch words' into the existing, more interesting and unique names.

Example: Focused Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor, as opposed to Focused Stasis Webifier (along side a whole slew of other 'Stasis Webifiers'). One remains interesting, one does not. Shouldn't be too hard to keep the unique module names in the game.

So when I search the market for stasis webifier to look at my options, it doesn't come up in the search.....
Bad design
I wouldn't be against Focused 'Fleeting' stasis webifier.
Keeping the current 'name' in the new name still, but I shouldn't have to memorise variant names for a stasis webifier just to find them in a search.
JamesT KirkJr
A New Eden
#39 - 2014-09-26 03:42:57 UTC  |  Edited by: JamesT KirkJr
Dorian Wylde wrote:
Losing useless complexity? Losing wasted time trying to remember a thousand different names that serve no purpose? Losing modules that never get used and serve no purpose other than to confuse new players?

Yeah, we are losing some things. And good riddance. These 'the old ways are better because I shouldn't have to adapt!" threads are really getting tiresome and pathetic. There is no choice in the current system. All they're doing is making the market interface easier to sort through.


Losing 15-20% of the capability of my current Meta 3/4 mods? In exchange for what exactly? I don't really feel that's a "good riddance" thing.

I think this is a horrible bad thing, and only people who fit T2 on everything don't care, because they won't feel it.

But everyone who plays the game with T1 stuffs is going to feel this nerf bat right upside their ship capabilities. How is nobody even calling that out?
Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
#40 - 2014-09-26 03:51:45 UTC
Marsha Mallow wrote:
If we're going to go with egomods, let's do it properly.
> Adorable Noob [Reactor Control Unit] > Meta 0
> Peasant > Meta 1
> Scrub > Meta 2
> Uppity Scrub > Meta 3
> Elite Peasant Scrub > Meta 4
I'd go on but all of them would be obscene, insulting, abusive, and verging on cybertorture.
This post made my night.

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