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[Kronos] Medium Micro Jump Drives

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Laiannah Sahireen
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#221 - 2014-05-18 11:14:37 UTC
The one ship class that would benefit massively from this module is Logistics Cruisers (T2).

Being able to keep up with an MJDing battleship fleet would be fantastic for logi boats, assuming they had the fitting to be able to use one of these modules as well as an AB.

I personally hate the idea of putting these on command ships and battlecruisers - those ships really aren't hurting for manueverability when fitted right.
Spugg Galdon
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#222 - 2014-05-18 11:18:08 UTC
These are going to be pretty tough to fit you know!

Especially trying to dual prop it with an MWD.

It think these will be just fine to be honest.
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#223 - 2014-05-18 11:18:23 UTC
Laiannah Sahireen wrote:
The one ship class that would benefit massively from this module is Logistics Cruisers (T2).

Being able to keep up with an MJDing battleship fleet would be fantastic for logi boats, assuming they had the fitting to be able to use one of these modules as well as an AB.

I personally hate the idea of putting these on command ships and battlecruisers - those ships really aren't hurting for manueverability when fitted right.


logistics cruisers are actually immensely overpowered, fyi
Pertuabo Enkidgan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#224 - 2014-05-18 11:23:12 UTC
Quote:
Exact same stats


It's not so medium then is it? You just crammed it in a battlecruiser.
Shade Millith
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#225 - 2014-05-18 11:23:16 UTC
Aralieus wrote:
Omg the tears...ty for this fozzie, seriously man ty

I for one cant wait to slap one on my Abso and go roaming...if anything it allow more solo pvp activities to not diaf as often. Idk know what all these haters are talkin bout.


It's a bit harder to solo roam when any ship you find might simply be able to leave when you engage. This actually makes it more difficult for solo roaming.

So the choice becomes either fit a point and lose your targets to a jump out, or fit a scram and get web/scrammed in return and killed by bait.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#226 - 2014-05-18 11:23:59 UTC
MJD's are fine on BS's because they are slow as balls otherwise.. I dont' really see a good reason to allow them on BC's other than allowing a wave of hyper annoying aBC gangs..

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#227 - 2014-05-18 11:25:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
CCP: "We're going to nerf mobility on BC because atm they're way too powerful and make the pvp landscape rather limited and boring"

players: "YOU CAN'T DO THIS, IT WILL COMPLETELY MESS UP MY CANE BACKBONE... err THE GAME! DOOM, HORROR, CTHULHU. YOU'll BREAK THIS GAME SO MUCH IT'S NOT EVEN FUNNY BECAUSE I CAN'T COMPREHEND THE RESULTS OF THIS CHANGE AND COMING UP WITH ADAPTATIONS SOUNDS LIKE EFFORT!"

:changes happen, some time passes and ppl adapt:

players: "hey, this is actually nice. Now we can fly funky cruisers and frigs because they're not made redundant anymore by Canes and Drakes. Pretty cool tbh"


CCP: "We're going to give BC a specific niche by giving it MJD because we feel that kiting (just like the old nano age and WCS) means that people can fight without having to commit to it, that's just not right given that these BC tend to be fairly slow compared to other ships. This way BC aren't able to keep up with fast roaming gangs but on the up side they can force you to commit to a fight if you want to kill them"

players: "YOU CAN'T DO THIS, THIS COMPLETELY MESSES UP MY BUBBLE/KITE err... THE GAME! DOOM, HORROR, CTHULHU AGAIN WTF"

people who have a clue: "well, it's a bit weird but sure, I can see where you're going with that but please, CBC only. Not ABC"



History repeats itself, again and again.
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#228 - 2014-05-18 11:30:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Medalyn Isis
I would be hesitant to fit one on an ABC anyway. It uses up too much PG, CPU and fitting. Pre aligning will still be the preferred choice for a competent ABC pilot in my opinion. I'd rather use a regular MWD. It would be quite nice for jumping and maintaing a lock on approaching interceptors though. I can see a niche for it but I don't think it will be as dominant as some people think.
Sirinda
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium
#229 - 2014-05-18 11:30:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Sirinda
My Damnation will reap a bloody HAMvest with this. Twisted

EDIT: To any who're going to quit because of this new module: Can I have your stuff?
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#230 - 2014-05-18 11:30:25 UTC
Michael Harari wrote:
Rowells wrote:

send out tackle, if they warp off then thats no different than now, however if you do get a successful tackle you can now be there for the kill quickly.


Except the first thing they are going to do once longpointed is activate their own mjds.



then don't use a long point
Pertuabo Enkidgan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#231 - 2014-05-18 11:33:28 UTC
ABC
Easy as 1 2 3
Or simple as
M M J D
Theon Severasse
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#232 - 2014-05-18 11:39:13 UTC
Bad idea, while it will be tough to fit on a majority of BCs, ABCs will find it extremely easy to fit one, while sacrificing very little. Sniping fits that previously had an MWD on will be able to switch to these without really having to change anything about their fits. Unless the current problems with MJDs are fixed (Align, MJD, Warp) these should not even be close to being on the drawing board.






Battlecruisers (excluding ABCs) are in dire need of a buff, but this is not it. They currently cost about 3x that of a cruiser, and yet typically do not do more DPS, and have less maneuverability to boot. Lack of adequate powergrid/CPU compounds this problem. These are the problems that should be being dealt with, not adding in modules that make significant elements of the game irrelevant (Bubbles, Hic Points, Long Points, even Mobile MJDs).
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#233 - 2014-05-18 11:42:02 UTC
I don't understand why people think BC's need a buff stats wise?

They are in a weird middle spot like dessies.. but they are still excellent bang for buck when you consider the dps/tank they bring to the field for that amount of isk.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#234 - 2014-05-18 11:47:09 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
I don't understand why people think BC's need a buff stats wise?

They are in a weird middle spot like dessies.. but they are still excellent bang for buck when you consider the dps/tank they bring to the field for that amount of isk.



:)
Shade Millith
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#235 - 2014-05-18 11:49:32 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
CCP: "We're going to give BC a specific niche by giving it MJD because we feel that kiting (just like the old nano age and WCS) means that people can fight without having to commit to it, that's just not right given that these BC tend to be fairly slow compared to other ships. This way BC aren't able to keep up with fast roaming gangs but on the up side they can force you to commit to a fight if you want to kill them"

players: "YOU CAN'T DO THIS, THIS COMPLETELY MESSES UP MY BUBBLE/KITE err... THE GAME! DOOM, HORROR, CTHULHU AGAIN WTF"


Maybe people should be concerned when the ability to kite is being removed?

My favorite solo PVP ships are brawling BCs, and this change could benefit me greatly. I've already worked out a nice fit for a HAMDrake with a MWD and MMJD. Basically either you fly within range of my web/scram/730DPS/63kEHP and have a scram fitted, or I'm just simply going to leave when I wish to.

And yet I still don't think it's a good idea.
Adrie Atticus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#236 - 2014-05-18 11:52:05 UTC
Medalyn Isis wrote:
Arya Regnar wrote:
Adrie Atticus wrote:
MMJD should be affected by long points and bubbles.

Reasons for this are already posted.

WORD

Make it so longpoints and bubbles disrupt MMJD (except on deep space transports, they need some kind of edge since they are so useless).

Please stop with these stupid knee jerk suggestions. You would break much more stuff than the imaginary problem you are trying to fix by doing something as stupid as this.


Break what? The module is not even implemented yet, there is nothing to break.

MEDIUM MJD should not be implemented in the first place.
Tek Handle
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#237 - 2014-05-18 11:54:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Tek Handle
If you introduce that module, you'll also have to give us a bubble variant which is able to hold them. Perhaps, a 5 minute cycle time but be able to fit a 2nd normal bubble to a Dictor, still. Seriously this module will totally imbalance Tier3 BCs. Another option would be to not allow Tier3 BCs to fit an MJD! You won't see Battleships in medium to large scale engagements anymore, because.. Tier3 BCs have likely the same damage and get an even easier GTFO option (added to their already great mobility), in fact they're decent right now so why give them such a huge advantage? MJD on any other Battlecruiser sized ship or DSPT, good thing!

Edit: Giving a long point the possibility to hold MJD is actually quite the nice idea, since you do not have **** tons of them in a fleet anyway, why not give them some *use* at all in such fleets?
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#238 - 2014-05-18 11:55:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
Shade Millith wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
CCP: "We're going to give BC a specific niche by giving it MJD because we feel that kiting (just like the old nano age and WCS) means that people can fight without having to commit to it, that's just not right given that these BC tend to be fairly slow compared to other ships. This way BC aren't able to keep up with fast roaming gangs but on the up side they can force you to commit to a fight if you want to kill them"

players: "YOU CAN'T DO THIS, THIS COMPLETELY MESSES UP MY BUBBLE/KITE err... THE GAME! DOOM, HORROR, CTHULHU AGAIN WTF"


Maybe people should be concerned when the ability to kite is being removed?

My favorite solo PVP ships are brawling BCs, and this change could benefit me greatly. I've already worked out a nice fit for a HAMDrake with a MWD and MMJD. Basically either you fly within range of my web/scram/730DPS/63kEHP and have a scram fitted, or I'm just simply going to leave when I wish to.

And yet I still don't think it's a good idea.




I'm not saying it's a buff the BC need but at the same time I can see the logic behind it. There's kity fast moving frigs and cruisers that can aggress and de-aggress at will, this makes slower ships pretty much useless and brings us back to square one. With this change BC will have their own form of kiting where faster cruisers have choice; avoid it or commit to the fight, and they HAVE that choice because a BC simply can't force themselves onto a frig or cruiser (assuming non-idiots). So it's a defensive measure where BC can go "sure I'm slower, but I'm still viable in my own right. You want to kill me? Come and get it".

It's a crude solution (where arguably none is needed) and possibly a precedent resulting in more and more MJD ships but from a strategy/gameplay POV it makes good sense.
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#239 - 2014-05-18 12:00:15 UTC
MJD'ing railferoxes without regular propmod EVERYWHERE. That's what MJDs imply.
Theon Severasse
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#240 - 2014-05-18 12:04:08 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
I don't understand why people think BC's need a buff stats wise?

They are in a weird middle spot like dessies.. but they are still excellent bang for buck when you consider the dps/tank they bring to the field for that amount of isk.



Really?


They don't do more DPS than cruisers, and don't really tank much more.

I can count on one hand the number of times I have seen someone flying a BC while soloing (not counting ABCs), and I can't remember the last time that I saw a fleet of BCs.

You can solo most BCs in a thorax without it being a particularly challenging fight.