These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[Kronos] Mordu's Legion

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#981 - 2014-05-22 14:35:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Kagura Nikon
Xequecal wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
And sicne when that will be enough to kill another pirate cruiser or a hac?

I will use HAMS on mine.


Then I hope you're fitting a web, because without one your DPS on pirate cruisers and HACs will be zero. It also kind of makes the point range bonus kind of useless because you have to get into web range to do anything. After MWD, point, and web.....enjoy your 3-slot tank on your billion ISK cruiser.

If you're planning to have someone else tackle, just fly an attack battlecruiser and do tons more DPS from much further away.



aa .. how cute a goon trying to teach a Pursuit Of Happiness about small scale PVP..

hint we know FAR MORE than you at this... we use hams massively and we can do things without thousands of bees.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Armin Arraeb
Doomheim
#982 - 2014-05-22 15:36:49 UTC
The Mordu's Legion Ships look great! Quite obwious they look like a stealth fighter (YF-23 or F-35), why dont they have the ability to cloake? In my opinion the should be able to do, what they look like they could do. (for that ability you could add a mordu's faction cloaking dewise (that only mordu's ships can fit), that is worse than the cov ops, but stil able to warp cloaked (and with a short locking time after decloaking))


What do you think about that?
Hagika
Standard Corp 123
#983 - 2014-05-22 17:51:40 UTC
Sheimi Madaveda wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:

Yes, my point was not to underestimate the value of a utility high. I was editing my post to reference the State Raven so I think you missed that portion, but from a purely aesthetic standpoint - yes, 8 launchers would be purtier. However, since this would put the damage above that of a State Raven - I don't expect we'd still see the 25% damage bonus on 8 launchers without taking a hit somewhere else.

Since we're into "wishful thinking", what I'd actually prefer is 6 launchers with a +50% damage bonus, one less high slot (total of 7) and an extra low slot (also 7). That actually gives it marginally better damage (9.0 effective vs. 8.75) as well as allowing for a decent armour tank configuration.


It wouldn't break the DPS of the State Raven because 25% RoF is better than 25% Damage unless you are using RHML.

I remember throwing stuff into EFT sometime and the State Raven has the highest potential DPS of any BS in the game... it even beats the Vindicator by a measurable amount. Caldari's got mad deeps man, mad deeps.


Then when you go to apply it, everyone laughs at you, because missiles apply damage like garbage.

Which is why missile ships should be higher dps because they dont apply instantly and have a far harder time applying full damage. Continuing them to be a fleet ship. People will bring the ships to allow them to hit effectively. It will be worth it.
Cordo Draken
ABOS Industrial Enterprises
#984 - 2014-05-22 17:55:56 UTC
Xequecal wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
And sicne when that will be enough to kill another pirate cruiser or a hac?

I will use HAMS on mine.


Then I hope you're fitting a web, because without one your DPS on pirate cruisers and HACs will be zero. It also kind of makes the point range bonus kind of useless because you have to get into web range to do anything. After MWD, point, and web.....enjoy your 3-slot tank on your billion ISK cruiser.

If you're planning to have someone else tackle, just fly an attack battlecruiser and do tons more DPS from much further away.


How do you go from using a Kiting Missile boat to then comparing an Attack BC? Two totally different play styles. Not to mention it's an MMO... If you don't have Friends you're doing it wrong. I'd think a Goon would know... Oh wait...

Whomever said, "You only get one shot to make a good impression," was utterly wrong. I've made plenty of great impressions with my Autocannons 
Cordo Draken
ABOS Industrial Enterprises
#985 - 2014-05-22 18:05:15 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
drop the tackle range bonus for it Lol



The tackle range bonus is the Best thing on those ships! Specially since in future we are likely havign every single ship in eve have a Micro jump drive.


Agreed, range bonus is super nice.

Ugh, I certainly hope they Don't do Micro Jump drives for ship classes below the BC. In fact I believe I read/heard somewhere that it will stop at BC.

Whomever said, "You only get one shot to make a good impression," was utterly wrong. I've made plenty of great impressions with my Autocannons 
Hagika
Standard Corp 123
#986 - 2014-05-22 18:32:06 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Xequecal wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
And sicne when that will be enough to kill another pirate cruiser or a hac?

I will use HAMS on mine.


Then I hope you're fitting a web, because without one your DPS on pirate cruisers and HACs will be zero. It also kind of makes the point range bonus kind of useless because you have to get into web range to do anything. After MWD, point, and web.....enjoy your 3-slot tank on your billion ISK cruiser.

If you're planning to have someone else tackle, just fly an attack battlecruiser and do tons more DPS from much further away.



aa .. how cute a goon trying to teach a Pursuit Of Happiness about small scale PVP..

hint we know FAR MORE than you at this... we use hams massively and we can do things without thousands of bees.


Contrary to popular belief, when it comes to SOV fleets then yes they use alot of people but in large alliances, we actually do alot of small gang pvp. Just because large alliances have a couple thousand people, doesnt mean they dont do other types of pvp. That would be foolish to think so.
Hagika
Standard Corp 123
#987 - 2014-05-22 18:55:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Hagika
Hmm considering the Fleet phoon kind of emasculates the Barg as it sits, there is no reason why the Barg cant get atleast 8% damage per level or possibly 10% considering the Phoon already gets 7.5% and a flight of heavies. When the Barg isnt getting that. Especially when the ship price will be over 1 billion isk and the Fleet Phoon is 400 mil?

Will be really hard to justify that cost for a Pirate faction ship that is inferior to a ship less than half its cost.

There should be no reason why a navy BS of missile weapon should be beating a Pirate faction. Why bother with the Barg when you can spend far less and get a Fleet phoon with higher dps and a better set of drones.

Which by the way still bothers me, how its superior to the navy raven.
Chessur
Full Broadside
Deepwater Hooligans
#988 - 2014-05-22 22:42:47 UTC
The typhoons is superior to the fleet phoon. The application bonus allows the phoon to apply more damage, to any target over the fleet phoon.
Hagika
Standard Corp 123
#989 - 2014-05-22 23:30:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Hagika
Chessur wrote:
The typhoons is superior to the fleet phoon. The application bonus allows the phoon to apply more damage, to any target over the fleet phoon.


Its only 5% which can be made up with a simple implant. Are you trying to say that the shear dps advantage from the fleet phoon compared to the regular phoon is going to be less in terms of applied damage? I hope not, because it doesnt, and lets not forget the Fleet phoon carries a huge drone bay and can use a flight of heavies or sentry.

In terms of killing Battleships and Battlecruisers the fleet phoon will easily beat the regular phoon bone stock except for anything below BC.

Then at that point the drones will wreck what ever else plus damage. The Fleet Phoon is superior, that is undisputed fact, well till your post.

Now in a perfect world lets pretend that the regular phoon is better. Then that would mean both phoons are better than the Barg billion isk pirate BS..Which just goes to prove my point, the Barg needs more damage.
Chessur
Full Broadside
Deepwater Hooligans
#990 - 2014-05-22 23:34:37 UTC
Hagika wrote:
Chessur wrote:
The typhoons is superior to the fleet phoon. The application bonus allows the phoon to apply more damage, to any target over the fleet phoon.


Its only 5% which can be made up but a simple implant. Are you trying to say that the shear dps advantage from the fCNt phoon compared to the regular phoon is going to be less in terms of applied damage? I hope not, because it doesnt, and lets not forget the Fleet phoon carries a huge drone bay and can use a flight of heavies or sentry.

In terms of killing Battleships and Battlecruisers the fleet phoon will easily beat the regular phoon bone stock except for anything below BC.

Then at that point the drones will wreck what ever else plus damage. The Fleet Phoon is superior, that is undisputed fact, well till your post.

Now in a perfect world lets pretend that the regular phoon is better. Then that would mean both phoons are better than the Barg billion isk pirate BS..Which just goes to prove my point, the Barg needs more damage.


Its an additional 25% increase in application, that stacks with implants rigors and crash. Fleet phoon can get nowhere near the damage application of the phoon. The phoon will always be doing more dps because of this. Also when you are forced to still use precision missiles- phoon can switch to CSn and have another step up in damage.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#991 - 2014-05-22 23:58:44 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Ok this is the first time I ever write this to one of your posts... but I think you may have had a good idea.

Thanks. I guess most of the pro-Minmatar players must have glossed over it since I didn't hear anything (which is strange, because I thought for sure they would've perked up at the prospect of having an additional Minmatar racial bonus).

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
chaosgrimm
Synth Tech
#992 - 2014-05-23 00:19:10 UTC  |  Edited by: chaosgrimm
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Ok this is the first time I ever write this to one of your posts... but I think you may have had a good idea.

Thanks. I guess most of the pro-Minmatar players must have glossed over it since I didn't hear anything (which is strange, because I thought for sure they would've perked up at the prospect of having an additional Minmatar racial bonus).

I am pro minmatar bonus. 2 reasons ur cal/gal/min idea doesn't appeal to me.

1) can't see it happening, it would be like a whole new class of battleship

2) wanting cal / min is about the not wanting a gallente bonus as much as it is about wanting a minmatar one. Ur idea still gives the gallente BS skill more value compared to the other BS skills
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#993 - 2014-05-23 00:31:57 UTC
chaosgrimm wrote:
I am pro minmatar bonus. 2 reasons ur cal/gal/min idea doesn't appeal to me.

1) can't see it happening, it would be like a whole new class of battleship

2) wanting cal / min is about the not wanting a gallente bonus as much as it is about wanting a minmatar one. Ur idea still gives the gallente BS skill more value compared to the other BS skills

Fair enough. I suggested the addition of a Minmatar racial bonus because many of the other Pirate ships (as indicated) have more than just the standard 2 racial and 1 role bonus, and because I think it's highly unlikely we'll see a Caldari-Minmatar specific Pirate class of ships anytime soon. I also think there's a snowball's chance in h*ll of having the Gallente racial bonus changed to Minmatar...

It's not a question of which racial bonus is more valuable, however - as perception will vary greatly depending on end-use (and to be honest, that's kind of picking at straws).

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Hagika
Standard Corp 123
#994 - 2014-05-23 01:03:00 UTC
Chessur wrote:
Hagika wrote:
Chessur wrote:
The typhoons is superior to the fleet phoon. The application bonus allows the phoon to apply more damage, to any target over the fleet phoon.


Its only 5% which can be made up but a simple implant. Are you trying to say that the shear dps advantage from the fCNt phoon compared to the regular phoon is going to be less in terms of applied damage? I hope not, because it doesnt, and lets not forget the Fleet phoon carries a huge drone bay and can use a flight of heavies or sentry.

In terms of killing Battleships and Battlecruisers the fleet phoon will easily beat the regular phoon bone stock except for anything below BC.

Then at that point the drones will wreck what ever else plus damage. The Fleet Phoon is superior, that is undisputed fact, well till your post.

Now in a perfect world lets pretend that the regular phoon is better. Then that would mean both phoons are better than the Barg billion isk pirate BS..Which just goes to prove my point, the Barg needs more damage.


Its an additional 25% increase in application, that stacks with implants rigors and crash. Fleet phoon can get nowhere near the damage application of the phoon. The phoon will always be doing more dps because of this. Also when you are forced to still use precision missiles- phoon can switch to CSn and have another step up in damage.



You avoided part of my post as to the targets, which for a BS they will usually be hitting BS or BC targets. Also you skipped over that i said for any ships smaller than those, a regular phoon will work better.

Oh and they fact that the Fleet phoon still has a better drone setup. Then again, you steer from the topic that both ships are better than the billion isk pirate ship for less than half the cost.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#995 - 2014-05-23 01:10:42 UTC
But it comes in black... Twisted

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
scorchlikeshiswhiskey
Totally Abstract
O X I D E
#996 - 2014-05-23 01:21:10 UTC
So, I'm talking to some corp buddies and we really can't figure out why you would build a Pirate BS that doesn't have Pirate damage or application. We've pretty much come to the conclusion that the Barghest will be another Nestor-flop unless you really feel the urge to fly an overly expensive, battleship sized, interceptor that can do mediocre damage against anything smaller than a BS and sub-par damage against BS's.
I do want an Orthrus though, could be very handy when sitting on a hole.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#997 - 2014-05-23 01:24:10 UTC
scorchlikeshiswhiskey wrote:
So, I'm talking to some corp buddies and we really can't figure out why you would build a Pirate BS that doesn't have Pirate damage or application. We've pretty much come to the conclusion that the Barghest will be another Nestor-flop unless you really feel the urge to fly an overly expensive, battleship sized, interceptor that can do mediocre damage against anything smaller than a BS and sub-par damage against BS's.

Maybe I can get a discount then...

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#998 - 2014-05-23 01:28:50 UTC
I think it'd be perfectly fine to give the Bargh a big missile damage bonus, especially given its lack of application bonus- it'd be permissible to give it massive DPS if it isn't getting any application bonus.

It's quite Bargh- more bargh than other ships- one could say it's the "Barghest"

"A City made of Dreams is built in heaven"
Sheimi Madaveda
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#999 - 2014-05-23 01:32:44 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:

And sicne when that will be enough to kill another pirate cruiser or a hac?

I will use HAMS on mine.


Assuming the enemy ship can match your speed... well, it is usually enough. Most kitey HAC or Pirate Cruisers have around 30-40k EHP before fleet or links. Against some brawlers, I would imagine a bit of unreliable drone DPS is also applied against them.

Unless you regularly try to solo targets with 100+k EHP, then RLML should do better. I think it takes RLML around its 2-3rd reload cycle to fall completey behind HAM's superior DPS, so if you're judging it based on a single clip's damage dealt, you're doing it wrong.


For projection, application, and peak DPS - RLML is better. You can kill a lot of enemies from farther away which can really save your butt, and HAMs can't hold a candle to RLML's ability to kill tacklers. That is enough to convince me to use RLML.

That being said, HAMs are not necessarily bad... I could think of a few examples were some super scram range kiting could be fun.

Arma Purgatorium - Once for the State, Now for the King Low Sec, PvP, Industrial - Open for Recruiting http://armapurgatorium.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/arpur_recruit1.png 
Actaeon Versaea
#1000 - 2014-05-23 04:50:21 UTC
[Whistle]

These ships look impressive! Particularly the Orpheus (Because the real name is a bit hard to pronounce, and I study Classical History). Looking forward to losing a few.


The battleship really needs a paint job to shine, but It's frontal silhouette looks scary.


So: Give the modeling team some reward stealth pizza.


Edit: Post 1000. Woot!