Player Features and Ideas Discussion

yup for the people on my side its multi alt. for the people against me its multiplayer :)

I'm all for all of these changes. The one thing that really pisses me off are the people that aren't in FW bitching about this. I say if you're going to change anything about this the first thing should be No nutes can use the gate. These weekend pvper's are starting to **** me off. Efing man up and be pvp 24/7 not just when you and 15 friends want to come mess with us and our systems.

Only people who think the current system is worth engaging in should have an opinion about changing it.

Really?

So basically what we have so far is:

In the olden days, you had to just speed tank all the rats. This was BAD MM'K, so CCP made you have to kill all the rats.

Then it was apparently too much of a pain in the ass to kill all the rats. (Killing your fun, etc.) So CCP removed the WAVES OF RATS and changed it to a single rat to encourage FW play.

By FW play they obviously meant endless alt farming, so put on your flight suit: MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.

But wait! Now endless alt farming is now known the State of California to cause cancer. CCP's initial answer to the problem is: WAVES OF RATS.

What a clever idea!

CCP Fozzie

This is what you said on October 22nd 2012:

(emphasis added)

http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/73491

As you can see from Bienator II's post this is still strongly supported and people are just confused what is going on.

Can you at least tell us whether this idea has been abandoned or if there are just technical difficulties or something else?

Thank you for your time and attention to faction war.

Does this "trailer" beacon show up for every player on grid on your overview, or just your instance of the "trailer"? Im trying to imagine having to try and click multiple ships on the overview/in space and having to dodge the trailer....

I agree, just seems a bit awkward of an implementation. The server obviously already tracks how close you are to the beacon to have the timer counting and awarding lp. Having a graphic "object" follow you just seems redundant. Seems like it'd just be simpler to apply a "cloak disrupt" effect to that same 30km radius, and not rely on a following object

If it does indeed work as Bienator describes, then it's simply a quick and dirty implementation. There is no 'cloak disruption' effect. The system is simply looking to see if there is something within ~2km of you and denying the ability to cloak as always. They've simply hacked in some nonsense to make sure that something is always ~2km from you.

ETA:

I'm on SiSi now, and what I am seeing is that you warp in on the standard warpable beacon, and there is a second 'local' beacon placed with/on the button. That beacon seems to have a 30km 'size' that you are actually inside of anytime you are within 30km of the button. It's invisible/whatever, so until you hit the edge, you're 'at zero,' much like the hit box around a station can be 'at zero' even though you're nowhere near close to being in the center of the model.

Further ETA:

I just bounced around to a couple more plexes; the second was the same as the first, the third is exhibiting this 'ghost beacon' behavior where I have the warp beacon following me around.

Let them Cloak because with a cloak they have to be watching local, they have to be able to hit that button the second someone drops on field with them... because once they're targeted that cloak is completely useless.

Cloaks DO have serious downsides to using them, and those that don't are considerably more expensive or far more specialised making them relatively useless for farming outside of Mission Running; but then that honestly should be a simple solution of well ship lock-outs.

I mean it isn't hard... tired of trying to catch Bombers in L4 FW Missions, really it is a bit bullshit they're allowed in there.
Don't get me wrong I'm Caldari so yeah that is often the best ship to do our L4 Missions - but just block Frigates and Destroyers from entering. There are a dozen or so ships that ARE already blocked from going in, if you end up forcing the Risk-Reward ... sure people will ***** for a bit but they'll adapt leading to more fights.

Or rather I should say, we'll have more Covert T3s running around ... but that isn't a bad thing as they are easier to catch, are a considerably larger risk - it balanced out quite well, especially as they're next up on the re-balance hit list.

---

As far as the NPC Tanking / Damage Output... I'm sorry but I will echo what I said before.
It doesn't matter what you do to the NPCs, it will not stop farmers as it just means they'll train up their characters another week before they get added to the multi-box list.

In the mean time increasing the "DPS Tanking" means you're basically saying most of the Low-DPS ships, which keep in mind most players during their first 1-2 months rarely have ships that can break 70-80 DPS, it's the same when they upgrade to Cruisers then Battlecruisers.

They are at the absolute low-end of damage output. Yet you (and CCP apparently) are suggesting it is perfectly fine to basically say "**** New Players" from legitimately playing Solo if they want to.

In the mean time most Farmers will simply swap tactics to another ship that is a little less economical to build or have another multi-box character added just to get that additional DPS needed, especially /IF/ as CCP suggest they're making the NPCs paper thin with no real punch.

Yeah that'll show those farmers... man I bet they're terrified of these changes.
As I said in my original post, ignore trying to use the NPCs as a means of preventing farmers... You can't, not without basically ******* over the legitimate players by ramping the difficulty to be on-par with Incursions; even then all you'll do is end up with far more organised farmers.

Instead the NPCs should be a learning tool to get players used to what they'll come against in PVP, standard fits, what each ship does... I mean it's fine showing Traits and being like "Well this is a Jamming Ship" or such - but most people don't understand how any of those mechanics actually work, I mean in PVE a) it isn't the right damn ship doing such things, and b) the module often like ECM for example is so much more powerful than a Player ECM that the chances of being perma-jammed are just monumentally high as it relies on the OLD statistics of those modules at Level 5 using Officer Mods.

It's just so far removed from a realistic depictions it's a joke.
Sure it is good for adding a bit of difficulty to PVE Missions (regardless of how **** poor they are entertainment wise) but again the biggest issue with PVE it isn't even remotely close to PVP, simply because you fit to game that system rather than the NPCs being fit like PVP ships.

I mean they don't have to act specifically like real people (although I hope Brain in a Box does bring that functionality within the next year as they'd be pretty awesome) but they could easily be fit and mimic a relatively new low-skill PVP pilot. Wasn't that the entire idea of swapping over to the Sleeper AI? Rather than simply meaning they just target Drones first and act like Sentry Turrets that scroll through all the viable targets.

All we need to deal with Farming are chances to level the playing field so we CAN police it.
And in-fact I'd actually say the exact same is true with dealing with the Null-Sec Alliances that treat Low-Sec as their own personal Hot Drop playground.

Right now we don't have the Resources to properly counter Super Capitals or just large Capital Fleets.
Having the toys that Null-Sec have available, along with Capital, Super Capital, Specialist Faction Starbases, all that are only available while in Militia (or rather they are buffed by being in Militia) so outside they are little more than military livery ... linking it to the Ranks that should be earned from Service Time, Kills, Securing / Defending Systems, providing OB for DUST. So you have to be committed to a given Faction with a clear stake in it before providing access to such things.

I mean you want to know the core way to improve FW on the whole... that would be it.
Don't change mechanics to simply try fixing problems with the system itself, make changes that give that power to those involved the chance to handle things themselves.

The issue with cloaks (and the issue that this band aid really does not solve) is that 'they' don't have to be doing any such thing; their bot does it for them, and faster than a person could.