Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I understand the reasoning (e.g. its a sandbox) but this will basically KILL PVPer population in wormhole space as it just makes it even more difficult for people to find fights. I would say most of those people wanting it removed are carebears that choose to live in dangerous space but just want another reason not to have look at their computer screen.

I understand the reasoning, but making production viable more than two jumps out of jita will basically KILL industrialist population in highsec as it just makes it even more difficult for people to compete with null. I would say most of those people wanting build slot limits to be removed are carebears that choose to live in dangerous space but just want another reason not to have to look at their computer screen.

Thread cleaned up. Keep it on topic and civil please. Thank you.

Again, easy solution..

Glimpse Probes..

If it s true that wspace is less occupied than it was, there could be a number of causal factors:
1. Easier returns on pve elsewhere (incursions?)
2. Random fluctuations in player behaviour
3. People tiring of being mercilessly ganked and held hostage.
4. New players being attracted in different directions (brave newbies, goons, etc)

This change addresses point 3 in a small way. It won't stop people being mercilessly ganked, but it means that the tankers will have to put a tiny amount of effort into it.

The overall effect on wspace will be close to zero, and if anything will serve to increase the number of people in c1/2/3 space.

This is a tangential argument at best. No one is saying that it's easy to find targets. I think I am on record for saying that it requires work.

There are a variety of places we do pvp, depending on how many people are available, what the w-space chains look like, how we're feeling that day and so on. Recently (say 6 months?), more often than not, the chains have been pretty sparse.

Nevertheless, whether or not the majority of my kills have been in w-space recently or not, this has no bearing on the argument being presented, which is about incentives.

I don't know how long you've been in w-space. I have been here for 3 years. I have certainly seen a drop in target numbers.

I'm not surprised. Starting with the Narwhals with their ruthless efficiency at extorting c3 residents, and then AHARM etc and the ascendancy of 40-man T3 gank fleets with perfect intel, I imagine life in a c3 or lower has become untenable. I am sure there is an easier and more lucrative living to be had elsewhere.

I'm afraid we have the hunter's dilemma. The more you kill, the less there is to kill. You have to manage your hunting grounds by incentivising people to live there. Ruthlessly exterminating them and then complaining that there is no more prey is just... daft.

A final note, I'd like to just address one of the elephants in the room.

Most w-space PVP is not what you might call real PVP. Dropping an overwhelming force onto defenceless pilots doing PVE who have no means of calling for backup can hardly be called PVP. It's actually cowardice dressed up as PVP. Like shooting lions from the safety of a safari truck. It probably seems like fun until you actually do it.

To add insult to injury, current w-space doctrine seems to be to kill the pods of the innocents that have just been ganked - like shooting the cub after killing the mother. This is also ridiculous. It guarantees that the victim cannot reship, regroup and come back to give you the fight you think you want, condemning you to another 20 wormhole rolls to find your next victim.

These days, if I am FCing a w-space execution of w-space carebears (sure, we execute carebears - but we don't live to execute carebears), I instruct people to let the pods live.

Sometimes people do actually reship (if we haven't dropped a ridiculously overwhelming force on them) and come back. Then there's a chance of a bit of fun.

The other advantage is that we end the encounter on much better terms than if I had simply senselessly murdered them. After all, what do I have to gain from blowing up a carebear's pod? Nothing will drop, and he'll just think I'm a moron.

Sure, killing a pod is strategically necessary in a large, even encounter. These only ever occur between a few c6 pvp corps.

So, i have an idea that would enable both parties to still have access to data :P

Move the system kill information to the system information window for W-space, BUT have it delayed to reflect that concord doesn't have fast access to the data in w-space due to its lack of gates, at the end of the day concord still generates killmails for kills in w-space and pend insurance still pays out for ship losses there, so its not even logical to assume that w-space is a complete unknown to both of thse NPC entities

This way you could have "some" idea of activity in WH space via the API and system information window but still allow that air of unknown with it being delayed, just my 2 cents ofc :P

I like this. I know this is the wrong place to post it, but wouldn't this step on the grounds of combat scanning? I'll post this in that topic section as well.


I guess I can't really say much, I've been in Wormholes for nearly 2 years now. I live in a Class 2, with dual statics. I've come across more empty holes, than occupied ones. When I do hit a c4 - c6, I usually find actives. Just last night, I ran into a asian group of guys, 20+ actives.

When I stated that wspace was dying, it was more for the c1 - c3. The other idea is to change Black Holes.

I just don't see wormholes getting the love they deserve. I mean, with all the new editions to nullsec, alliance owned stargates, and new conquerable space. What do wspace gets? Anyways, I'll stop posting, and read the responses now.

Read the topic again. This does not have anything to do with combat scanning. Combat probes find ships, drones, etc. The glimpse probes find debris and offers a mechanic to guestimate the age of said wreckage. It cannot find ships, signatures, or anything, for that matter, to warp to.

Hello again,

I hope you all had a wonderful weekend. I said that the game design department would have another review of this proposal here on Monday, and that meeting has come and gone.

The conclusions of the meeting, and having talked to the CSM9, is that we WILL be removing WHs from the kills endpoint. This means that NPC, pod, and ship kill counts for WH systems will no longer be available from the EVE API.

This is a change that should hopefully ship with Kronos.

We do appreciate all of the feedback provided on this topic as we work on the goal of creating a balanced hunter/hunted environment.