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Dev blog: Building better Worlds

First post First post First post
Author
Querns
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#41 - 2014-04-15 15:11:05 UTC
One artifact from this change: where does this leave Amarr Outposts? Currently, their advantage, compared to other outpost types, is that they have the largest number of raw manufacturing slots available for use. Does the new system have plans for mutating that advantage somehow to gel with the new system?

Could I be asking for information that's coming in a later devblog?

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#42 - 2014-04-15 15:12:31 UTC
What happens to a BPO in research/build in a pos when this change goes live? Is it moved to the POS, or does it remain in the station?

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.

Sir HyperChrist
Persnickety Pilots
#43 - 2014-04-15 15:14:54 UTC
I see a lot of improvements, most are just graphical clarifications, which is always great.

But also my "extra hassle" alarm goes off: I now have to make copies of my battleship-and-up (T2) bpo's in a station, then move those to a pos, for added buildspeed, or set those bpc's to build directly in station. It's more clicks than I have to do now, building in a pos, with the bpo in station, directly.

Will standing with the corp owning an empire station lower the fees on manufacturing and research? Adding some optimisation mechanic there would add gameplay for otherwise passive industry alts. Maybe an idea....

Part of problems I saw come up after the reprocessing blog, about compressed ores becoming the new default material unit for transport, but those only being built in Rorquals in null-sec, are solved. Mining corps can now easily put up pos for compression, providing steady market supply of compressed ore in empire. Thankyou for that :)

Still, allowing industrial cores on Orca's would even be easier: Compress during the mining op, instead of afterwards.

I'm really curious bout what you're planning with "Teams" !

Keep up the good work, see you in 2 weeks

-SHC
CCP Phantom
C C P
C C P Alliance
#44 - 2014-04-15 15:16:51 UTC
Please refrain from personal attacks, trolling and off topic posts - thank you.

CCP Phantom - Senior Community Developer

Paul Otichoda
Perkone
Caldari State
#45 - 2014-04-15 15:17:54 UTC
So those 6 months grinding standings for a high sec POS has been wasted?

I must say this rather does remove much need to have high standings with a faction and not a corporation now
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#46 - 2014-04-15 15:18:47 UTC
Hmm always wondered what these blue blueprint things were... must of saved hundreds of the damn things from all the exploring...

No Worries

David Magnus
#47 - 2014-04-15 15:19:36 UTC  |  Edited by: David Magnus
I sincerely hope that you have fully thought through the BPO changes.

Having to move BPOs around and not being able to leave them locked down, or lock them down in a POS is an open invitation to corp theft.

Removing the usefulness of this basic protection will only encourage people to make 1-man corps and discourage anyone from working together once they have any BPO of significant value. BPOs are one of the only assets that have lasting, significant, and appreciating value. You may think that adjusting the risk/reward on these will spark more gameplay, but it will only encourage people to play solo.

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Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#48 - 2014-04-15 15:19:45 UTC
also, w/r/t this:

Quote:
Reduce copy time on all blueprints to be less time consuming than manufacturing something out of it. This gives the option to use blueprint copies to build items at Starbases without risking the original.


will you be looking at runs as well? for example, bpcs of capital ship components are hilariously useless as they're capped at 5 runs, so you need to reinstall every eight hours or so if you wanted to use them, a huge slowdown unless you can reinstall like clockwork

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.

Corraidhin Farsaidh
Singularity Expedition Services
Singularity Syndicate
#49 - 2014-04-15 15:20:19 UTC
Good to see changes coming through from the forums I've been active in, certainly feels like the player base have been listened to on many things here.
Magnus Cortex
Ginger Industrial Solutions
Goonswarm Federation
#50 - 2014-04-15 15:20:49 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
So those 6 months grinding standings for a high sec POS has been wasted?


Its not wasted, it let you have a highsec pos when they required standings...
Thead Enco
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#51 - 2014-04-15 15:21:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Thead Enco
Altrue wrote:
First :DDamn!

I started reading and I really like the whole "splitting in six", it helps give each change its spotlight while splitting discussions, and integration of what these change means, for the average player.

Edit :

1- I don't like the icons on the show info of bill of materials. They are very 2003. The whole gratient background and stuff. Their shape in itself is also quite.. meh :D. You should make these icons in line visually with the little skillbook on the ship show info.

2 - The line "After summer, R.A.M. and R.db will instead behave like any other material in the game. However, to keep loss ratios similar l we will:" contains a typo. There is a "I we" that snuck inside the final devblog :p

3 - Kuddos for the removal of Extra Materials!!!

4 - Cost scaling system for industry jobs, hahaha so evil Twisted. Sounds awesome! (Also stealth isk sink) IMHO, limiting it to 14% of the base item is way too low as a hard cap, but thats my opinion.

5 - "The Blueprints in question can be researched remotely, by installing them at a station while using a Starbase Mobile Laboratory in the same solar system. With the removal of slots this use case is no longer that important, as we expect research slots to be widely more available." o_O I didn't know that! Seems broken, happy that it goes away.

6 - POSes in high-sec without standing requirements? Cool! But we still need a way to easily remove offline POSes !!

7 - And this last teaser of the new industry UI... Aaawww so sweeeeeeet!!



Answer to number 6, Wardec>Blap POS>WIN
Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#52 - 2014-04-15 15:22:39 UTC
CCP RubberBAND wrote:
We've been dying to talk about these changes and can't wait for your feedback.


Moving away from a fixed npc pricing structure like this appears to be a good thing.

Actually on reflection, I see that it should drive players to re-distribute themselves and their possessions to less centralised locations. Ships could die, possessions could be lost, this is all good.




on an un-related note ....
Can the same thing be done to trading in general with regard to sales taxes and broker fees ?
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#53 - 2014-04-15 15:23:39 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
So those 6 months grinding standings for a high sec POS has been wasted?

I must say this rather does remove much need to have high standings with a faction and not a corporation now

Which is probably the entire point, since it was a ****** mechanic that just encouraged painful grinding, alt corp usage or manipulating the mechanics to work around the limitation. Mainly pain and workarounds instead of worthwhile gameplay.
Yinmatook
Skilled Refugees
#54 - 2014-04-15 15:26:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Yinmatook
The major problem with putting anything out into a POS is that there is NO way to see what is out there from the game client unless you are physically at it and can open the modules to look. Of course, you can fire up jEVEAssets and get that entire list from the API...

With these Industry changes and now the requirement to place your BPO/BPC out in the POS, I certainly hope that the game client will be able to see what you have out there (you know, like with the Corportation->Assets->Search interface).
CCP RubberBAND
CCP Engineering Corp
#55 - 2014-04-15 15:26:52 UTC
Kitty Bear wrote:
CCP RubberBAND wrote:
We've been dying to talk about these changes and can't wait for your feedback.


Moving away from a fixed npc pricing structure like this appears to be a good thing.

Actually on reflection, I see that it should drive players to re-distribute themselves and their possessions to less centralised locations. Ships could die, possessions could be lost, this is all good.




on an un-related note ....
Can the same thing be done to trading in general with regard to sales taxes and broker fees ?


A couple of the follow up blogs should elaborate on this, but yes, the idea is that there is a more dynamic spread of players invested in Industry which should lead to a more interesting and dynamic landscape.

Sales tax and broker fees are a completely separate system, not something within scope of these changes though certainly an interesting idea.

Feel free to poke me on: Twitter

Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#56 - 2014-04-15 15:27:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Unless I misunderstand, it is misleading to state station manufacturing slots are being removed: they are becoming unlimited.

Does this apply to outposts as well as NPC stations?

I am curious how that works with POS assembly lines; do they remain slotted?


EDIT: I think I need to read the blog a few more times.
Thead Enco
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#57 - 2014-04-15 15:29:19 UTC
David Magnus wrote:
I sincerely hope that you have fully thought through the BPO changes.

Having to move BPOs around and not being able to leave them locked down, or lock them down in a POS is an open invitation to corp theft.

Removing the usefulness of this basic protection will only encourage people to make 1-man corps and discourage anyone from working together once they have any BPO of significant value. BPOs are one of the only assets that have lasting, significant, and appreciating value. You may think think that adjusting the risk/reward on these will spark more gameplay, but it will only encourage people to play solo.


If people want to play solo who is anyone to tell them how to play their game. And if people are going to store their T2 BPO's and Capital BPO's then they deserve their **** to get jacked. This is EVE!
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#58 - 2014-04-15 15:30:36 UTC
About being able to anchor POSes anywhere in high sec: Does that mean the very high security systems will become available? For example, right now you cannot anchor a POS in a 1.0 system. Will that change?

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Tetania
Wildly Inappropriate
Goonswarm Federation
#59 - 2014-04-15 15:32:02 UTC
Ok. I'm intrigued and I'll wait patiently for the rest of the plan to be unveiled.

As someone who builds Titans I'd just like to get another voice behind considerations for POS building.

Reducing copy time would certainly be viable for Hull Building after a brief delay to get copies started after the first post patch build that will be fine.

Components tho. Assuming a 1man corp which is going to be a must without lockdown. You still need to keep either 30Bil of BPOs in a POS anc choose betwen gambling on a successful defense or destroying around 20Bil in minerals to retrieve the BPOs while the POS is being reinforced. Or drastically increase your hauling from Refine minerals in station and haul to POS in system. To Refine minerals in Station and haul through a stargate to an Amarr station and then haul components from station to POS to build the ship off a BPC.

I already use 8 freighters multiboxed and consider the existing movement excessive. This would be hundreds of trips.

Upping the copies on a component BPC to 45-50 would be start as long as copy time is <= build time.

Otherwise allowing mineral recovery when jobs are cancelled would be an option but it forces a very very high attention level on POSes and makes eve a literal job to avoid catastrophic loss of assets.

I know supercap builders are the 1% but please don't make the extreme edge cases of ****** mechanics worse for us.
Squelch
Honestly We didnt know
Riddle us this
#60 - 2014-04-15 15:32:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Squelch
Soz if this has already been mentioned, but where you mention the new R.A.M requirements (in your example, you'll need 60 R.A.M where you needed 1 before), that will effectivley de-value any current stocks of R.A.M by a huge amount (example, 60 times less valuable).

Will existing stocks be multiplied to compensate, or is this something that players with R.A.M stocks will just have to deal with?

Additionally, will existing sources of R.A.M items have their drop quantities increased?