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Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
#5241 - 2014-03-27 14:20:39 UTC
olan2005 wrote:
The control to end this was completely in Erotica1 hands . Ultimate responsibility is with the scammer Erotica1 for this entire situation
Actually the client ultimately has more control over the situation. It can't even begin without their consent.

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lollerwaffle
Perkone
Caldari State
#5242 - 2014-03-27 14:20:41 UTC
LordOfDespair wrote:
lollerwaffle wrote:
LordOfDespair wrote:
lollerwaffle wrote:

Nope. Still the same one liner. Try again.


Assuming you deserve anything more. Cute.

Try again. Dismissing arguments with one liners is pretty weak. I'm sorry if I was brought up to have the decency of reading and responding to the opinions of other people by at least providing coherent points. It's not my fault the way you turned out.

Or as you would put it:
You're stupid and wrong lol

You just strawmanned again. Way to prove my point. All I had to do was give you one liners. Imagine if I actually tried to give you a reasonable argument.

Now you see why is pointless to take you seriously.

So you have no arguments? Gotcha.

Just come out and say it, you don't have to keep beating around the bush with one-liners.
Ssieth
Celestial Inc
Dracarys.
#5243 - 2014-03-27 14:21:12 UTC
It's pretty pure and simple really. If this is the sort of behaviour that CCP are happy to be associated with EVE then they need do nothing but shrug and say "it's the nature of EVE, live with it".

If they don't want this sort of behaviour to be associated with EVE then they need to take a strong stance (altering EULA if required).

Sittining in the middle doing nothing looks a bit weak no matter what they think.

W-Spacer.  Bittervet. 75% PvP, 25% assorted other stuff.
Prince Kobol
#5244 - 2014-03-27 14:22:18 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Prince Kobol wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Salvos Rhoska wrote:


This is the community expressing its condemnation of Erotica1's conduct.


No, this is a segment of the community expressing it's condemnation, and expecting that condemnation to translate into direct action against a person who broke no definitive rules. And it's wrong.

I and other members of this community are not condemning Erotica1 (though we are not necessarily condoning it either).

But we recognize the fact that not only was what Sohkar did worse than anything Erotica1 did or could have done to precipitate it, but also the response of the enraged portion of the community (asking for his expulsion and wishing physical violence on him) is also worse than what Erotcia1 does.

You don't fix the ills of a society by being worse than the ills you want to fix. That only works in action movies.


Whilst the rules are not definitive, they rarely are for a reason, there is certainly the room in them for CCP to declare if E1 was in wrong and punish him.


And doing so would be wrong. Even so, if he gets punished and the racist death threat guy doesn't, that would be a worse wrong.



Missed part of my post as I was in the middle of an edit but I will guess that your point will still stand.

I actually agree, whilst he said those words whilst he was in a state of distress, apologised and may regret them now, he should still receive a ban, not perma, but at least say 2 weeks minimum although I would still advocate E1 being perma banned.
LordOfDespair
Deep Dark Fantasy.
#5245 - 2014-03-27 14:22:38 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
LordOfDespair wrote:
lollerwaffle wrote:
LordOfDespair wrote:
lollerwaffle wrote:

Nope. Still the same one liner. Try again.


Assuming you deserve anything more. Cute.

Try again. Dismissing arguments with one liners is pretty weak. I'm sorry if I was brought up to have the decency of reading and responding to the opinions of other people by at least providing coherent points. It's not my fault the way you turned out.

Or as you would put it:
You're stupid and wrong lol

You just strawmanned again. Way to prove my point. All I had to do was give you one liners. Imagine if I actually tried to give you a reasonable argument.

Now you see why is pointless to take you seriously.


Strawman...

You keep using this word as if you think you know what it means.

Could you tell us please? And also, provide an example. Thanks. Just so that we know how we should be arguing with you from now on.


Google it and educate yourself pleb.

Keep saying it because that's all people are doing.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5246 - 2014-03-27 14:22:56 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
But we recognize the fact that not only was what Sohkar did worse than anything Erotica1 did or could have done to precipitate it, but also the response of the enraged portion of the community (asking for his expulsion and wishing physical violence on him) is also worse than what Erotcia1 does.


Yeah that Sohkar is a real bad guy, without reason or prior provocation he just logs on to E1's TS server and verbally abuse him, and that was exactly what happen, E1 is clearly the victim here!

and now it's time to snort 2cb mixed with ketamine, and smoke some dmt.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Mario Putzo
#5247 - 2014-03-27 14:23:06 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Prince Kobol wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Salvos Rhoska wrote:


This is the community expressing its condemnation of Erotica1's conduct.


No, this is a segment of the community expressing it's condemnation, and expecting that condemnation to translate into direct action against a person who broke no definitive rules. And it's wrong.

I and other members of this community are not condemning Erotica1 (though we are not necessarily condoning it either).

But we recognize the fact that not only was what Sohkar did worse than anything Erotica1 did or could have done to precipitate it, but also the response of the enraged portion of the community (asking for his expulsion and wishing physical violence on him) is also worse than what Erotcia1 does.

You don't fix the ills of a society by being worse than the ills you want to fix. That only works in action movies.


Whilst the rules are not definitive, they rarely are for a reason, there is certainly the room in them for CCP to declare if E1 was in wrong and punish him.


And doing so would be wrong. Even so, if he gets punished and the racist death threat guy doesn't, that would be a worse wrong.


and the blogger whose continued harassment of Erotica 1 and Sohkar solely to capitalize on page views, also went unpunished that would also be wrong.
lollerwaffle
Perkone
Caldari State
#5248 - 2014-03-27 14:23:35 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
LordOfDespair wrote:
lollerwaffle wrote:
LordOfDespair wrote:
lollerwaffle wrote:

Nope. Still the same one liner. Try again.


Assuming you deserve anything more. Cute.

Try again. Dismissing arguments with one liners is pretty weak. I'm sorry if I was brought up to have the decency of reading and responding to the opinions of other people by at least providing coherent points. It's not my fault the way you turned out.

Or as you would put it:
You're stupid and wrong lol

You just strawmanned again. Way to prove my point. All I had to do was give you one liners. Imagine if I actually tried to give you a reasonable argument.

Now you see why is pointless to take you seriously.


Strawman...

You keep using this word as if you think you know what it means.

Could you tell us please? And also, provide an example. Thanks. Just so that we know how we should be arguing with you from now on.

If he had something, or could even state an example of how I was 'strawmanning', don't you think he would have done so by now?
Korhaka Mirunas
Doomheim
#5249 - 2014-03-27 14:24:19 UTC
Since this incident I have been able to use it to start a conversation with multiple people about EVE, then used that to get 2 people to start a trial and another to return to the game.

If used right there is no such thing as bad publicity.

We need T3 Shuttles!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PiR5Q72kT1U
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#5250 - 2014-03-27 14:24:38 UTC
dexington wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
But we recognize the fact that not only was what Sohkar did worse than anything Erotica1 did or could have done to precipitate it, but also the response of the enraged portion of the community (asking for his expulsion and wishing physical violence on him) is also worse than what Erotcia1 does.


Yeah that Sohkar is a real bad guy, without reason or prior provocation he just logs on to E1's TS server and verbally abuse him, and that was exactly what happen, E1 is clearly the victim here!

and now it's time to snort 2cb mixed with ketamine, and smoke some dmt.


So, it's ok to spew death threats and obscenely racist statements as long as someone on the internet made you mad?

Provocation does not equal vindication. Especially when the "provocation" is as flimsy as this.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Prince Kobol
#5251 - 2014-03-27 14:24:53 UTC
dexington wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
But we recognize the fact that not only was what Sohkar did worse than anything Erotica1 did or could have done to precipitate it, but also the response of the enraged portion of the community (asking for his expulsion and wishing physical violence on him) is also worse than what Erotcia1 does.


Yeah that Sohkar is a real bad guy, without reason or prior provocation he just logs on to E1's TS server and verbally abuse him, and that was exactly what happen, E1 is clearly the victim here!

and now it's time to snort 2cb mixed with ketamine, and smoke some dmt.


Not to subject Sohkar to a ban will open a door nobody wants to see. There is no excuse for ever using racist language.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#5252 - 2014-03-27 14:25:18 UTC
Ssieth wrote:
It's pretty pure and simple really. If this is the sort of behaviour that CCP are happy to be associated with EVE then they need do nothing but shrug and say "it's the nature of EVE, live with it".

If they don't want this sort of behaviour to be associated with EVE then they need to take a strong stance (altering EULA if required).

Sittining in the middle doing nothing looks a bit weak no matter what they think.


If you're talking about the carebears hauling pitchforks up to Ero's doorstep, then yes, CCP needs to start cleaning up this thread. Better yet, lock it and be done with it. Because no behaviour has been worse than that on display in this thread by the carebears with the pitchforks wishing for harmful things to befall Ero IRL. Not even Sokhar's.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Regis Solo
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#5253 - 2014-03-27 14:26:12 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Regis Solo wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
LordOfDespair wrote:


You guys try to justify ANYTHING, no wonder you think what E1 is doing is okay.


That, or I just don't like lynch mobs summoned up by Ripard Teg.


Lynch mob is a bit extreme, he's only calling for Erotica 1 to be banned from a simple computer game.


Cyber-Lynch mob then.

Oh and there have been calls in this thread for actual physical violence towards Erotica1.


That is not Ripard's fault, he did not call for people to be violent towards Ero. The people in this thread are responsible for their own comments.
Prince Kobol
#5254 - 2014-03-27 14:26:21 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Prince Kobol wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Salvos Rhoska wrote:


This is the community expressing its condemnation of Erotica1's conduct.


No, this is a segment of the community expressing it's condemnation, and expecting that condemnation to translate into direct action against a person who broke no definitive rules. And it's wrong.

I and other members of this community are not condemning Erotica1 (though we are not necessarily condoning it either).

But we recognize the fact that not only was what Sohkar did worse than anything Erotica1 did or could have done to precipitate it, but also the response of the enraged portion of the community (asking for his expulsion and wishing physical violence on him) is also worse than what Erotcia1 does.

You don't fix the ills of a society by being worse than the ills you want to fix. That only works in action movies.


Whilst the rules are not definitive, they rarely are for a reason, there is certainly the room in them for CCP to declare if E1 was in wrong and punish him.


And doing so would be wrong. Even so, if he gets punished and the racist death threat guy doesn't, that would be a worse wrong.


and the blogger whose continued harassment of Erotica 1 and Sohkar solely to capitalize on page views, also went unpunished that would also be wrong.


In case Themittani / Evenews24 would of been shut down years ago
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#5255 - 2014-03-27 14:26:41 UTC
LordOfDespair wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:


Strawman...

You keep using this word as if you think you know what it means.

Could you tell us please? And also, provide an example. Thanks. Just so that we know how we should be arguing with you from now on.


Google it and educate yourself pleb.

Keep saying it because that's all people are doing.



Oh I know what strawman means.

I'm trying to give you an opportunity to show us that you do too.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
lollerwaffle
Perkone
Caldari State
#5256 - 2014-03-27 14:26:42 UTC
Prince Kobol wrote:
dexington wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
But we recognize the fact that not only was what Sohkar did worse than anything Erotica1 did or could have done to precipitate it, but also the response of the enraged portion of the community (asking for his expulsion and wishing physical violence on him) is also worse than what Erotcia1 does.


Yeah that Sohkar is a real bad guy, without reason or prior provocation he just logs on to E1's TS server and verbally abuse him, and that was exactly what happen, E1 is clearly the victim here!

and now it's time to snort 2cb mixed with ketamine, and smoke some dmt.


Not to subject Sohkar to a ban will open a door nobody wants to see. There is no excuse for ever using racist language.

I could live with racist language. RL death threats, or threats of bodily harm, are a different matter altogether.
PinkPanter
Valhalla Drinking Team
#5257 - 2014-03-27 14:26:46 UTC
David Kir wrote:
olan2005 wrote:


I think you hit the nail on the head with that . Where is the line in these situations. For all discussions and commentators most agree, myself including scamming is fine. But once scam is completed and you have all possible assets extracted , is it ok to prolong the ordeal for the sucker ( victime , self inflicted) for tear extraction as it is called in-game. Should the EULA be more stringent on that aspect of scamming. Me personally i say yes . As for punshment i will disagree , there should be perma ban for Erotica1 for taking it too far, then putting this public domain which has a consequence for the whole community. There should be a temp ban for the sucker (victim ,self inflicted ) for the racism , and threats that followed. Why the lesser punishment . He was under self inflicted emotional duress, which was not completely under his control as his assets where being held to ransom , by that he had to play or loose everything he built up in his eve carrier . Coercion is used by Erotica1 , the scenario was set up by erotica1 , The control to end this was completely in Erotica1 hands . Ultimate responsibility is with the scammer Erotica1 for this entire situation



You have all of my respect; this is one of the few rational responses I have seen on this thread.


Pretty much.
Just gonna quote cause tired of replying same thing over and over and over again.
LordOfDespair
Deep Dark Fantasy.
#5258 - 2014-03-27 14:27:12 UTC
Korhaka Mirunas wrote:
Since this incident I have been able to use it to start a conversation with multiple people about EVE, then used that to get 2 people to start a trial and another to return to the game.

If used right there is no such thing as bad publicity.

Prove it.
SKINE DMZ
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5259 - 2014-03-27 14:27:17 UTC  |  Edited by: SKINE DMZ
Wow Erotica, the amount of **** you get is unbelievable, extremely greedy gullible idiots who are being "bullied" online... I mean they don't even have a way out, not like they can click the disconnect button right?

(also DJ is a raging idiot everyone knows it, some even like it)


http://funkybacon.blogspot.co.uk/2014/03/eve-il-online-and-incredibly-silly-mr.html

I disagree
Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
#5260 - 2014-03-27 14:27:50 UTC
Regis Solo wrote:
That is not Ripard's fault, he did not call for people to be violent towards Ero. The people in this thread are responsible for their own comments.
"I didn't tell anyone to burn her, I just called her a witch"

Compelling tale comrade

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