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Not going to get involved with the main debate, but just wanted to mention:

If a Siphon has 100k EHP, they're going to be really annoying to kill with anything but POS guns. So the idea that people who "use their space" will be protected is not really effective. Most members of the corp/alliance that has the moon are not able to use the POS guns (both permissions, and the anchoring 5 requirement to train the skill).

So if a guy sees a siphon on one of his alliance towers and wants to get rid of it, they'd have to shoot the thing for almost 2 minutes even with a high-dps BS or T3 BC. Much longer with a ship that someone might fly as a roaming patrol. That's a pretty annoying chore when they can be pooped out by the dozen.


With the things costing 10mil and being incredibly spammable, I'd hope you go with the very low side of that proposed EHP. If the idea is to promote nullsec alliances having better cooperation and "living in their space", it's dumb to make them into bricks that need to be shot with POS guns to clear.

POS guns take a long time to lock and these have no anchor or online timers. You can launch one and immediately warp off.

POS guns are ****, so they'll be really annoying to kill with those too.

Some people have never played around a hostile pos I see

Indeed, and because of this I'm surprised that you've failed to see the potential for your alliance.

As you say, your alliance will be much better placed to deal with the consequences than your competitors, while you also have a playerbase with the numbers and penchant for griefing that will be able to make full use of this module in hostile space. The siphon meshes perfectly with Goons' public philosophy.

But remember, you don't need to check every POS, just use dscan. Hell, probes are probably even easier.

nerf afk cloaking siphons

Remember when cfc people were saying to nerf tech

That's cool spin, Aryth, but if you think you won't be one of the larger impacted, based solely on the amount of POS towers/moons you guys will now have to babysit or lose income, you're mistaken, or, as I said, nice try to spin it. Even if your response is "oh we'll have our mighty numbers check POSes around them," you'll still have to wonder if Joe Regulargoon is going to 1) steal the profits for themselves and report everything is fine or 2) actually say that they destroyed a siphon. My guess is they'll sneak over to the siphon and collect the bounty for themselves.

I think these siphon units are gold for CCP's goal of creating harass/nuisances for POS owners. Imagine this: the incentive will be to build a POS and cultivate its spoils. If you are inattentive to it, then you lose out. Simple as that. It's even better when you consider that wormholers will be able to take hundreds of these throwaway deployables back to their homes with them, pop out wherever the exits take them, deploy their theft units--just to harass--and be on their way. Some random pilot shows up (cloaky, of course, because he's in a new SOE ship) and collects from the siphons.

Wonderful modules, CCP. Just by reading all the nullhurt in this thread indicates that you're on the right direction. It's when all the nullblocs are raving about the changes--highsec POCOS--that you really ought to be concerned.

I like what I've seen so far!

Thread moving fast, so will ask (and suggest) again.

These Siphons must provide players will Structure Killmails, like most other deployable Alliance-level-Warfare Structures do.

Simply be providing players with a statistic reward (a kill) for destroying them, it will create the impetus for some players to want to scan them down and pop them for their Alliances/Corporations.

It's also backed by the idea that killmails are for conflict/war. A Siphon is direct economic warfare via theft. Killing it is like killing a POS itself, or killing an SBU.

Make these give killmails.

EDIT: Dev Reply, nice. Thank you for clarification, and good job thinking this through. Kudos.