These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[Rubicon] Marauder rebalancing

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
marVLs
#1741 - 2013-09-03 14:13:10 UTC
I'm w8ing for round two (maybe even more...) because no way this is acceptable.

Overall transforming idea is good, something new, fresh and sure will bring new players to game, but those bonuses lacks usefulness and target. They need to be the best at PVE, they're specialized T2 ships ffs...
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#1742 - 2013-09-03 14:22:36 UTC
CCP Ytterbium wrote:
Alright, ran some more tests on our internal servers with suggested changes.

Feedback suggested I ran Buzzkill or Worlds Collide without the web bonus on the Kronos to see how well the ship fared. Challenge accepted. Needless to say it was a slaughter. For the NPCs that is P


Drones: 5x Warrior II - you don't need them anyway. Might as well be Peanut Butter II drones for that matter.


With the Tracking Computer II running with range script, I get 1220 DPS with turrets alone at 6.7km Range + 41.2km Falloff on Federation Navy Antimatter, or 973 DPS at 18.82km + 57.6km with Null Shocked Yes, yes, that's theoretical falloff damage, but I think that's good enough to compete with Pirate Battleships. You also have MWD + MJD combo to get in range of anything.

I typically use rails on my mission Kronos on TQ (I've got all 4 Marauders on one of my characters), but with this kind of projection I'll switch to blasters. Oh yes, my precious. So fresh, so shiny, oh yes precious blaster cannons, tastes like a delicious croissant. And the above setup can be pimped more. It's something I've put in 5mins, pretty sure it's not optimized and you'll find holes in it. Who cares, you get the idea.


How to wreck things in missions?

Warp in, activate Bastion, use extra projection with Null to smash frigate NPCs while they are closing in (I usually have transversal or radial velocity as overview column to know which ones I should shoot first). Once they're orbiting and you can't hit them anymore, smash cruisers and higher NPCs with Null or Navy Antimatter depending on range. Optional: use drones to kill frigates while dealing with bigger NPCs. Shooting frigates with blasters is a waste when you can let drones do it while you waste other targets.

If all that's left are frigates orbiting you and don't want drones to be shot, wait for Bastion mode to run out (best to anticipate one cycle in advance so you don't have to wait), activate MJD. At 100km away, activate Bastion again, wait for them to come in and smash them to pieces. Sure, you aren't going to do full damage in falloff, but even at 60-70km, all it takes is a single good hit on 4 grouped blasters to wreck them.

Having some battleship NPCs sitting at long range? (quite rare) At more than 50km, use MJD, turn around, then MWD. Less than 50km, just MWD. Funniest moment was the Serpentis / Guristas 120km spawn in Worlds Collide level 4 first room. Jumped straight into the Guristas spawn, then activated Bastion: laughed as they helplessly tried to jam my Kronos while I smashed them to bit at close range. Pay back time for the 1346321 times I got helplessly jammed. That was just my own experience here, your mileage may vary, of course.


Other examples in Bastion (main weapon damage only, no drones here with tech2 weapons, faction WU mods similar on the Kronos setup above). Numbers may be off depending on setup / typos, I'll leave you guys to correct me.


  • Paladin with Megapulses and Scorch: 817 DPS at 92km range +21km Falloff. Or 1025 DPS at 31km range +21km falloff with Imperial Navy Multifreq.
  • Paladin with Tachyons and Navy Multifreq: 969 DPS at 67km range + 52 Falloff.
  • Golem with Fury Cruises: 946 DPS at 208km range (with rigs, they have 361m explosion radius, 125m/s explosion velocity and 13km/s velocity) Or 776 DPS with Navy Cruises.
  • Golem with Caldari Navy Torps: 1002 DPS at 37km range (they have 243m explosion radius, 133.125 m/s explosion velocity and 4.2km/s velocity)
  • Vargur with 800mm autocannons II with Republic Fleet EMP: 955 DPS at 4km range + 68.8km falloff
  • Vargur with 1400mm artilleries, with Republic Fleet EMP: 720DPS at 43km range+134km falloff


    • Oh yes, and forgot to mention with a proper deadspace X-L shield booster and a good tank, a single Vargur or Golem can tank the first wave of a Vanguard Incursion by itself. Sure, damage isn't that good when you do (you can't use cap booster, go through charges too fast, thus have to go for cap stable Evil), but the fact remains it's still possible. Even discussing that very fact with other designers as it most likely is far too OP for PvE.


    So while there are still concerns for PvP, I don't think you realize how efficient those things are for PvE. We feel like Dr. Frankenstein looking at a slab with a half-decaying corpses coming back to life. We've created monsters. Mission / PvE efficiency is not all about pure damage. It's also about mobility, projection and time you spend shooting. MJD + MWD helps with the first, Bastion plus new Kronos / Paladin bonuses give the second and EW immunity grants you the last.

    As such we are definitely not going to give any kind of damage bonus in Bastion mode - if we ever did, it would be by severely penalizing turret tracking / missile explosion velocity when in Bastion mode, which would severally limit their use in PvE.


Hope this wall of text helps a bit (PvE side, as I said, we aren't talking about PvP in this post).

Also, here is a preview of the transformation mode on the Kronos.


Wonderful, you have managed to get through WC with the Kronos on your private server.
Now, how about letting us test under less controlled conditions.
Because I simply don't believe you that it is a more effective ship.
I am talking all the Marauders.

Regardless of what you say, you have nerfed the damage by hammering the drone bay, and removing the web bonus is critical for a ton of players. Sure sure, it hits with more effective damage at range. But I will not believe a word about how you deal with scramming frigs until I do it myself and see player feedback from Sisi.

And BTW, using cap boosters is NOT how people fly a PvE ship.
Cade Windstalker
#1743 - 2013-09-03 14:29:41 UTC
Ele Rebellion wrote:
I have major concerns about both the PvP and PvE capabilities that the Bastion Marauders will have... I'm going to use the Kronos here as example since it is the one I'm most familiar with.

First off, The damage output seems to be lacking. With max skills there is a 25% bonus plus the 100% role bonus. Apply that to 4 hybrids and you have the equivalent of 10 (4 x 1.25 x 2 = 10). Without any bonus from the bastion module the dps will still still fall behind the Vindicator (8 x 1.375 = 11) .. I know you said you don't want its damage output to surpass the Vindicator, but it wouldn't make sense to me for a ship that goes into a special mode to still fall behind in damage output... Now that with the price comparable to a Vindicator and the fact that it can't receive remote reps, why would anyone take these in a fleet?


It makes perfect sense. These ships are favoring damage application and tank over raw DPS. The Pirate Battleships post-rebalance will probably end up looking like shiny Attack Battleships favoring DPS and speed over tank and application.

These are also not meant to be PvP god-boats, they're pretty clearly PvE focused but the Bastion mod should give them at least a little niche PvP usefulness. This does not meant they are intended to be the core of every fleet comp, that's just going to lead to power creep and another Flavor of the Month fleet that's hilariously over-priced.

Ele Rebellion wrote:
Another issue. removing the stasis web bonus and nerfing the drone bay and bandwidth eliminates its use in most level 4 security missions. Reason being is how is this thing supposed to hit a frigate? I thought well just MJD away and then shoot frigates from distance.. but then as I was running a level 4 in my SNI it occured to me.. What would a Kronos pilot do if they were fighting a frigate that had them scrammed and was low on drones. (since to use MJD the Kronos would have to exit Bastion and spool the MJD; making it susceptible to EW) ..without a web bonus it would be near impossible to hit a fast moving frigate.


They do still hae drones and while I'll admit I'd like more drone-bay if I'm going through more than one or two T2 Light Drones in a mission I'm doing it pretty wrong, doubly so if I'm only using them on targets within 10km (easy recall distance). So if I'm "low on drones" I should probably go get some more.

Ele Rebellion wrote:
So what would the use of one of these really be? I can't seem to find one. Some people have suggested POS Bashing in High Sec or SubCap WHs, but wouldn't a buffer shield tanked Vindicator with dps fit (and better drone bay/bandwidth) be more effective with a T2 Logistics cruiser behind it? (I've never seen anyone go POS Bash solo.)

The advantages are of the bastion are Range, EW Immunity, Resist, and self Reps.


Yes, but you don't have to fit Bastion. The Kronos with logi behind it will rep more than a Vindi because of better resists.

Overall though if you're going to bring a logi supported fleet to a POS bash you bring Attack Battlecruisers with lasers.

Again, niche use.

Ele Rebellion wrote:
Only thing I see that is really going to benefit from this is the Golems. They are keeping their target painter bonus, shield rep bonus, and explosion velocity bonus. Plus gaining the bastion bonuses. Currently my SNI with good skills and a couple implants, Gist X-Type XL shield booster and Gist X-Type XL boost amplifier reps around 1200 every 4 seconds.. those two modules on a Golem in bastion mode with its bonuses (not including the 1.1 10% bonus to that repper) is going to be sitting around 3,500 every 4 secs and will have the range to use Torps in PvE. (not to mention that the 3,500 every 4 seconds only cost around 180GJ per cycle on max skills so it will be EASILY cap stable)


More likely you'll be able to downgrade the repper and drop the boost amp for a perma-running fit and more damage application mods like target painters or the missile mods Rise hinted at.

Ele Rebellion wrote:
The Paladin is in the same boat as the Kronos. Its loosing stasis web bonuses for more range that it don't really need, and its still lacking in reps and cap (since armor repping ships need 2 reps to even come close to competing with 1 shield rep)

The Vargur is in the middle. Its going to have the Golem's defence and reps, but its still going to have the issues of hitting smaller targets.

CCP, Please take this one back to the drawing boards.. I really want to see the Marauders rebalanced (and I love the idea of a Mini-Dread), but I feel that this isn't the way to do it.

Oh, and almost forgot... Why the HP nerfs to Shields and Armor but bonus to Hull? These things already have WAY less hp than the pirate faction ships... and why does the Kronos have 8600 Hull HP but only 7200 Armor HP if its supposed to be an Armor tank? (Armor repair bonuses)


Except that with an MJD and more range it can apply higher damage at range through higher damage ammo.

At long range tracking and issues hitting smaller targets cease to be an issue (seriously try a mission like Mordu's Headhunters with a long range turret BS, the frigates and cruisers never get near you).

About the only thing you have a point on here is the various HP levels which are probably due to balancing their EHP against hilarious buffer fits, though I'll admit having more shields than armor on an armor bonused ship doesn't make much sense.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#1744 - 2013-09-03 15:03:03 UTC
Mournful Conciousness wrote:

Maybe it's not the marauders that need to change. Maybe it's just that the players need some education and leadership in marauder use?


This is EVE Online, where people actually think Tengus are super awesome for sleeper sites, and that Lokis and Legions make any kind of sense in sleeper sites. On a more serious note, marauders take what, 3-4 times(?) longer to train to an optimal level than T3s.

That said, I've seen marauders 5-6 times in w-space for PVE purposes. I'm also considering moving back to wormholes just so I can bait bads with a Kronos.

.
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#1745 - 2013-09-03 15:03:04 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
The Pirate Battleships post-rebalance will probably end up looking like shiny Attack Battleships favoring DPS and speed over tank and application.


yea, the nightmare and sentry rattler are known for being speed demons.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#1746 - 2013-09-03 15:04:14 UTC
I absolutely doubt that those bastion-marauders will not have impact on pvp. Maybe insignificant for low/null, but they got great traits for whs so far. Putting aside c5 and up engaging people you know will drop dreads - that aside, they make for excellent addition to any small fleet you got. Their invulnerabilty to ewar while bastioned, combined with dual-heavy-cap-boost and DAT HOLD makes for nice applications. It mostly acts like/similiar to a guardian-replacement regarding the rep-output. The rangelimitation is a hindrance, but nothing people can't overcome.

The achievable tank also falls pretty decently into the magnitude needed for smaller wh brawls (with around 6-8k), matching around 3 guards repairing a t3)

The concept of MWD+bastion till now appears to bump the align far beyond 100seconds, which would mean that sieging at 1km/s would make you leave bastion after a minute at something 300-400m/s I'd guess wildly. Afaik webs can't be activated on those sieged targets (I rarely try to web sieged webs atleast), so there is pretty much nothing one can do to alter your trajectory.

Looking at the Paladin/Vargur, quite a bunch of ideas to deploy them are coming to mind...
Cade Windstalker
#1747 - 2013-09-03 15:17:26 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Its amazing to see so many bears screaming for an I win ship with no drawbacks.



Because null sec and low sec people never do that, nope nope nope Blink

Seriously though, I'm amazed how many people want this thing to be "Dread-blap Junior" Lol

Battle Cube wrote:
you apparently havent read anything. People arent screaming for an i win ship, people are screaming for a BALANCED ship, that falls into line with ships of comparable isk cost and SP requirement. You be trollin'.


Yeah, I'm with Baltech here. Some of the ideas have been good, many have been horribly balanced starting with everyone asking for more damage.

The last thing this game needs is a pissing contest between T2 and Faction Battleship hulls over raw DPS supremacy.
Ager Agemo
Rainbow Ponies Incorporated
#1748 - 2013-09-03 15:19:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Ager Agemo
CCP Ytterbium wrote:
Battle Cube wrote:
While the blue post is appreciated.... i cant be the only one disappointing in those vargur numbers comparing even to a current vargur, or to a pirate bs.....

Maybe its just me, but it shouldn't just "compare" to a pirate bs if it costs the same but take more skills

And ok so it can tank the first wave of a VG but with no benefit due to lost dps, so its just 'comparable' for doing L4s. Exciting.






"we are definitely not going to give any kind of damage bonus in Bastion mode"

well i think i'm done here.



i guess i'll play with one for like 20 minutes though, i guess.



You have a bit less damage and less mobility, but better damage application, more tank, EW immunity, less ammunition consumption, more range on tractor beams, MJD reduction bonus. Apple and oranges. Again, point of Tech2 in the new scheme isn't to make them all better than other hulls Blink


look I will glady sacrifice half tracking if needed for 25% more DPS, I can live with that.


you still don't get it, so what if It can run a C88 wormhole by itself, tell me how much was your isk per click efficiency?
that is the hard number marauder pilots care about for PVE, anything else is just things we do not care about.
Mournful Conciousness
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1749 - 2013-09-03 15:31:09 UTC
Roime wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:

Maybe it's not the marauders that need to change. Maybe it's just that the players need some education and leadership in marauder use?


This is EVE Online, where people actually think Tengus are super awesome for sleeper sites, and that Lokis and Legions make any kind of sense in sleeper sites. On a more serious note, marauders take what, 3-4 times(?) longer to train to an optimal level than T3s.

That said, I've seen marauders 5-6 times in w-space for PVE purposes. I'm also considering moving back to wormholes just so I can bait bads with a Kronos.



Do it!!! I will look out for you - we shall have awesome fights. A merry time shall be had by all.

\o/

Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
Cade Windstalker
#1750 - 2013-09-03 15:35:02 UTC
Ager Agemo wrote:
look I will glady sacrifice half tracking if needed for 25% more DPS, I can live with that.


you still don't get it, so what if It can run a C88 wormhole by itself, tell me how much was your isk per click efficiency?
that is the hard number marauder pilots care about for PVE, anything else is just things we do not care about.


Are you familiar with "dread blapping"? Big smile
Zeus Maximo
Mentally Assured Destruction
#1751 - 2013-09-03 15:38:05 UTC
CCP Ytterbium wrote:

So while there are still concerns for PvP, I don't think you realize how efficient those things are for PvE. We feel like Dr. Frankenstein looking at a slab with a half-decaying corpses coming back to life. We've created monsters. Mission / PvE efficiency is not all about pure damage. It's also about mobility, projection and time you spend shooting. MJD + MWD helps with the first, Bastion plus new Kronos / Paladin bonuses give the second and EW immunity grants you the last.

As such we are definitely not going to give any kind of damage bonus in Bastion mode - if we ever did, it would be by severely penalizing turret tracking / missile explosion velocity when in Bastion mode, which would severally limit their use in PvE.
[/list]

Hope this wall of text helps a bit (PvE side, as I said, we aren't talking about PvP in this post).


Also, here is a preview of the transformation mode on the Kronos.


I don't recall mission runners having trouble tanking missions.

Only reason for this buff that I can think of is that missions are about to be made harder.

Could someone please explain to me how these changes are positive in a PVP aspect.

-No 90% web = can't lock down target
-In siege = can't move = no transversal = can't chase target running away
-Used for POS shoots = Raven Navy has 400 more dps

"It is not possible either to trick or escape the mind of Zeus."

U-MAD Membership Recruitment

PoH Corporation Recruitment
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#1752 - 2013-09-03 15:39:15 UTC
Ager Agemo wrote:
you still don't get it, so what if It can run a C88 wormhole by itself, tell me how much was your isk per click efficiency?
that is the hard number marauder pilots care about for PVE, anything else is just things we do not care about.

if isk/click was your main concern, you would be running passive tanked FoF rattlesnakes or domis.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#1753 - 2013-09-03 15:50:29 UTC
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
Roime wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:

Maybe it's not the marauders that need to change. Maybe it's just that the players need some education and leadership in marauder use?


This is EVE Online, where people actually think Tengus are super awesome for sleeper sites, and that Lokis and Legions make any kind of sense in sleeper sites. On a more serious note, marauders take what, 3-4 times(?) longer to train to an optimal level than T3s.

That said, I've seen marauders 5-6 times in w-space for PVE purposes. I'm also considering moving back to wormholes just so I can bait bads with a Kronos.



Do it!!! I will look out for you - we shall have awesome fights. A merry time shall be had by all.

\o/



Might even be worth it to buy a marauder character without any KB history :)



.
Aeril Malkyre
Knights of the Ouroboros
#1754 - 2013-09-03 15:54:37 UTC
After almost 90 pages, I'm convinced: this is not the direction to go. I think Bastion itself is an awesome idea. Who wouldn't want a ship that transforms to uber tank? But the Marauders are just the wrong hull.

As it stands, this is an awesome ideagasm in need of a home. Nothing about the Marauder hulls (attack BS's), their abilities, or their description screams 'immobile brick'. This shows up in the fact that they all had to be HP, speed, drone and mass altered to offset this new module. That's indicative of cramming in functionality they're not built for, crowding out what they were trying to be good at.

The Combat BS is the hull you want this on. They're already heartier, slower, tougher. What you've designed is a module for a new class of Tech 2 Battleship that doesn't exist. But I don't know that you're prepared to make that a whole new thing, which is why you're bolting it on to the Marauders.

So don't go this direction. Go the other direction. Make the Marauder what its name claims to be: a fast, hard-hitting, behind enemy lines, hit and run, smash and grab hull.

  • The MJD bonus is great. Added mobility is key for something that Marauds. The ability to hop out of (or into) danger is pretty cool.

  • I still like the tractor bonus, although everyone here seems to dualbox with a Noctis, which must be nice. But for all of us that don't have salvaging alt accounts, and may not have a Noctis parked in every mission hub, the Marauder's ability to cart off the riches of the fallen while still murdering their compatriots is amazing. And it holds with the 'behind enemy lines' flavor. Boost the range to 200% to offset the use of the MJD. Let me reprocess and build ammo on-board, and I'll have your children.

  • The power/cpu upgrades were desperately needed, and should stay. The boosts to targeting range and scan res were needed as well. Likewise the cap bonus is beautiful.

  • The extra hi is unnecessary if you port Bastion to a new hull.

  • Don't nerf the HP, speed, drone bays. And take back all that bloody mass.

  • Love the sig radius decrease, it fits the theme.

  • Fix the sensor strength. In fact, harden the sensors. After years of complaints and slumping Marauder sales, the engineers were ordered to bump them to competitive levels.

  • Boost the resistances to standard Tech 2.

  • Give them the deep space warp strength +2 bonus. Give people the chance to ACTUALLY go behind enemy lines and come out alive. You want a specialty that will make people wet themselves? Give them +1 warp strength per Marauder level (I know, it's madness). Or give them immunity to non-targeted interdiction. Make them truly capable of marauding in the dark places of the galaxy. Suddenly the name makes sense. And you'll see them in PvP as well as PvE, especially low-sec.

This makes the Marauder an incredibly strong ship (as it should be, all the way at the end of a very long training cycle and price tag). It provides needed buffs and hole filling for PvE, and provides interesting new options for PvP. And puts more high dollar ships in harm's way, which is good for business.
Ager Agemo
Rainbow Ponies Incorporated
#1755 - 2013-09-03 15:54:38 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Ager Agemo wrote:
look I will glady sacrifice half tracking if needed for 25% more DPS, I can live with that.


you still don't get it, so what if It can run a C88 wormhole by itself, tell me how much was your isk per click efficiency?
that is the hard number marauder pilots care about for PVE, anything else is just things we do not care about.


Are you familiar with "dread blapping"? Big smile


yes I do, we used to do that In a WH corp I was at before.

Lokis would hold the sleepers for the revelations and moros to disintegrate said sleepers.

Daniel Plain wrote:
Ager Agemo wrote:
you still don't get it, so what if It can run a C88 wormhole by itself, tell me how much was your isk per click efficiency?
that is the hard number marauder pilots care about for PVE, anything else is just things we do not care about.

if isk/click was your main concern, you would be running passive tanked FoF rattlesnakes or domis.



I m... and doesn't it strikes you as weird, that a simple super cheap T1 drone battleship, makes more isk per click AFK than an active combat T2 super expensive battleship?
Shadalana
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1756 - 2013-09-03 16:10:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Shadalana
Ager Agemo wrote:
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Ager Agemo wrote:
look I will glady sacrifice half tracking if needed for 25% more DPS, I can live with that.


you still don't get it, so what if It can run a C88 wormhole by itself, tell me how much was your isk per click efficiency?
that is the hard number marauder pilots care about for PVE, anything else is just things we do not care about.


Are you familiar with "dread blapping"? Big smile


yes I do, we used to do that In a WH corp I was at before.

Lokis would hold the sleepers for the revelations and moros to disintegrate said sleepers.

Daniel Plain wrote:
Ager Agemo wrote:
you still don't get it, so what if It can run a C88 wormhole by itself, tell me how much was your isk per click efficiency?
that is the hard number marauder pilots care about for PVE, anything else is just things we do not care about.

if isk/click was your main concern, you would be running passive tanked FoF rattlesnakes or domis.



I m... and doesn't it strikes you as weird, that a simple super cheap T1 drone battleship, makes more isk per click AFK than an active combat T2 super expensive battleship?


I know the solution: don't buff the tech2 ship, nerf the tech1 ship, so everything is inline! ...
Ager Agemo
Rainbow Ponies Incorporated
#1757 - 2013-09-03 16:16:08 UTC
Shadalana wrote:
quote and quote of the quote etc etc ...............


I know the solution: don't buff the tech2 ship, nerf the tech1 ship, so everything is inline! ...


They did, still is faster, not only that, plethora of other T1 ships are just as fast, and any pirate or faction battleship is if not as fast, is faster.

Maybe they could add an AOE salvage module and AOE tractor module? that would make marauders very sexy even with the lower dps.
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1758 - 2013-09-03 16:25:02 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
And BTW, using cap boosters is NOT how people fly a PvE ship.

Raven a la Liang fit uses it quite effectively.

Bokononist

 
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#1759 - 2013-09-03 16:28:32 UTC
nonsciolist wrote:
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
CCP Ytterbium wrote:
BASTION MODULE

Provides 30% shield, armor and hull resistances when activated, which function on the same way than Damage Control modules (not stacking penalized)


Do you mean that only one can be fitted per ship and I don't understand the (not stacking penalized) comment. Does this in fact mean that you could fit MOAR THAN ONE and activate two at the same time? *Cue wet pants*.


I guess it means that bonus doesn't have a stacking penalty when used with a damage control.


So the Bastion module gives 30% resists to shields, armor and hull? So if used with a damage controller (60% resists on hull), if it is not stacking penalized, you would have 90% omni hull resists? They seemed to add hull HP to most of them as well. I am thinking there could be some very interesting hull tanking fits for these new marauders. 1 high slot Bastion module, and 1 low slot damage controller, you got 90% resists, throw on a reinforced bulk heads or two, and some hull reps in the mids, that would leave you a lot of slots for damage/targeting mods. To bad it doesn't get a hull repairer bonus, or did I just miss it?
Ravasta Helugo
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#1760 - 2013-09-03 16:29:35 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Ager Agemo wrote:
look I will glady sacrifice half tracking if needed for 25% more DPS, I can live with that.


you still don't get it, so what if It can run a C88 wormhole by itself, tell me how much was your isk per click efficiency?
that is the hard number marauder pilots care about for PVE, anything else is just things we do not care about.


Are you familiar with "dread blapping"? Big smile

What about if we take it in the other direction:

Bastion's range bonus makes blapping NPC's at range no problem, but what about closer NPC's that already have a little traversal built up?

I think Bastion should confer a 25-30% Tracking/Exp Velocity bonus as well. I think this fits the damage application theme, without turning it into a Dread Blapper.