Player Features and Ideas Discussion

please quote me "slagging on others" i think i've been as respectful as possible with responding to rude and belittling responses, or is the fact my opinion differs to yours offensive?

and the thing is your missing the big picture, AFK cyno cloaking is not the only form of PVP, but it is the only form thats designed to avoid conflict with other PVP ships and go strait for ships not designed with PVP in mind.

and again why can most PVP pilots in null sec get kills without AFK cyno camping but you cant?

A t2 mining ship is intended to work as a part of a group, or in territory not vulnerable to hostile presence.

Use elsewhere should be done at your own risk exclusively.
I strongly recommend the venture. With the right skills, it can more than mine enough to justify using it in places too risky for an exhumer to operate in.
This includes null being camped by a cloaky quite nicely indeed.
(But the higher yield fitted version is not light in skills any more than an exhumer is)

As to local helping hunters more?
The advantage will always belong to whoever has sov, simply because the intel channels and patrols supplying them will be a huge advantage.

Those hunting in hostile territory will be on their own, and with no local to artificially tell them where everyone is, chances are they will have no idea.
They can, of course, guess, or do research to learn where people usually hang out, but unless someone spies for them and tips them where to look, they will be effectively blind.

Local is never the friend of PvE. PvE has a far more obvious advantage trading it in for an intel channel while the hunters are blind.

psy warfare lol, thats funny

ok first and foremost this is the Features and Ideas section, not the maintain the status quo at all costs section.

try to look at this through the eyes of a miner in null, you are in a cyno cloaked system with all surrounding systems also cyno camped. You make about 40-80 million a day through mining/manufacturing depending on time spent playing. Your ship costs 200 million fully fit (mackinaw, costs varies with availability) and the cyno cloaked ship is active 4 times a day on average.

chances are your going to lose you ship every day if you have the audacity to mine, risk outweighs reward so you stay in POS and wait, so far its been 7 months of waiting.

can you see the frustration that industry based players feel? I know the rhetoric used by AFK cyno cloaked pilots all too well and thats what i am disputing, if your alliance and corp are actively defending their home it should allow miners the ability to mine and help pay for shiny things for pvp pilots to get blown up in.

so you mine with cyno cloaked ships in your system? I've tried, I tend to just blow up. My ship layout is fairly similar, without the cloak. i can never seem to warp before i get dead.

I still wouldn't like being a mining ship with only a prototype cloak in a swarm of SB's, recons and T3 cruisers, I can't see, with the exception of aligning, which you should already be, how it would help. They have you rough position you need to decloak before warp.... still feels like being fish in a barrel to me.

You know what bothers me the most about your argument Nikk? The fact that it feels your telling people how to play the game of Eve based on how you think THEY should play the game. This bothers me.

To suggest changing ships or to alter their play style so that it fits more in line with yours isn't a valid argument on this topic.

Wow quick to get defensive, are we?

No honestly, I think it's you and a few others that commonly post on this topic that are trying to smoke screen issues. Your suggestions aren't bad suggestions. I never said that, but they do feel like you are trying to tell people how to play the game instead of "teaching" as you claim.

I truly hope you don't really think my last three posts on this topic have been some attempt to sweep ideas under the rug. If you do, then I am sorry.

Now I am curious. Are you trying to say that I am a cloaky camper and I am somehow upset cause you suggested ideas to someone that could possibly help them survive? Cause that would be a tad silly to jump to that conclusion.

From my point of view, and JUST my point of view, the suggestions I have seen you offer are basically saying. "This is how the game is. Accept it, and deal with it, and oh by the way, here are a few ideas of what you could do to defend yourself."

Now there is absolutely nothing wrong with this point of view, but I don't think it fits with a features and ideas segment of the forums. It was even said in the last couple pages that this is a forum for suggestions of change, not how to work with the current game.

The idea behind this thread seems to be a push to change the game mechanics so that a person can't hold a system hostage with little to no risk to themselves isk wise. Personally I agree and think a change needs to be made to fix this issue. Obviously you disagree. That's fine. However some of your ideas are simply impractical, such as having a counter fleet to hot drop a hot dropper. This isn't impossible but just not practical 23/7.

Don't get me wrong your ideas aren't bad ones, and some are even good ones but when it comes to trying to silent ideas, I think you are holding those cards.

And you're absolutely right this is a sandbox game, people can play the way they want. So why the hatred for "nullbears"? They are playing the part of the game they enjoy. That is a general statement, by the way. Not strictly focused at you, since you don't seem to degrade that play style, but others on the thread have.

Ok first off you're splitting hairs. You know exactly what I mean when I reference "thread". The last three pages haven't been discussing the list of other threads about AFK cloaking. They have talked directly about that issue, so please don't do that.

For a quick response, I will say I disagree that a change to local is the solution to this. I don't think your idea would actually change anything. It would simply remove the "local" tag over one window and replace it with "(Alliance) Intel". It wouldn't require any more effort than the current game requires. If you are watching local for your intel, you are dead already, especially if your in a ratting carrier. You will be tackled before you can warp off to safe. You watch your intel channels and as hostiles get close, you safe up your expensive assets.

For anything else. I will post tomorrow. It's late and its bed time now.

If I had a fighting chance I would stay and fight but the fight most of the times are bomber vs hauler / barge or hot dropper with 10 + friends vs a barge / hauler / single carrier. So tell me this... why on earth would I stay and fight if I would loose a ship.

Using overwhelming tactics is a good thing for the person using them and makes a sure kill when ever you catch someone but it also discourages people to fight them. And then the odd are against the hot droppers and bombers they don't do anything. This is how this game is played and that is why it is booring and it is because of you (pvpers).

It's not my job to figure out new tactics, I'm just a lonely industrialist and I get my kicks out from industrial things and roams when I feel I have too much isks and I don't know which blueprint to buy so I can make ships for you to blow up.

And still... break cloaks it would make things better for eve.

A very myopic view. understand that pvpers are not the only benefactors of cloaks.
...and pvpers ganking "poor industrials" not only does not require a cloak, there are other activities that do require cloaks that will suffer if nerfherders get their way on cloak "breaking".