Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Because if PVE in null was under constant threat from PVP, there would be no players doing it in null. Simple.

However if AFK cyno cloaking was removed a lot of people who left null because of perma-camped systems, would proberbly return and you would have more defenceless PVE pilots to try and kill.

Except they aren't defensless...and if you read the thread or even some of the last few posts you'd know this.

I know right, mining ships make great pvp ships

so misguided, mission and mining ships need a lot of support to do their job safely in null, scouts and alliance support, it's by no means an easy task, just to get destroyed by AFK cyno's, that nobody can defend against.

and beware of who you call a troll.

Yes, ratters, miners, etc in null should absolutely need to adjust their playstyles to account for the fact they are in null - whether that means having friends in a support fleet, or adjusting their fittings suitably, they have to do these things. Are you saying they shouldn't have to? Are you saying highsec attitudes and choices should work equally well - if not better, thanks to local - in null? That's a pretty ridiculous claim, if it's what you're getting at.

Saying "nobody can defend against" cynos is also pretty ridiculous. Why can't you defend against them? What prevents your corp/alliance from having a fleet in system, or nearby ready to counter-cyno? Nothing other than laziness and incompetence. If you can't defend your space, you don't deserve the rewards. It's that bloody simple.

I only call someone a troll when what they've said is so off the mark or so stupid that the only explanation is that they are deliberately being dishonest.

But The Gunslinger is absolutely correct. Shooting fish in a barrel is fun sometimes, but eventually you want something more challenging.

Right now the game mechanics hands you intel very easily via local, not only that it gives you this intel with a significant time lapse in favor of the locals. These are indisputable facts. These indisputable facts are exactly what leads to AFK cloaking.

You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.

Oh, and here is another fact, nobody has ever been destroyed by an AFK ship of any kind. Whether it has a cyno or guns or missiles.

I underlined the primary aspect they really want to avoid.

Noone ever suggested they should be easy kills, ONLY that they should require effort for the safety they so take for granted right now.

I have tried to read thru this mess of a forum topic and even in the past talkeda bout my distaste for AFK cloaking.

Couple things I dont understand.

Why is local even being complained about? I understand the arguement. It gives out intel, but local has been in the game since day one, and cloaking hasn't. Does anyone seriously think CCP will remove it. I understand WH space doesnt have local but it also functions under its own rules. You cant hot drop into a WH and you will never get 100 ships thru a WH entrance before getting trapped inside. It's also harder to pray on a industrial character in a WH cause they have to be tanked to deal with sleepers, but in exchange for that, they are granted huge bonuses to potential profit from very rare spawns. ETC ETC ETC. WH space is unique and I just dont think it fits in this argument as a valid example as why local should be removed.

Now am I for the idea of tieing intel channels to sov space? ****, yes. I would be all for this idea. It makes sense. If you own space, you should get the benifit of a local style warning system. I mean it is space you call home, have built stations in, pos's and other assests. You should be granted some bonus to security in this space, cause of these things. Though I still find it unlikely CCP will change it.

As for AFK cloaking camping with the potential of a hot drop. I am split on this. I find it an effective way to shut down a system for a while but after a month or two of the same person camping the same system and just perma camping. I find this action to be rather distasteful. Why? Caues the people in that system have very few options to remove that player. You can try to bait him, but it has to be good bait and it completely up to the cloaky if he wishes to engage. There really is no way to catch this person unless they decide to leave on their own. Even if you have 100 ships in system with a D scan running and that person logs off and then back on. All he has to do is tap his cloak and poof, you cant find him. All he will be is a blink on a d scan, if you happen to click at the right time.

I think a lot of people would be happy if THIS particular style of AFK camping was removed. Question is. How can it be done without breaking other parts of the game. I wont get into that cause my past ideas have been flamed. I dont care to deal with it anymore but I do think that this style of camping is really what people dislike.

I disagree. Unclaimed sov space should be very very very dangerous but if an alliance owns that space then I see no reason why it shouldnt be as safe as, if not safer than high sec. Of course there wouldnt be any concord style ships to enforce rules, it would all be done by the alliance but I think you understand my point. Local holds a valid reaason for being in these regions.

I think the work your suggesting a player do is unbalanced. The work to keep stations, POS's and other things in operation is far more work than is required for covert ops ship needs to simple invade space and perma camp it,

As for the standings thing. I didnt know that but it is somewhat beside the point isnt it? A right click on a new name would easily show what corp a person is in. Also wouldn't that again be beside the point since the standings thing in local was in effect before cloaking ships were, right?

Personally I dont think local is broken. I personally feel that it's a crutch used by PVP oriented toons to use as a defense against having cloaks reworked.

I am not for the removal of a cloak and i dont think the people asking for the cloak to be reworked wants that either. But perma camped systems are a real issue and I dont feel they are used for anything more than griefing and harassment. Even if it is being used for a legit reason, once a person is in a system, it's impossible to remove them unless they choose to be found or leave on their own. That fact alone breaks the balance of a cloak.

Now mind you I cleared state this is how I feel. I am not saying it is right or how CCP feel or how anyone else should feel about the topic. I am stating my opinion in hopes to show my point of view and maybe influence some to understand what I am saying and possibly agree with me. I have read any of the responses here and none of them have really made me change my mind to think that the system is working perfectly.

ok where do i start...

so if a miner wants so go out and mine, he has to have a fleet of his friends just sit in system and do nothing on the chance that the AFK cloaker is at the keyboard?

and you suggest to defend our space we have to cyno camp our own systems with a hotdrop fleet always at the ready, this is just plain silly!

and stop complaining about local, i see plenty of kills by pvper's in null that don't AFK cyno cloak, maybe they can teach you a thing or two?