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PI in low sec
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Makavelia
National Industries
#41 - 2013-03-19 17:52:15 UTC
Kodama Ikari wrote:
Makavelia wrote:

2 of the planets produce toxic metals, and the other 2 produce chiral structures. The last planet produces robotics.

What I consider doing instead, to save most hauling is all 5 planets produce p3 from scratch.

I was thinking of using a 10 head extractor + 2 silos to stock up, then alternate each day between extracting heavy metal/cs.

Maybe?.


Chiral structures and Toxic metals are P1 materials. If the 5th planet is producing consumer electronics, that is a P2 material. Consumer electronics + mechanical parts = robotics, which is a P3. Having all 5 planets produce p2 is viable and saves on hauling/taxes, plus any planet can make at least one kind of p2. You can do two methods. With two extractors its a pretty inefficient but requires little management besides occasionally moving the extractors. Using 1 extractor is efficient but you have to re-configure all of the basic processors every few days. My long post from last week addressed the problems of doing p2 on one planet with two extractors.


Yes, sorry my mistake.


1 Extractor. Alternate the 10 heads each day between the 2 p0's

1 silo to store p0 A
1 silo to store p0 B


2 basics that will create p1 A
2 basics that will create p1 B

Bsics feeding off both silos

P1 a&b routed to launch pad

1 adnvaced proc creating p2 from/to launch pad.

x 5 planets.

That hopefully is right now o0.
Kodama Ikari
Thragon
#42 - 2013-03-19 20:39:12 UTC
Makavelia wrote:

1 Extractor. Alternate the 10 heads each day between the 2 p0's

1 silo to store p0 A
1 silo to store p0 B



Ooooohhh. That makes more sense. I was kind of envisioning a system where you would make and store p1, then switch the extractor and the basic processors to the other kind. Bonus is you can chase 1 material for a week before switching, but its a lot more clicking once you do.

For you, you're aiming to store excess p0 and keep p1 and p2 in constant production. Here you want to fill up the silo before switching, because chasing hotspots and moving the ECU takes time. A full silo is 12,000 m3 of p0, or 1.2m units. A simple processors eats 12,000 units per hour, so with two of them you'll clear a full silo in 50 hours. That gives you basically two days to harvest one resource, then two days to harvest the other. A 4 days supply of p0 for two basic processors is about 2.3 mil units of p0. To get that in 2 days you need average 48,000 units per hour from your extractor, but ideally even a bit more. So something like 1 day extractor cycles with alternating the extraction material every other day would be ideal. However maintaining this will probably be difficult, depending on competition and richness of the planet, you'll probably need to spend longer on one resource than the other. If the ECU yield is too low overall, you can try having 1 silo store both p0 materials to save on pg.

Lastly if you have 2+2 basics then you should have 2 advanced processors, but you can wait for your launchpad to fill up a bit with p1 before doing so. The second advanced processor won't run at full efficiency but you will want one at some point, even if you run it for a week and then decomission it for the next week. If you are really fine with just 1 advanced processor then you may as well go for 1+1 basic processors, 2 silos, and run 4-day extraction cycles.

Some first-hand PI tips
Makavelia
National Industries
#43 - 2013-03-19 20:55:43 UTC
Kodama Ikari wrote:
Makavelia wrote:

1 Extractor. Alternate the 10 heads each day between the 2 p0's

1 silo to store p0 A
1 silo to store p0 B



Ooooohhh. That makes more sense. I was kind of envisioning a system where you would make and store p1, then switch the extractor and the basic processors to the other kind. Bonus is you can chase 1 material for a week before switching, but its a lot more clicking once you do.

For you, you're aiming to store excess p0 and keep p1 and p2 in constant production. Here you want to fill up the silo before switching, because chasing hotspots and moving the ECU takes time. A full silo is 12,000 m3 of p0, or 1.2m units. A simple processors eats 12,000 units per hour, so with two of them you'll clear a full silo in 50 hours. That gives you basically two days to harvest one resource, then two days to harvest the other. A 4 days supply of p0 for two basic processors is about 2.3 mil units of p0. To get that in 2 days you need average 48,000 units per hour from your extractor, but ideally even a bit more. So something like 1 day extractor cycles with alternating the extraction material every other day would be ideal. However maintaining this will probably be difficult, depending on competition and richness of the planet, you'll probably need to spend longer on one resource than the other. If the ECU yield is too low overall, you can try having 1 silo store both p0 materials to save on pg.

Lastly if you have 2+2 basics then you should have 2 advanced processors, but you can wait for your launchpad to fill up a bit with p1 before doing so. The second advanced processor won't run at full efficiency but you will want one at some point, even if you run it for a week and then decomission it for the next week. If you are really fine with just 1 advanced processor then you may as well go for 1+1 basic processors, 2 silos, and run 4-day extraction cycles.


Ok, thnx for all your help.
Kodama Ikari
Thragon
#44 - 2013-03-20 04:22:07 UTC
PS. i just realized that I did the math wrong. A simple processor uses 6,000 units per hour, not 12,000. So you actually only need to average 24,000 units per hour with your ECU. So a full silo will empty in 100 hours ~ 4 days, and if your ECU is pulling in 24,000 per hour, then it'll take 4 days to fill it up. When you're harvesting resource A, silo B will drain at 12,000/hour, and A will fill up by 12,000/hour.

Anyway, 24,000/hour shouldn't be hard at all to get going. and you should definitely get a second advanced processor on each planet. You may even find you can do two 2-day cycles instead of four 1-day ones.

Some first-hand PI tips
Makavelia
National Industries
#45 - 2013-03-20 09:10:43 UTC
Kodama Ikari wrote:
PS. i just realized that I did the math wrong. A simple processor uses 6,000 units per hour, not 12,000. So you actually only need to average 24,000 units per hour with your ECU. So a full silo will empty in 100 hours ~ 4 days, and if your ECU is pulling in 24,000 per hour, then it'll take 4 days to fill it up. When you're harvesting resource A, silo B will drain at 12,000/hour, and A will fill up by 12,000/hour.

Anyway, 24,000/hour shouldn't be hard at all to get going. and you should definitely get a second advanced processor on each planet. You may even find you can do two 2-day cycles instead of four 1-day ones.


Yeah i fixed it all up last night. It was tight on pg so i had to drop to 9 heads to be able to fit 2 advanced procs.
Kodama Ikari
Thragon
#46 - 2013-04-01 06:41:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Kodama Ikari
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:



Just keep factory planet in High Sec as one must often loiter at the POCO.


You actually never have to. You can dump all the stuff in the poco or yank all of it out, warp away and cloak, and manage the factory from there. You won't be exposed any longer than doing a pickup at extraction planets.

Some first-hand PI tips
Netheus Soubar
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#47 - 2013-04-01 13:21:35 UTC
Makavelia wrote:
I'm interested in investing some time into low sec PI. I have not began to get into the details of it although i glanced over a youtube vid or 2.

My question is: Can my instalations simply be destroyed in low sec?. Must i have any kind of standings or pos positions in that system?.

Further more, is a T2 hauler the only way I'm going to get the tools into low sec?.



I'm running a mix between high-sec and low-sec planets. It should be obvious that the low-sec planets have much more goo to spare than any high-sec planet.

For this kind of operation, I strongly recommend a Viator with Cov-Ops cloak. You buzz in, buzz out, in almost no time. While you warp to the planet office, you can already transfer stuff from the surface. Upon arrival, you bring that into the cargo and warp away, reactivating the cloak.

If you warp cloaked to a low-sec gate and jump immediately, it is possible to evade gate camps. Likewise, if you jump in, align to the planet office and warp there, immediately activating the cloak, chances are slim to be caught. The only time-window in which you're visible is maybe 1-2 seconds - not enough time to lock you.

I hope this helps a little.

PS: Standings play no role when performing any PI.
Makavelia
National Industries
#48 - 2013-04-01 16:39:19 UTC
Netheus Soubar wrote:
Makavelia wrote:
I'm interested in investing some time into low sec PI. I have not began to get into the details of it although i glanced over a youtube vid or 2.

My question is: Can my instalations simply be destroyed in low sec?. Must i have any kind of standings or pos positions in that system?.

Further more, is a T2 hauler the only way I'm going to get the tools into low sec?.



I'm running a mix between high-sec and low-sec planets. It should be obvious that the low-sec planets have much more goo to spare than any high-sec planet.

For this kind of operation, I strongly recommend a Viator with Cov-Ops cloak. You buzz in, buzz out, in almost no time. While you warp to the planet office, you can already transfer stuff from the surface. Upon arrival, you bring that into the cargo and warp away, reactivating the cloak.

If you warp cloaked to a low-sec gate and jump immediately, it is possible to evade gate camps. Likewise, if you jump in, align to the planet office and warp there, immediately activating the cloak, chances are slim to be caught. The only time-window in which you're visible is maybe 1-2 seconds - not enough time to lock you.

I hope this helps a little.

PS: Standings play no role when performing any PI.


I have it all set up now just they way i want it. Very little hauling to do apart from when my 5 launch pads across the planets are full of P2. It won't make near as much as i could if i was willing to put the effort in.. but i ''guess'' around 250 mil per month. Ofc, assuming i can sell the P2 from location. If i have to haul it all to hub then i guess i'll not be sticking with it. But at-leas ti got to learn how it works.
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