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POSes: I am a small portion of the community

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ShyAsianHunny
Fweddit
Free Range Chikuns
#781 - 2013-01-17 14:57:22 UTC
i think pos' are just about everywhere in lowsec and null. How can say that poses are a "small portion of the community."
not to mention WH corps live out of a POS.

"small portion of the community." i didn't realize that 85% of the eve map, including wspace, was only a small portion of the community.
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#782 - 2013-01-17 14:57:30 UTC
So i heard that CCP Greyscale is beign an arse to the CSM about POSs
Quote:
UAxDEATH disagreed and brought up an example of priorities like POSes, “you promised us those things”. Greyscale replied that coming into meetings with the mindset of CCP promising a certain feature is a fallacious, and flat-out wrong, mindset. With conversation now completely deteriorating, Unifex took control of the conversation and spoke about POSes.

It isnt a flat-out wrong mindset when you presented a bloody roundtable about 'starbases' at fanfest, and went on about 'Fantasy POS 2.0

Stop beign such a bootlicker Greyscale and give your paying customers what you promised and what they want.
(http://eveblog.allumis.co.uk/?p=832)
Quote:
The next thing I attended was the starbases round table, although it was really a room with lots of chairs and a table at the front where CCP Greyscale and CCP MasterPlan sat. Unfortunately this didn’t have any microphones so it was more difficult to hear the Devs talk, and the discussions weren’t moderated particularly well, so some of the more vocal people in the room dominated at times.

CCP Greyscale has a vision he called Fantasy POS 2.0, which is a modular system, almost like a mini-outpost. This would need huge input from the art team, but would essentially allow you to set up a POS but not have to fly around all the different anchored structures to find out which lab the invented blueprints are in.

CCP Greyscale also liked the idea of small individual player POS which virtually anybody could own and put up and have some stuff there.

One of the most concerning aspects of this discussion was that the removal of POS forcefields seemed to be on the discussion table. One wormhole resident seemed particulary upset that players could hide in a POS and not get involved in PvP. However, with the discussions on removing POS forcefields, it didn’t seem that the impact of such a change had seriously been considered.

All in all, it was recognised that POS need love, but it doesn’t sound like any major changes are likely for quite some time.

I'll enjoy watching CCP dig their way out of this hole they've dug for themselves

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION
TimNeilson
The Greater Goon
#783 - 2013-01-17 14:58:10 UTC
posting for pos revamp. also fix the corp interface please.
HARD STEEL
Caldari Capital Construction Company
#784 - 2013-01-17 14:59:52 UTC
Advanced POS's = conflict driver. Maybe a small % of people are using them now because they are so horrible.

Space stations = huge sci fi element - I can't believe theres been such a backpeddle on this. Greyscale saying he wanted starbases that could jump systems - that got me so excited.

Now what do we have to look forward to based on this "lets do a little bit of everything" approach? How would that add a sense of wonder and mystery to the game vs "holy crap we can build star bases"

ONLY THE HARD.  ONLY THE STRONG.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#785 - 2013-01-17 15:00:00 UTC
I actually think that current POS design works well enough in general however I do think they are well over-due a decent overhaul.

My main gripe is the lack of "allowed" lists that you can add or remove a player from specifically to grant access to the forcefield, specific CHA or SMA, etc. (not just tied down to corp either).

Beyond that theres are some tweaks that wouldn't go amiss to make it a bit less of a chore/more intuiative for people who are managing them but overall I don't see the need for massive changes - setting up and maintaining a POS shouldn't be effortless IMO but at the same time you shouldn't be tied in knots trying to manage basic features.
Istyn
Freight Club
#786 - 2013-01-17 15:00:13 UTC
Quote:
UAxDEATH disagreed and brought up an example of priorities like POSes, “you promised us those things”. Greyscale replied that coming into meetings with the mindset of CCP promising a certain feature is a fallacious, and flat-out wrong, mindset. With conversation now completely deteriorating, Unifex took control of the conversation and spoke about POSes.


Compare with

http://www.eve-search.com/thread/139688-1/page/4#94

CCP Greyscale wrote:
If the minutes are somehow giving you the impression that starbases aren't a high priority, then there's some miscommunication going on. They're a big damn job to do and they need a lot of runway to get them right, but we're working on it as fast as we can.


and

CCP Greyscale wrote:

The thing is, starbases are a crufty old system that lots of people use and lots of people dislike using, and we've got to tackle them at some point. If you're classifying "jesus features" purely on size, then ruling them out means we'll never redo the corp management interface, or lowsec, or s&i, or sov warfare, or any of the other "big" projects that everyone wants dealt with.


Do you really think your subscribers are that thick, Greyscale?
space chikun
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#787 - 2013-01-17 15:00:19 UTC
MainDrain wrote:
@CCP_Unifex Do I want a new modular POS system? No. Do I need to manage it easily? Yes. Please iterate - we've been patient! #tweetfleet

CCP Unifex ‏@CCP_Unifex
@RussellBarnes78 That's the key way to look at this.

This is a copy paste from twitter, and looks to be the first response to this issue from Unifex (i could be wrong and if i am i'm sorry)

This to me shows that although a whole new re-design would be bad in terms of the money and time required iteration and improvements of use is something that are happy with doing.



Then he needs to clarify that here, not on Twitter, and tell us that they're going to iterate on the current system. As it stands, they've left it at "well, they're not important enough", referring to the players who manage POSes.
Wafou Ka'Djo
Yellow Box Ltd.
#788 - 2013-01-17 15:00:44 UTC
I'd like to see a POS Fix/Revamp and a more user friendly corp interface
Erebus Gale
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#789 - 2013-01-17 15:00:47 UTC
1) Go to any system.
2) Hit d-scan.
3) See POSes.
Nair Alderau
The Blessed Chains of Freedom
#790 - 2013-01-17 15:01:08 UTC
MainDrain wrote:
@CCP_Unifex Do I want a new modular POS system? No. Do I need to manage it easily? Yes. Please iterate - we've been patient! #tweetfleet

CCP Unifex ‏@CCP_Unifex
@RussellBarnes78 That's the key way to look at this.

This is a copy paste from twitter, and looks to be the first response to this issue from Unifex (i could be wrong and if i am i'm sorry)
...


Quoting this because it is important if genuine.

I disagree with no new system (because I think the current system is pretty broken from the get-go and would req. almost as much effort/resources to iterate to usability as simply starting from scratch - except for the art department, obvs.)
Heimdallofasgard
Ministry of Furious Retribution
Fraternity.
#791 - 2013-01-17 15:02:00 UTC
MainDrain wrote:
@CCP_Unifex Do I want a new modular POS system? No. Do I need to manage it easily? Yes. Please iterate - we've been patient! #tweetfleet

CCP Unifex ‏@CCP_Unifex
@RussellBarnes78 That's the key way to look at this.

This is a copy paste from twitter, and looks to be the first response to this issue from Unifex (i could be wrong and if i am i'm sorry)

This to me shows that although a whole new re-design would be bad in terms of the money and time required iteration and improvements of use is something that are happy with doing.


Or he's found the one person on earth who agrees with him. Unifex has gone back on his word about "pos's can't be iterated upon"... he needs to go all the way here... modular pos's are just too good to pass up on.
Aenrea
Terpene Conglomerate
#792 - 2013-01-17 15:03:03 UTC
CCP, please, revamp POSes, I hate the current system pretty much in all aspects. You said few months back that you want to make them more accessible, prettier, that everyone could afford to buy one, everyone would like them.

Please, CCP, make this happen.

CEO of Terpene Conglomerate, Amarrian FW & exploration corp formed from  Khanid, Amarrian and Caldari pilots.
Glasgow Dunlop
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#793 - 2013-01-17 15:03:47 UTC
Yeah, so almost 800 Posts in 12 hours.

Your move CCP . . .

@glasgowdunlop #tweetfleet

TDSIN Director : Join 'TDSIN pub' for more info, Join today!

Glasgow EVE Meets Organiser
Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#794 - 2013-01-17 15:04:28 UTC
Heimdallofasgard wrote:
MainDrain wrote:
@CCP_Unifex Do I want a new modular POS system? No. Do I need to manage it easily? Yes. Please iterate - we've been patient! #tweetfleet

CCP Unifex ‏@CCP_Unifex
@RussellBarnes78 That's the key way to look at this.

This is a copy paste from twitter, and looks to be the first response to this issue from Unifex (i could be wrong and if i am i'm sorry)

This to me shows that although a whole new re-design would be bad in terms of the money and time required iteration and improvements of use is something that are happy with doing.


Or he's found the one person on earth who agrees with him. Unifex has gone back on his word about "pos's can't be iterated upon"... he needs to go all the way here... modular pos's are just too good to pass up on.


True, it is not needed Iteraction.. It is needed a REVAMP, as POS is so important as a spaceship...

Please read these!

New POS system New SOV system
Saidin Thor
The Odin Conspiracy
#795 - 2013-01-17 15:04:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Saidin Thor
POSes in their current form are an abomination, but there isn't any alternative.

Almost every single resident of player-owned nullsec will be affected by a POS revamp (through staging towers, jump briges, etc).

Every resident of a wormhole will be affected by a POS revamp (since WH dwellers are totally dependent on POSes to actually live inside a WH).

Those residents of NPC-nullsec that have staging towers will be directly affected by a POS revamp.

Owners of lowsec towers, as well as any entities which have staging towers in lowsec, will be directly affected by a POS revamp.

Owners of hisec towers will be directly affected by a POS revamp.


This seems like a lot of people that are going to be affected. Considering that balancing nullsec basically only affects residents of nullsec, I would posit it's a significantly larger population than would be affected by working on "balancing nullsec." Finally, I believe that not seeing a real POS overhaul as part of the solution to Nullsec balance is a real mistake.


Does the change to POSes HAVE to happen as implementation of modular POSes? No, I don't think so. But improvements to the way they are handled now is something that needs to happen.
Dynow Sawr
Shadow State
Goonswarm Federation
#796 - 2013-01-17 15:04:59 UTC
Heimdallofasgard wrote:


...the current system is pretty broken



I totally agree, POS interface is a mess, please fix it.
Qlyx
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#797 - 2013-01-17 15:05:13 UTC
Fix pos please.
Pinky Feldman
Amarrian Vengeance
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#798 - 2013-01-17 15:05:22 UTC
Does this mean we will get hats finally?

The moar you cry the less you pee
czMulti
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#799 - 2013-01-17 15:05:23 UTC
Glasgow Dunlop wrote:
Yeah, so almost 800 Posts in 12 hours.

Your move CCP . . .


we should burn jita or something...

or blow up every pos...
Daoa Hakoke
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#800 - 2013-01-17 15:05:44 UTC
I support this thread and fixing/improving POS's.