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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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freighter fits

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Mag's
Azn Empire
#41 - 2012-11-18 20:39:17 UTC
Souisa wrote:
What makes you think it will be a nerf?
Even though you already have been told this and know it, I'll answer. Because any low and rig fitting slots means a nerf to the freighters cargo hold. This nerf has already been explained to you, in your previous locked thread.

Now answer the question, why ask for a nerf to freighters, when you could ask for a new ship type instead?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Souisa
Subhypersonics
#42 - 2012-11-18 20:40:33 UTC
Mag's wrote:
Souisa wrote:
What makes you think it will be a nerf?
Even though you already have been told this and know it, I'll answer. Because any low and rig fitting slots means a nerf to the freighters cargo hold. This nerf has already been explained to you, in your previous locked thread.

Now answer the question, why ask for a nerf to freighters, when you could ask for a new ship type instead?


Its only a nerf if you refuse to look at the big picture

o/
Mag's
Azn Empire
#43 - 2012-11-18 20:43:48 UTC
Souisa wrote:
Mag's wrote:
Souisa wrote:
What makes you think it will be a nerf?
Even though you already have been told this and know it, I'll answer. Because any low and rig fitting slots means a nerf to the freighters cargo hold. This nerf has already been explained to you, in your previous locked thread.

Now answer the question, why ask for a nerf to freighters, when you could ask for a new ship type instead?


Its only a nerf if you refuse to look at the big picture
Answer the question.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#44 - 2012-11-18 20:44:32 UTC
Souisa wrote:
Its only a nerf if you refuse to look at the big picture
The big picture is that it's a nerf.
You refuse to accept that fact because you don't understand how the bigger picture requires it to happen for your idea to work.

The bigger picture is that Freighters are already optimised for their task. Changing them to make them more versatile will make them worse at everything you want them to do. If you want them to do something else, a better idea would be to ask for a different ship that does what you want. Nerfing freighters because you don't want to use them the way they are is not a good reason.

So: why do you want to nerf freighters and what problem are you trying solve by doing so?
Souisa
Subhypersonics
#45 - 2012-11-18 20:44:57 UTC
Mag's wrote:
Souisa wrote:
Mag's wrote:
Souisa wrote:
What makes you think it will be a nerf?
Even though you already have been told this and know it, I'll answer. Because any low and rig fitting slots means a nerf to the freighters cargo hold. This nerf has already been explained to you, in your previous locked thread.

Now answer the question, why ask for a nerf to freighters, when you could ask for a new ship type instead?


Its only a nerf if you refuse to look at the big picture
Answer the question.


Lol :) You are making assertions that its a nerf. I mean, its not a nerf. Its a false question you are asking

o/
Souisa
Subhypersonics
#46 - 2012-11-18 20:46:34 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Souisa wrote:
Its only a nerf if you refuse to look at the big picture
The big picture is that it's a nerf.
You refuse to accept that fact because you don't understand how the bigger picture requires it to happen for your idea to work.

The bigger picture is that Freighters are already optimised for their task. Changing them to make them more versatile will make them worse at everything you want them to do. If you want them to do something else, a better idea would be to ask for a different ship that does what you want. Nerfing freighters because you don't want to use them the way they are is not a good reason.

So: why do you want to nerf freighters and what problem are you trying solve by doing so?


You are just blabbering

o/
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#47 - 2012-11-18 20:46:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Souisa wrote:
You are making assertions that its a nerf. I mean, its not a nerf.
How is a reduction in is key stat — cargo space — not a nerf? How is a reduction in its other big stat — hull HP, which pilots will have to give up to counteract the nerf — not in and of itself a nerf?

How does making the ship less capable at its specialised task not a nerf?

Quote:
You are just blabbering
And you are unable to provide the slightest shred of a reason why your idea has even the most minute benefit. You cannot even answer the most basic question: why do you want to nerf freighters and what problem are you trying solve by doing so?
Souisa
Subhypersonics
#48 - 2012-11-18 20:47:58 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Souisa wrote:
You are making assertions that its a nerf. I mean, its not a nerf.
How is a reduction in is key stat — cargo space — not a nerf? How is a reduction in its other big stat — hull HP, which pilots will have to give up to counteract the nerf — not in and of itself a nerf?

How does making the ship less capable at its specialised task not a nerf?


Obviously the rig slots and low slots are going to compensate for the reduction in HP and M3, i also covered this in the main post

o/
Mag's
Azn Empire
#49 - 2012-11-18 20:48:07 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Souisa wrote:
You are making assertions that its a nerf. I mean, its not a nerf.
How is a reduction in is key stat — cargo space — not a nerf? How is a reduction in its other big stat — hull HP, which pilots will have to give up to counteract the nerf — not in and of itself a nerf?

How does making the ship less capable at its specialised task not a nerf?
This.

We have already seen the big picture Souisa, you seem to have not. Now please answer the question.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Souisa
Subhypersonics
#50 - 2012-11-18 20:49:04 UTC
Mag's wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Souisa wrote:
You are making assertions that its a nerf. I mean, its not a nerf.
How is a reduction in is key stat — cargo space — not a nerf? How is a reduction in its other big stat — hull HP, which pilots will have to give up to counteract the nerf — not in and of itself a nerf?

How does making the ship less capable at its specialised task not a nerf?
This.

We have already seen the big picture Souisa, you seem to have not. Now please answer the question.


Right :) When you want to explain how the freighter is going to be worse off from getting fitting slots by all means, please do.

o/
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#51 - 2012-11-18 20:50:22 UTC
Souisa wrote:
Obviously the rig slots and low slots are going to compensate for the reduction in HP and M3, i also covered this in the main post
No. That is not obvious. It is in fact completely the opposite of how the game works.

Compensating for reduction in cargo hold by using lowslots and rigs = reduction in HP.
Compensating for reduction in HP by using lowslots and rigs instead of cargo expanders = back to the reduced cargo space.

So how are those reductions not a nerf? Also, why do you want to nerf freighters and what problem are you trying solve by doing so?
Souisa
Subhypersonics
#52 - 2012-11-18 20:51:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Souisa
Well ok. Lets just call fitting slots a nerf then. However the buff, or the benefit is that people can decide wether they want to maximize tank, speed or m3 or a compromise between the 3

o/
Mag's
Azn Empire
#53 - 2012-11-18 20:52:17 UTC
Souisa wrote:
Mag's wrote:
We have already seen the big picture Souisa, you seem to have not. Now please answer the question.


Right :) When you want to explain how the freighter is going to be worse off from getting fitting slots by all means, please do.
Because fitting cargo expanders have draw backs, making the freighter worse than it was without fitting slots at the same cargo size.

Now please answer the question.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#54 - 2012-11-18 20:54:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Souisa wrote:
When you want to explain how the freighter is going to be worse off from getting fitting slots by all means, please do.
This has already been done numerous times. Now stop trolling before you get this thread locked just like your last one (you know that you're not allowed to re-open closed threads, right?).

Quote:
Well ok. Lets just call fitting slots a nerf then. However the buff, or the benefit is that people can decide wether they want to maximize tank, speed or m3 or get some of each
…which isn't a buff since it'll be less in total than they have now. Right now you don't have to choose because you already have everything.

So how are those reductions not a nerf? Also, why do you want to nerf freighters and what problem are you trying solve by doing so?
Souisa
Subhypersonics
#55 - 2012-11-18 20:55:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Souisa
Mag's wrote:
Souisa wrote:
Mag's wrote:
We have already seen the big picture Souisa, you seem to have not. Now please answer the question.


Right :) When you want to explain how the freighter is going to be worse off from getting fitting slots by all means, please do.
Because fitting cargo expanders have draw backs, making the freighter worse than it was without fitting slots at the same cargo size.

Now please answer the question.


I kind of covered the drawbacks of the different modules, and like i said, cargo expanding rigs will be the most commonly used as it has the least worst penalty, which is reduction in armor. And like i said, low slots are meant to support the buffer tank. If they are used to boost the m3 instead there will be next to no buffer, and the freighter will just be extremely vulnerable to ganks etc.

o/
Mag's
Azn Empire
#56 - 2012-11-18 20:57:18 UTC
Souisa wrote:
Mag's wrote:
Souisa wrote:
Mag's wrote:
We have already seen the big picture Souisa, you seem to have not. Now please answer the question.


Right :) When you want to explain how the freighter is going to be worse off from getting fitting slots by all means, please do.
Because fitting cargo expanders have draw backs, making the freighter worse than it was without fitting slots at the same cargo size.

Now please answer the question.


I kind of covered the drawbacks of the different modules, and like i said, cargo expanding rigs will be the most commonly used as it has the least worst penealty, which is reduction in armor. And like i said, people will utilize the structure for the buffer tank, or expanded cargo holds, who cares. regardless of what they do they will either have a "tanky" freighter, or a freighter with a large cargohold or a freighter that has niether but is optimized for speed instead
So why do you want to nerf freighters, when you could ask for a new ship type instead?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#57 - 2012-11-18 20:58:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Souisa wrote:
´I kind of covered the drawbacks of the different modules, and like i said, cargo expanding rigs will be the most commonly used as it has the least worst penealty, which is reduction in armor. And like i said, people will utilize the structure for the buffer tank, or expanded cargo holds, who cares.
We care because we don't want to have to give trade cargo space for HP when we can have both. Your idea is that people will have to give up one of the two (or both) to keep the other.

Quote:
regardless of what they do they will either have a "tanky" freighter, or a freighter with a large cargohold or a freighter that has niether but is optimized for speed instead
As luck would have it, the current freighter has the best combination of the three that you can ask for. You are trying to present a requirement to suddenly start giving two up to maintain the third as a buff, when it actually means that you get a less capable ship all in all.

So how are those reductions not a nerf? Also, why do you want to nerf freighters and what problem are you trying solve by doing so?
Souisa
Subhypersonics
#58 - 2012-11-18 21:07:34 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Souisa wrote:
When you want to explain how the freighter is going to be worse off from getting fitting slots by all means, please do.
This has already been done numerous times. Now stop trolling before you get this thread locked just like your last one (you know that you're not allowed to re-open closed threads, right?).

Quote:
Well ok. Lets just call fitting slots a nerf then. However the buff, or the benefit is that people can decide wether they want to maximize tank, speed or m3 or get some of each
…which isn't a buff since it'll be less in total than they have now. Right now you don't have to choose because you already have everything.

So how are those reductions not a nerf? Also, why do you want to nerf freighters and what problem are you trying solve by doing so?


Basically the freighter doesent do its job very good atm. Its often overtanked, with way more m3 than needed, and/or slower than needed. Basically with fitting slots this could change. The idea is to lower the base m3 and base structural HP, and then having players improve the freighter whichever way they want. Some situations call for a large buffer tank, others call for speed. others just call for maximum m3. depending on what players choose, the freighter will have drawbacks in another area. For example choosing to maximise m3 will come at severe cost to its tanking abilities, maximising tanking abilities will come at the cost to m3 and speed, so on so forth. People dont even have to choose between speed, tank or m3, it is entirely possible to make a compromise and actually end up with a freighter that is similar to the one today, however it all depends on the new base attributes

o/
Mag's
Azn Empire
#59 - 2012-11-18 21:12:03 UTC
So you want to make the freighter worse, so you can fit stuff?

Which begs the question why ask for a nerf, when you could ask for a new ship type?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Souisa
Subhypersonics
#60 - 2012-11-18 21:14:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Souisa
If we agree that the freighter can improve from this, why make a new ship, instead of supporting the change. Adding a new freighter would also end up making the current one obsolete

o/