Player Features and Ideas Discussion

A seperate idea I had was to put the Rifter and other distinct frigs of its bracket to a seperate "Corvette" bracket. I know it is annoying to be coming with new names but since this tiericide is putting things upside-down, I do think we should broaden the horizon. Disregarding the actual "size/ship" term, I think it would be easier to give the Rifter as well as others seperate bonuses as well as not having the apparent need to be compared with the new kings like Slasher etc.

Let's face it, Slasher and similar frigates are here to stay as true tacklers. Whatever may be, Rifter is now a shadow as the other frigates can literally do the job better.

In this case, maybe we should consider Rifter follow a slightly heavier combat role; as suggested just above with arties.

I hate to come with this ridiculous one, but maybe we could have some sort of flexibility...
You know, Rifter and others of its sort being a "T1.25"... 'ish?

To be between that of an ordinary T1.0 and the more effective (T1.5) faction frig; but Rifter etc not being faction frigs and just a tad stronger than ordinary T1s such as slasher. I know the line is thin but that's what I think has to happen.

It would give some leeway for the Rifter and similar ones to have their advantages without having too much worry.


The easiest (but likely the most pain-in-the-veldspar) suggestion would be giving an AB bonus to Rifter specifically, but that is where the cascade of headaches would start. Then again, it would give it that interesting aspect of AB-speed tanking. It would still die, but it would have a special feature unlike Slasher/Breacher - So in short, trade the Tracking Bonus for a decent Afterburner Speed bonus.

I would add a lot more bonuses and penalties, but that would require a tiericide within a tiericide xD!

I know about the sizes. Destroyers are not essentially the right size either, but this is a scifi game, so one can play around with terms and stuff freely :).

Might as well could push the Slasher and other attack frigates to corvette since those are actually "small and witty" ships - But that doesn't help much either. The idea was just to get the Rifter and such out of the bracket so they can be their own thing.

In my mind it goes like this overall.

The Attack frigs (Condor, Slasher, Atron, Executioner) would more likely prey on Close Combat frigs (Incursus, Merlin, Breacher, Punisher) since they often lack webs and normally fit close range guns.
The Close Combat Frigs (Incursus, Merlin, Breacher, Punisher) would more likely prey on Ranged Combat frigs (Tormentor, Kestrel, Tristan, Rifter) due to there more equal speed, mediocre tank and due to being able to themselves tank there damage.
The Ranged Combat frigs (Tormentor, Kestrel, Tristan, Rifter) would more likely prey on Attack frigs (Condor, Slasher, Atron, Executioner) because of there weak tanks, weakish damage and able to themselves project their damage well on fast moving targets.

That my theory of how it should be anyway, each ship should have a preferred prey and a predator to be weary of.

A role as dedicated "gunboat" in comparison to Breacher/Slasher sounds neat.

For that I'd change up to 3 things:

1)swap tracking bonus to 10%/lvl falloff bonus

2) slightly more pg for the occasional arty fit

3) change projectile damage bonus to either 7,5%/lvl OR give a 7,5%/lvl bonus to missile damage


The first is kind of mandatory, the Slasher is the new highspeed-brawler with the tracking bonus, there's no need for the Rifter to have one.
The second and third would be nice to have if the first change is not enough.



P.S: The falloff bonus would translate into barrage ranges of 1,5+12km for 200mms and 1,7+18km for 200mms with one TE
280mms with closerange ammo would go to 7,5+16,5 and 8,6+21 with TE

Thank you

Any idea what damage it would be doing at say, 15k with no gyro just its 5% damage per level?

Rockets have no cap, and damage selection, there "tracking" is ok and i never have problems fitting them.

Plus to get that sexy falloff range you need to use barrage which locks AC's damage type, where as the rockets with long range ammo get greater range, tracking and damage selection. AC's will make up tho with ferocious dps at close range and the Rifter hull will be far faster.

Im not sure how much damage rocket do in reality compared to on paper but then using javlin would remedy that.

Giving the Rifter a fall-off bonus will firstly and mostly boost its damage output at the edge of scrambling range which is the way you are supposed to play the breacher. The AC already has far more falloff range than any other turret. It really does not need help on that end.

If you want to make the Rifter a better arty platform which will not be played like a Breacher 90% of the time you have to give it an optimal range bonus (and I do like the idea about the rate of fire instead of damage to limit alpha damage).

Secondly, both the Kestrel and the Breacher can fit rockets but also missiles. The Kestrel in particular will probably be more played as a missile vessel than a rocket one (because if it get caught in scrambler range it's dead anyway). The breacher only issue with a missile build is its target lock range but I'm pretty sure there will be some kiting fit out there which will not brawl.

Thirdly, your predator/prey ideal vastly depends on the weapon type used by your attack/ranged combat frigs and usually is not as simple. You should not discount the fact that an attack frig will always have the choice of fleeing too.
It's true though that all of these classes have some sort of advantages that they have to abuse to beat the others (tank, manoeuvrability or damage projection). Right now, the Rifter does not fit well there and will probably be outperform by a Breacher in about every role.

Well, I've been struggling to figure out a fit that would make the Tristan work with its bonuses despite its fitting shortcomings and thought I would throw this out there to get an opinion on it. I used EFT but figured in the new CPU/PG of the ship.

[High slots]
150mm Railgun II
150mm Railgun II
Core Probe Launcher II

[Mid slots]
Limited 1mn Microwarpdrive I
Warp Disruptor II
Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I

[Low slots]
Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

[Rigs]
Small Capacitor Control Circuit I
Small Capacitor Control Circuit I
Small Capacitor Control Circuit I

[Drones]
5x Hobgoblin II
3x Warrior SW-300 (or light ECM's)



3446 m/s mwd and 477 m/s standard. Cap stable at 37% with the guns turned off and 2 minutes 37 seconds with guns turned on. All assuming old stats from EFT so it would be slightly faster and slightly more cap stable with the changes.

My thought on the probe launcher is that I would be at range so a nos/neut wouldn't really be of use and since CCP is removing the launchers I can't fit something more useful unless you think an auto-targeter is more useful. A drone link augmentor might be fun to play with a certain setup if DLA's werne't so cpu intensive (one of the reasons I rule out the idea of sentry drones). My thought on the tracking disruptor is to attempt to keep my drones and myself (and perhaps my fleet) alive. I would have considered a drone navi computer to attempt to take advantage of the drone tracking (not sure how much that would help with the fling effect though) but it just wasn't able to fit and I felt a tracking disruptor would be more useful.

Highlighted part is really bad.

You are seriously putting a target painter to help rockets hit better? Your right to comment on missile boats has been revoked....