EVE General Discussion

1. its more expensive and less accessible than other mmos

2. it takes a year to be able to do anything rewarding or entertaining

3. the pve is ******* terrible

4. the pvp is (now) becoming exclusive in far too many ways (isk down, stakes raised everywhere). there are only half a dozen ships/fits worth flying if you actually want to win. most of them are minmatar.

5. 0.0 is empty due to risk free high sec isk faucets that are completely exclusive (see 1, 2, 3) so you're kinda stuck with low sec or alpha blobs in gewns. neither of which is welcoming to new players or attractive to established ones. in fact **** it, I'll go balls deep here and say sov 0.0 is ******* horrible and futile; the isk is ****, the ctas are ****, the fleet doctines are ****, the lag is **** and the inhability for any smaller alliance to resist the larger ones because the game is fundamentally unfair (boo hoo) is in the eyes of many newcomers err, pretty ****.

so you whittle away at your player base until the only guys left are professional eve players, bitter vets in 'elite' alliances and dumb sheeple who havent yet realized they're bored (but do within a few months and move on). the high sec dwelling hoardes of aspies and high functioning sociopaths who dont want to 'play with anyone else anyway' pay your wages. so you give them stuff to do. which is not appealing to the other 9bn folks on the planet sadly. but keeps ccp in business.

6. eve is fundamentally boring as **** unless you do nothing but pvp relentlessly with a 70m sp character and have friends with tech moons to finance it for you. and this is fast becoming a case of the same 5k or so dudes fighting each other week in and week out. you cant do that anyway because nobody trusts or wants newbies around. new players (of the sort ccp advertising brings in) are generally incompatible with the mindset and intellectual challenge posed to them and just a burden that soak up all your time and enthusiasm then quit after 2-6 months.

7. you need multiple accounts to do anything fun or lucrative. so yeah, the constipation caused by having a game which demands all your time and $$$ and enthusiasm (and then some) to get any good at, or to grind around even just the most basic of **** like moving around or moving assets from one place to another, coupled with the total lack of demand for this kind of gameplay among consumers nowdays, err, puts people off. normal people that is.

ccp doesnt seem to have realized that people dont want to spend 8 hrs playing eve every day in the pursuit of 3 minutes of actual fun (which is always at the expense of weaker, dumber, poorer and less experienced players who will soon quit). and even if they do, most dont have that luxury and rapidly realize they dont have the isk (or the rl money or time to make the isk) to keep it up. and quit. or go find other games that indulge their laziness and desire to feel special and powerful asap. of which there are many and all of which have lots more people to 'be friends' with. for less cost.

so your entire player base are basically either high paid dudes who sperge in safe space or unemployed guys with above average IQ's who want to grief idealists and 'retards' out of the game. since most of those tend to be phsycially repellant young men of college age or sad middle aged losers on the dole, the target audience is pretty limited. since eve is not 'aspirational' or 'self esteem compensating' enough for the wow crowd, you're once again looking at finding new and inventive ways of retaining the attention of and/or gratifying weirdos.

8. the economy is fantastically broken and almost completely at the mercy of third world botters and hoardes of non-english speaking rmters for whom eve is not entertainment but a ******* career move.

9. there is literally nothing to do for the first 6 months in this game except go afk or grind pve. the much vaunted romantic notions of yore no longer apply; you are not useful in a rifter. those days are long, long gone.

dichotomy between pve and pvp skills training and ignorance among new players of the distinction between the two just makes people quit when they get bored of missions and can't pvp because they a) have literally no ******* clue how and even if they do, they can't afford to lose thei rocket fit cynabal more than once or twice before they're broke (not that they will risk it anyway, being nerdy cowards) and b) their skills they spent months patiently working on are ******* useless for the task.

10. there is no incentive financially or in terms of roi to training a new character from scratch over just say, dropping $200 on one
+ lots more ad nauseum

tl;dr eve only appeals to 'pro' mmo players who are sadists or masochists or mentally handicapped in some way. its expensive, time consuming and unrewarding except at the highest levels; which are inaccessible to people who are not able to spend 5+ hrs a day playing eve ie. folks who can stump up the mandatory $2-400 to get a character and assets that can realize that ambition quickly enough to maintain their interest.

which isnt usually very enduring because: the core game is **** and the pvp is fast becoming **** due to incursion based inflation and propagation of faction hulls and other ******** **** that is far too common and far too good compared to everything else on offer.

1. I'm unemployed and can't understand long sentences with difficult words, so I never even try

2. I believed the guys in NPC corps and grinded missions instead of doing something fun

3. I read mission walkthroughs so I couldn't fail them and then grinded the same missions over and over and over and over and over again

4. I'm also spacepoor and can't work out my own fits and believe everything they say on Battleclinic Ships & Modules

5. I've never heard of wormholes either

6. I'm an unimaginative person and can't set my own goals

7. I'm afraid of challenges and prefer instant gratification, even though I get quickly bored with that too

8. I don't understand much about economy, but I'm comfortable with making grand claims about it

9. Nobody held my hand when I was a noob, which is unfair because I'm a bit simple and can't figure out things on my own

10. I don't value things I create myself, and hate :effort: because someone else has more shineys

You're pretty fail TBH. You can incursion in a logi, which is cheap and quick to get into. You can get in in a t3 cruiser. you can get in in multiple battleships.

Wormholes still make generate more income than Incursions, they have been "devaluing isk" since 2009. It is quicker to get into a BS than it used to be if you do want to missions, and you can still easily purchase a plex every month with minimal time investment if you choose to mission.

While you are complaining about the inflation of costs, you are not complaining about the inflation of income that mission salvagers are seeing right now. That is very typical in the current inflation debacle. everything you buy costs more? well yeah, everything you sell costs more too. fancy that.

For many new players the biggest cause so far is griefing wardecs in High-sec and ganking on miners.
(New players rarely transport anything of value hence logistic ganking is less of a problem).

I'm not saying it should be different and I have done it myself, but it is really tough for a new player wanting to play with your friends facing more experienced players than yourself who war dec's corporations in high sec for money or tears.

People constantly claim more and easier pew pew in high sec. I get the point why, but honestly it will only cause more problems with people who are either learning the game or who have less interest in pew pew.

On the other hand rewards should ofcourse follow and an overall empire tax of 5-10% on missions, trade and mining could be a solution. On the other hand make it harder to wardec corps and alliances non-consensual.

Just thinking aloud after reading your post regarding your last idea. Heres the gist of it. Expand the ISD for each faction in the Eve-uni/RvB style of play. Merge all three starter NPC corps into one. As with the character creation changes it really doesnt matter WHERE you start now stat wise its only a cosmetic choice anyway. Then give each new starter corp its own "alliance" chat tab in the channels list but label it "faction" instead. Have this be run by RPing ISD volunteers to give a combined newbie alliance and corp feeling within the starting home as well as an RP value with live events created by CCP and the ISD volunteers for each faction for the RP element. Also create a "faction RvB" style corp where you can leave the starter corp to join but STILL go back to the original starter corp if you dont like it run in the RvB style. Cheap ships lots of fights in only a few systems. This would essentially become a feeder for the "faction warfare" NPC corp which also will have a chat tab as well. But then not have that the main FW chat tab. As itll reduce the likelihood of spies, sure theres already many but still. Same with the RvB ones.

1. its more expensive and less accessible than other mmos

The very notion that the game needs to be made harder and unfriendlier in high sec is so completely moronic that it doesn't even deserve to be debated But it will, because this game is overrun with borderline sociopaths.

The main thing that needs to happen to fix this game is that the pvp GODS need to stop telling the rest of us how to play and how we're supposed to enjoy the game. Non-consensual pvp in high sec is a complete turnoff. People who think more of that is going to bring more people to this game are in a dream world. That's already driven thousands and thousands and thousands of players out of the game.

There are staggeringly more people who have quit this game than those of us who have stuck with it. Somebody needs to start talking to them and stop listening to the HARDEN THE **** UP idiots who want nothing from the game except other people's unhappiness.

People play WOW and Sttar Wars in droves because they can play casually and they can choose how much upset they want brought into their lives by other players. Players in Eve are told to get screwed and learn to like it. So which game do you think the most people will try? And which game do you think the most people will stick with? This is not hard to understand. People leave the game because it's a mean game, people are proud of how mean it is, and people constantly rub your face in it.

The very notion that the game needs to be made harder and unfriendlier in high sec is so completely moronic that it doesn't even deserve to be debated But it will, because this game is overrun with borderline sociopaths.