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Removing the sand from the sandbox
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Daiony
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2012-03-14 08:33:34 UTC
It's happening. Very slowly. The problem with that is, that slow changes are not percieved by the masses as bad, they have time to adapt to them and roll with them. If all the little changes where to be applied in one go, there would be a riot

Thats human psychology folks. Nothing we can do about it. Slow changes are not percieved as a threat to our standard of living

The problem is, that CCP themselves seem to slowly lose their way. The original vision for eve seems to fade away. A few little cuts here, a few there. Yes, some guys wont like it but they will sigh and then adapt.

What happened to the idea that you have to work hard to overcome the odds? So your corp members can only mostly fly frigates and cruisers and the enemy can fly Battleships with T2 Guns? You can't touch them at that range, and they can't be killed, but they kill you easily from 160km away.

Now the logical answer would obviously be to train up and do the same. Get into those Battleships yourselves, buy some T2 guns and even the battlefield. Thats the way eve used to be

You could also flat out refuse to fly battleships, because you don't like the way they move. They are cumbersome, restricted in their movement. They are also much more expensive than your cruisers and frigates. Why should you have to fly Battleships to be able to counter battleships? It's also much easier to replace a lost fleet of criusers and frigates, they can be build much faster and cheaper

Well, you don't have to fly Battleships to counter battleships. There are other ways of doing it wich require more refined tactics and fittings. But countering Battleships with battleships is also a viable option. You would have to change your logistical backbone tho, you would have to start building them yourself. You might not even have to use them, just the sheer potential of being able to use them could lead to the other guys not bringing theirs wich would be a win

In todays eve, you just have to refuse to enter a certain type of game element. You can just ignore it. In th end the game will adapt to your playstyle if you just cry loud and long enough
Most 0.0 Alliances engage in ALL possible gameplay elements eve has to offer. From pvp to PvE to Trading, Science, Industry. If you want to be a top contender and chose to engage a top contender, you need to sort your **** and gather ALL the tools required to do the job

Thats what we would have done in 2005 or so. Start building ******* battleships!
Serene Repose
#2 - 2012-03-14 08:37:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Serene Repose
I love how the pseudo-intellectuals always refer to everyone but themselves as the "masses." The "masses" (of course) never notice what they notice. Then, peel the layers from the textual onion, it reveals itself as pedestrain drivvel.

Yeah. EVE's morphing into something else. Yeah. People who played the old one don't like it. No. New players don't know the difference. Yes. If CCP pays its bills, they really don't care what you think about it.

Think about it.

We must accommodate the idiocracy.
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#3 - 2012-03-14 08:39:02 UTC
Daiony wrote:
It's happening. Very slowly. The problem with that is, that slow changes are not percieved by the masses as bad, they have time to adapt to them and roll with them. If all the little changes where to be applied in one go, there would be a riot

Thats human psychology folks. Nothing we can do about it. Slow changes are not percieved as a threat to our standard of living

The problem is, that CCP themselves seem to slowly lose their way. The original vision for eve seems to fade away. A few little cuts here, a few there. Yes, some guys wont like it but they will sigh and then adapt.

What happened to the idea that you have to work hard to overcome the odds? So your corp members can only mostly fly frigates and cruisers and the enemy can fly Battleships with T2 Guns? You can't touch them at that range, and they can't be killed, but they kill you easily from 160km away.

Now the logical answer would obviously be to train up and do the same. Get into those Battleships yourselves, buy some T2 guns and even the battlefield. Thats the way eve used to be

You could also flat out refuse to fly battleships, because you don't like the way they move. They are cumbersome, restricted in their movement. They are also much more expensive than your cruisers and frigates. Why should you have to fly Battleships to be able to counter battleships? It's also much easier to replace a lost fleet of criusers and frigates, they can be build much faster and cheaper

Well, you don't have to fly Battleships to counter battleships. There are other ways of doing it wich require more refined tactics and fittings. But countering Battleships with battleships is also a viable option. You would have to change your logistical backbone tho, you would have to start building them yourself. You might not even have to use them, just the sheer potential of being able to use them could lead to the other guys not bringing theirs wich would be a win

In todays eve, you just have to refuse to enter a certain type of game element. You can just ignore it. In th end the game will adapt to your playstyle if you just cry loud and long enough
Most 0.0 Alliances engage in ALL possible gameplay elements eve has to offer. From pvp to PvE to Trading, Science, Industry. If you want to be a top contender and chose to engage a top contender, you need to sort your **** and gather ALL the tools required to do the job

Thats what we would have done in 2005 or so. Start building ******* battleships!


Actually they're just changing the sand. The old sand was dirty and rumor has it that there was BoB poo in it.

Ewwww. BoB poo.

Also the sandbox has been slightly reshaped and some of the old razor sharp edges have been ground off.

But the sandbox still is not a Theme Park (thankfully), no matter how bad you think it's gotten.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
seany1212
M Y S T
#4 - 2012-03-14 08:42:34 UTC
Another "I am mad because I cannot pwn everything solo anymore".

Battleships with T2 guns is good and all but you're not going to hit those rifters for **** if they get transversal on you. Exactly how it should be...
KrakizBad
Section 8.
#5 - 2012-03-14 08:42:46 UTC
Posting in Titan Nerf Whine thread #43252.
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#6 - 2012-03-14 08:44:58 UTC
KrakizBad wrote:
Posting in Titan Nerf Whine thread #43252.


Oh come on!

I worked my brain off to come up with the reference to BoB poo and I don't even get a "Yeah, bro!" from my bro?

Oh wait this is Titan Nerf Whine thread #43252!

Well, carry on then!

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
#7 - 2012-03-14 08:46:42 UTC
EVE stopped being EVE at Dominion. The trouble is, we have been floundering ever since. Dust 514 will determine if those changes were worth it or not.

It's interesting you use 2005 as the marker point though. It used to be 2003. You don't see too many 2003 names in the game though.

R.I.P. Vile Rat
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#8 - 2012-03-14 08:56:32 UTC
They aren't removing the sand. It's just been shifted around a litle and as a consequense, some of it has found its way in to the vaginas of some players. That in turn is causing some personal irritation and mad posting, but overall things are fine in the sandbox and many other players are happy with the new way the sands are shifting.

The funny part is, that CCP has been very open where and how it is shifting the sands, so any actually intelligent person has had plenty of warning and time to adjust and plan for the new situation. Despite this some self-proclaimed intellectuals still act surprised about the changes and continue to fight a losing battle to the bitter end to defend the old situation, that CCP has stated is not intended and was just a matter of time before it was changed.
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#9 - 2012-03-14 08:58:08 UTC
Destination SkillQueue wrote:
They aren't removing the sand. It's just been shifted around a litle and as a consequense, some of it has found its way in to the vaginas of some players. That in turn is causing some personal irritation and mad posting, but overall things are fine in the sandbox and many other players are happy with the new way the sands are shifting.

The funny part is, that CCP has been very open where and how it is shifting the sands, so any actually intelligent person has had plenty of warning and time to adjust and plan for the new situation. Despite this some self-proclaimed intellectuals still act surprised about the changes and continue to fight a losing battle to the bitter end to defend the old situation, that CCP has stated is not intended and was just a matter of time before it was changed.


No I'm pretty sure they changed the sand due to BoB poo.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
Daiony
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2012-03-14 09:00:49 UTC
seany1212 wrote:
Another "I am mad because I cannot pwn everything solo anymore".

Battleships with T2 guns is good and all but you're not going to hit those rifters for **** if they get transversal on you. Exactly how it should be...


I am not sure if you understand completely how transversal works, especially against large spread out groups of ships. Thats also why you still will be blapped. Exactly as it should be.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#11 - 2012-03-14 09:06:56 UTC
Daiony wrote:
Now the logical answer would obviously be to train up and do the same. Get into those Battleships yourselves, buy some T2 guns and even the battlefield. Thats the way eve used to be
…and moving away from that kind of static “bigger is better”-thinking is a good way of adding sand to the sandbox, rather than just cementing the whole thing and requiring everyone to do the same thing.
seany1212
M Y S T
#12 - 2012-03-14 09:08:59 UTC
Daiony wrote:
seany1212 wrote:
Another "I am mad because I cannot pwn everything solo anymore".

Battleships with T2 guns is good and all but you're not going to hit those rifters for **** if they get transversal on you. Exactly how it should be...


I am not sure if you understand completely how transversal works, especially against large spread out groups of ships. Thats also why you still will be blapped. Exactly as it should be.


I fully understand how transversal works but when you're using the equivalent of artillery and its still hitting at relatively close range while tracking there is something wrong.

Also, yea bro Gustav Lol
KrakizBad
Section 8.
#13 - 2012-03-14 09:11:11 UTC
Darth Gustav wrote:
KrakizBad wrote:
Posting in Titan Nerf Whine thread #43252.


Oh come on!

I worked my brain off to come up with the reference to BoB poo and I don't even get a "Yeah, bro!" from my bro?

Oh wait this is Titan Nerf Whine thread #43252!

Well, carry on then!

Too many tears today. Sad

Ahem..."Yeah, bro!"
Daiony
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-03-14 09:13:05 UTC
Well, i think we can all agree that this nerf in this shape and form would be diletantic. If CCP nerfs Titans Scan Resolution, the need to nerf it for all Capitals and then in turn increase sig radius. Because with this nerf, they will not only circumcise titans ability to fight subcaps, but also capitals. Wich is their inteded role i think.

Also, if you want to go further with the sand removing, make TCUs and SBUs immune or highly resistant to sub caps, to enforce alliances to use their capitals.
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#15 - 2012-03-14 09:13:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Darth Gustav
KrakizBad wrote:
Darth Gustav wrote:
KrakizBad wrote:
Posting in Titan Nerf Whine thread #43252.


Oh come on!

I worked my brain off to come up with the reference to BoB poo and I don't even get a "Yeah, bro!" from my bro?

Oh wait this is Titan Nerf Whine thread #43252!

Well, carry on then!

Too many tears today. Sad

Ahem..."Yeah, bro!"


Thanks bro!

Edit:

Daiony wrote:
Well, i think we can all agree that this nerf in this shape and form would be diletantic. If CCP nerfs Titans Scan Resolution, the need to nerf it for all Capitals and then in turn increase sig radius. Because with this nerf, they will not only circumcise titans ability to fight subcaps, but also capitals. Wich is their inteded role i think.

Also, if you want to go further with the sand removing, make TCUs and SBUs immune or highly resistant to sub caps, to enforce alliances to use their capitals.


See, this is mixed posting. You start off with drivel about roles when Titans are just really big taxis.

But then you go and make a damned good point.

Tough call.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
seany1212
M Y S T
#16 - 2012-03-14 09:46:01 UTC
Except adjusting SBUs and TCUs to your method just further removes the chances of smaller alliances getting on the map without the backing of much larger alliances' cap fleets. You really want to keep your space don't you? Blink
Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
#17 - 2012-03-14 10:43:16 UTC
seany1212 wrote:
Except adjusting SBUs and TCUs to your method just further removes the chances of smaller alliances getting on the map without the backing of much larger alliances' cap fleets. You really want to keep your space don't you? Blink


This is the issue no nerf has been able to remedy.

Nobody should "lose thier space". No nerf should be geared to take any alliances space. CCP have no right to take anyones space. If they do have that right, they have alot of other ingame issues they can pile on that police saddle.

The issue right now is if you can hold 5 systems, you can hold 50. If you can't hold 50 you can't hold 1 and that is what makes the Null Sov game a pile of steaming dogshit.

R.I.P. Vile Rat
Rico Minali
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2012-03-14 10:51:48 UTC
Daiony wrote:
It's happening. Very slowly. The problem with that is, that slow changes are not percieved by the masses as bad, they have time to adapt to them and roll with them. If all the little changes where to be applied in one go, there would be a riot

Thats human psychology folks. Nothing we can do about it. Slow changes are not percieved as a threat to our standard of living

The problem is, that CCP themselves seem to slowly lose their way. The original vision for eve seems to fade away. A few little cuts here, a few there. Yes, some guys wont like it but they will sigh and then adapt.

What happened to the idea that you have to work hard to overcome the odds? So your corp members can only mostly fly frigates and cruisers and the enemy can fly Battleships with T2 Guns? You can't touch them at that range, and they can't be killed, but they kill you easily from 160km away.

Now the logical answer would obviously be to train up and do the same. Get into those Battleships yourselves, buy some T2 guns and even the battlefield. Thats the way eve used to be

You could also flat out refuse to fly battleships, because you don't like the way they move. They are cumbersome, restricted in their movement. They are also much more expensive than your cruisers and frigates. Why should you have to fly Battleships to be able to counter battleships? It's also much easier to replace a lost fleet of criusers and frigates, they can be build much faster and cheaper

Well, you don't have to fly Battleships to counter battleships. There are other ways of doing it wich require more refined tactics and fittings. But countering Battleships with battleships is also a viable option. You would have to change your logistical backbone tho, you would have to start building them yourself. You might not even have to use them, just the sheer potential of being able to use them could lead to the other guys not bringing theirs wich would be a win

In todays eve, you just have to refuse to enter a certain type of game element. You can just ignore it. In th end the game will adapt to your playstyle if you just cry loud and long enough
Most 0.0 Alliances engage in ALL possible gameplay elements eve has to offer. From pvp to PvE to Trading, Science, Industry. If you want to be a top contender and chose to engage a top contender, you need to sort your **** and gather ALL the tools required to do the job

Thats what we would have done in 2005 or so. Start building ******* battleships!



Im not sure I understood the post, you start by saying ccp and eve is changing and that the sandbox is dying, and by the end of it its a post about how you need to build battleships and go out fighting.. Maybe Im missing siomethign, like a reason why teh sandbox is dying, or how relevent battleships are to teh sandbox. I dunno, post just seems to be a vague rant about somethign, just not sure what that somethign is...

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Sable Moran
Moran Light Industries
#19 - 2012-03-14 11:58:30 UTC
Destination SkillQueue wrote:
The funny part is, that CCP has been very open where and how it is shifting the sands, so any actually intelligent person has had plenty of warning and time to adjust and plan for the new situation.


Not only plenty of warning but also a chance to affect what the new situation will be. And still people *****...

Sable's Ammo Shop at Alentene V - Moon 4 - Duvolle Labs Factory. Hybrid charges, Projectile ammo, Missiles, Drones, Ships, Need'em? We have'em, at affordable prices. Pop in at our Ammo Shop in sunny Alentene.
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#20 - 2012-03-14 12:05:54 UTC
Daiony wrote:
It's happening. Very slowly. The problem with that is, that slow changes are not percieved by the masses as bad, they have time to adapt to them and roll with them. If all the little changes where to be applied in one go, there would be a riot

Thats human psychology folks. Nothing we can do about it. Slow changes are not percieved as a threat to our standard of living

The problem is, that CCP themselves seem to slowly lose their way. The original vision for eve seems to fade away. A few little cuts here, a few there. Yes, some guys wont like it but they will sigh and then adapt.

What happened to the idea that you have to work hard to overcome the odds? So your corp members can only mostly fly frigates and cruisers and the enemy can fly Battleships with T2 Guns? You can't touch them at that range, and they can't be killed, but they kill you easily from 160km away.

Now the logical answer would obviously be to train up and do the same. Get into those Battleships yourselves, buy some T2 guns and even the battlefield. Thats the way eve used to be

You could also flat out refuse to fly battleships, because you don't like the way they move. They are cumbersome, restricted in their movement. They are also much more expensive than your cruisers and frigates. Why should you have to fly Battleships to be able to counter battleships? It's also much easier to replace a lost fleet of criusers and frigates, they can be build much faster and cheaper

Well, you don't have to fly Battleships to counter battleships. There are other ways of doing it wich require more refined tactics and fittings. But countering Battleships with battleships is also a viable option. You would have to change your logistical backbone tho, you would have to start building them yourself. You might not even have to use them, just the sheer potential of being able to use them could lead to the other guys not bringing theirs wich would be a win

In todays eve, you just have to refuse to enter a certain type of game element. You can just ignore it. In th end the game will adapt to your playstyle if you just cry loud and long enough
Most 0.0 Alliances engage in ALL possible gameplay elements eve has to offer. From pvp to PvE to Trading, Science, Industry. If you want to be a top contender and chose to engage a top contender, you need to sort your **** and gather ALL the tools required to do the job

Thats what we would have done in 2005 or so. Start building ******* battleships!


ramble ramble ramble - what?

I'm not even sure what your complaint is other than "something" changed.

Are you pro-battleship or anti-battleship?

Or are *you* the one crying loud and long enough to try and get something to change?


I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
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