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CCP... What the Crap?

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Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2012-03-04 20:52:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Ris Dnalor
Justifying how many hours of work with this poop?

SOURCE: http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=9130

TL;DR -- Some changes goodish, some changes badish, but some changes make less sense than the original names!?!?

How's that possible?!? I'm really curious about the reasons WHY these ideas seemed like an improvement, because some sure don't to me.



CCP Gnauton wrote:
So without further ado, here's what we've changed this time around. These changes are already in on Singularity, and will hit TQ in March.

A note to begin with: we've come up with a standardized global scheme for Meta Level 1-4 modules, so by looking at the name you should be able to tell at a glance where the item falls in the Meta pecking order. It goes like this:

Meta Level 1: Upgraded

Meta Level 2: Limited

Meta Level 3: Experimental

Meta Level 4: Prototype

This will, in due time, be applied to every Meta level 1-4 module in the game, and except where otherwise noted, has been applied to all module groups mentioned in the list below.


So you have replaced numbers 1-4 with names. o.k. No improvement in market searchability. Problem not solved wherein meta 1-4 are not always progressively "better" than the tier below it. Confusion not remedied. What did we gain?

How about this?

Just put an M1, M2, M3, M4 in the name of the stupid item? How hard would that be? Just put the M1 right where the roman numeral II goes for tech 2 stuff.... I mean if simplifying is what you want to do, then do it. or don't. Just don't mish-mosh around and change things for the sake of changing them....

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2012-03-04 20:52:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Ris Dnalor
CCP Gnauton wrote:
Skill Hardwiring

All Skill Hardwiring implants in the game have had their names changed to conform to this format:

[Corporation][Implant Group Name][Skill/Function Name][Two-Letter Flavor Acronym]-[Slot Number][Percentage Bonus]

As an example, the Hardwiring - Inherent Implants 'Lancer' G0.5-Betaimplant, which fits in implant slot 7 and gives a 2% bonus to the Controlled Bursts skill, has now become the Inherent Implants 'Lancer' Controlled Bursts CB-702 implant. Hardwiring - Eifyr and Co. 'Rogue' HY-2.5, which goes in implant slot 6 and gives an 18% bonus to Warp Speed, is now Eifyr and Co. 'Rogue' Warp Drive Speed WS-618.


Let's put this in a better comparative format:

OLD: Hardwiring - Inherent Implants 'Lancer' G0.5-Beta
NEW: Inherent Implants 'Lancer' Controlled Bursts CB-702

So new players will automatically know that 702 means slot 7 and 2% bonus. Yea, I see that. And they'll also know what "controlled burst" means? And of course Controlled burst is easier to memorize and type into a search box than 'lancer' G. O.K....

OLD: Hardwiring - Eifyr and Co. 'Rogue' HY-2.5
NEW: Eifyr and Co. 'Rogue' Warp Drive Speed WS-618

This one is better, but again, new players will still have to be taught about the numbers at the end, so it's not like we're adding anything intuitive. I suppose once they learn, they won't have to click "show info" to see the % boost stat, once they learn to read it. Is that what we're accomplishing here?

AND!!!

Let's look at some examples you DID NOT list that I get from this SOURCE: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Module_changes

OLD: Hardwiring - Inherent Implants 'Noble' ZET300
NEW: Inherent Implants 'Noble' Mechanic MC-803

hm... pictures the mechanic from Serenity...

OLD: Hardwiring - Eifyr and Co. 'Rogue' DY-0.5
NEW: Eifyr and Co. 'Rogue' Fuel Conservation FC-802

Fuel Conservation? We going green? Does this save me jump fuel? Where do I gas up my ship, I don't want to run out of fuel mid-fight!!?! My point is that a new player isn't going to know what the skill does, so if you're simplifying implants by showing what skill they modify, not sure that's making them more new-player friendly.

OLD: Hardwiring - Zainou 'Snapshot' ZMT1000
NEW: Zainou 'Snapshot' Torpedoes TD-603

Ok, so this boosts torpedoes... How? Faster, longer flight time, more damage, tighter explosion radius, less effect of target velocity on damage reduction, launcher ( or array ) rof bonus? Really? I mean, sure they can learn what it means, but they could learn it before.

WTF??!?!

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2012-03-04 20:52:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Ris Dnalor
CCP Gnauton wrote:
Armor Coating/Armor Hardener/Armor Plating Energized/Shield Resistance Amplifier/Shield Hardener

Every module that boosts either armor or shield resistance has gone under the knife. In addition to adapting them to the global Meta 1-4 scheme, we've replaced the words "Reflective," "Reactive" and "Magnetic" with the modules' relevant damage types (EM, Explosive and Kinetic, respectively).



Wait a minute. You just assigned arbitrary names ( which by the way makes it HARDER to search for the right missile ) for damage types for missiles. But apparently Trauma is a fckload eaiser to learn than Magnetic? What the hell? Really?

But wait, there are still arbitrary things about your new names. Why no examples here?

OLD: Explosion Dampening Amplifier I
NEW: Explosive Deflection Amplifier I

OLD: Heat Dissipation Amplifier I
NEW: Thermic Dissipation Amplifier I

OLD: Kinetic Deflection Amplifier I
NEW: Kinetic Deflection Amplifier I

OLD : Magnetic Scattering Amplifier I
NEW: EM Ward Amplifier I

So... Explosion was too freakin complicated, and Explosive is better.
Heat is so much more confusion than thermic.. I agree...
Kinetic we left alone because we already pissed off the missile-chuckers...
and EM is better than magnetic...

BUT Dampening won't do we had to change that to deflection, but we can't OBVIOUSLY couldn't deflect heat... sorry thermic energy... so we had to leave that one different as dissipation, and Since everyone knows that EM energy can't be deflected, dampened, or dissipated, we went with WARD, because noone knows wtf scattering means anyway... in fact I'm not sure that's even a word... I'm sure now that we have the ability to localize the client defence will become defense in the us, because noone's smart enough to make that leap either...

c'mon ccp, what the crap?

play the game a little and you'll know what we call the crap.

EM PASSIVE ARMOR HARDENER
KN ACTIVE SHIELD HARDENER

though for better searchabilty do this!

HARDENER, ARMOR, PASSIVE, EM
HARDENER, SHIELD, ACTIVE, KN

that'd much easier on the eyes, puts the noun first, and the adjectives in some sort of grouping order. but hey what do i know....

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2012-03-04 20:53:06 UTC

CCP Gnauton wrote:
Assault Launcher/Heavy Assault Launcher/Standard Missile Launcher/Siege Launcher

This is perhaps the most extensive and potentially controversial change we've made in this iteration, because it goes beyond individual modules and all the way into module (and market) groups.

Please make sure you disseminate this information among your corporation and alliance mates as widely as possible.

We have changed the missile launcher names as follows:

Heavy Assault Missile Launchers have become Assault Missile Launchers

Assault Missile Launchers have become Light Missile Arrays

Standard Missile Launchers have become Light Missile Launchers

Siege Launchers have become Torpedo Launchers

The general idea here was to change the name of each launcher into something more generally descriptive of its function and the type of ammo it is able to fit, and more specifically to erase the counterintuitive assault launcher/heavy assault launcher dichotomy that's caused its fair share of confusion in the past.


I'd have to say this would be the LEAST controversial of the changes I've seen. Missile types included in the names of the launchers? That's a good idea. Is it necessary? meh, I don't think so, but at least it makes sense. The fact you think this is the most controversial is.... fck I don't even have the right word for this.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2012-03-04 20:53:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Ris Dnalor
Scripts

CCP Gnauton wrote:
All scripts in the game have had the word "script" added to their names, so a simple market search for "script" will now bring up all scripts available in the game, irrespective of market group.

For a comprehensive list of every item name change made so far, please point your browsers to this EVElopedia page. This central name change portal will be updated as and when more module names get changed, and we will split it up and make it prettier in future iterations. Note that in places where the New Name column is blank, the module's name has not been changed.



right because searching for script is a lot easier than clicking on the ammo - scripts in the market tree. I like this concept, but you applied to to the group that needed it the least. holy cow.




In conclusion, I'm not sure the problem is even clearly identified. Changes to different parts of the market seem to be addressing different "problems". The changes aren't even consistent with each other... And they often don't make things easier, sometimes they're the same but different, so not even folks that already spent time learning the system know wtf is going on, and sometimes, it's even harder? really? And this is going live.

c'mon... how much of the development dollars are actually going into this sh|t?

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#6 - 2012-03-04 20:55:28 UTC
Clicking the “comments” link is hard, I take it?
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-03-04 20:59:01 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Clicking the “comments” link is hard, I take it?


Yea, I think they need to name it something else, I dunno what it means.... Perhaps something simpler like [ linkage to textual feedback mechanism ] ....

srsly I'm hoping for a lively and general discussion on the topic.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2012-03-04 21:00:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Kidd
As for the meta items......meh....doesn't matter either way. They're not descriptive either using meta 4 or prototype when talking about something unless the person you're talking to already knows what it means. It just makes it a PITA with the change since there's a bit of learning the new scheme.

As for the implants.....it's an improvement in that you'll know 702 refers to slot 7 and 2% bonus. "Controlled burst" still doesn't mean anything to me. And as usual, I replace implants so infrequently, that I generally have to look them all up to find the info on the new set I want anyway. So, this change, is more or less pointless save for the "702". Still going to have to pull the info on it to find out exactly what the bonus applies to, won't we?

CCP would be wise to sort implants based on what they affect rather than what slot they fit in. Obviously, when searching for new implants I'm looking for function, NOT WHAT SLOT THEY GO IN. And so, as usual, you have to look at all of them to make sure you're not missing something.

Don't ban me, bro!
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#9 - 2012-03-04 21:01:16 UTC
Ris Dnalor wrote:
srsly I'm hoping for a lively and general discussion on the topic.
So go to the comments thread, where that is already happening and where this feedback belongs.
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2012-03-04 21:19:51 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Ris Dnalor wrote:
srsly I'm hoping for a lively and general discussion on the topic.
So go to the comments thread, where that is already happening and where this feedback belongs.


Maybe I want to discuss it with folks that haven't read the dev blog as well? Is that so terri-badly wrong? Maybe it'll cause someone to go read the dev blog and subsquently add more feedback to the thread of which you speak?


Or maybe I'll only get responses like yours. Either way, there is no harm done.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#11 - 2012-03-04 21:22:11 UTC
Ris Dnalor wrote:
Maybe I want to discuss it with folks that haven't read the dev blog as well?
Sure doesn't seem like it. Looking at the posts, it rather looks like you want to provide feedback to CCP about their design decision… you know, kind of what you'd do in a feedback thread where they might actually read it.

Quote:
Or maybe I'll only get responses like yours. Either way, there is no harm done.
It clogs up the forums with pointless and misplaced posts. Oh well, IBTL.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#12 - 2012-03-04 21:27:42 UTC
... you so totally missed the train.

We already argued this point on the feedback and got a concession from the devs they need to go back to the white board for the module names and truama.

Bottom line what you just did was totally wasted effort.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Bischopt
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2012-03-04 22:20:55 UTC
Personally I think changing module names was and is something useless that's just going to confuse people.

Still, not the worst thing CCP has done.
AureoBroker
Perkone
Caldari State
#14 - 2012-03-04 22:40:12 UTC
The names are identical to the skills which give the same bonuses.
Stop being ********, they make perfect sense.
Tarsus Zateki
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2012-03-04 22:59:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarsus Zateki
Are you really so dimwitted that you can't learn a new naming scheme? Will CCP have to create a new tutorial module to teach you what the new names signify? Perhaps a simple voice analyzer implemented in game so that you can slur, "i want dos really gud misil thingies," in your barely literate monkey babble and the game will automatically point you to a meta level four launcher.

Eve is one of the few MMOs on the market that doesn't actively pander to the idiocy of the general public; I'm sure if you try really, really hard you'll get over this.

You asked me once, what was in Room 101. I told you that you knew the answer already. Everyone knows it. The thing that is in Room 101 is the worst thing in the world.
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Midgard Academy
#16 - 2012-03-04 23:06:43 UTC
Dear op, you sir are an idiot. Please read the dev blog again and then read the comments section.


there is over 25 pages of feed back there and several CCP posts.

After you are done with that please press Ctrl + D to your ships.

Why Can't I have a picture signature.

Also please support graphical immersion, bring back the art that brought people to EvE online originaly.
Xurr
Wasted Potential.
#17 - 2012-03-04 23:56:17 UTC
It seems like if they can't play with their barbies they'll find a new way to **** away time.

Yes I know there is an official post. Yes I posted there.
Schmacos tryne
Norsk Testosteron
#18 - 2012-03-05 00:12:22 UTC
I support this thread as I haven't read any dev blog and I don't intend to. Feedback to CCP is as useless as a condom machine in the vatican.

I totally agree on the M1-4 icon improvement and mostly agree on the rest.
EnslaverOfMinmatar
You gonna get aped
#19 - 2012-03-05 00:20:37 UTC
Remember we used to get offers to buy Nvidia videocards in the mail from CCP? CCP is mimicking Nvidia that's why they rebrand everything instead of creating new content.

Every EVE player must read this http://www.eveonline.com/background/potw/default.asp?cid=29-01-07
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2012-03-05 00:26:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Ris Dnalor
Perhaps I should have put a TL:DR

I'll go back and add one.

But here it is.


Quote:
TL;DR -- Some changes goodish, some changes badish, but some changes make less sense than the original names!?!?

How's that possible?!?



So, my real desire is to understand -- honestly -- how the specificly pointed-out changes in the pages above came about, and in what way could they have been considered a good thing?

Maybe I am an idiot, and it's obvious -- but I'm not seeing it, and noone's given me any answers to my admittedly sarcastic questions. Maybe I'll get answers, maybe not. But if I did not ask, I certainly would not have.

So, hate me if you must, think me stupid if you like. I realize my delivery is less sugar and more vinegar but hey, whoo-pee-doo!

We'll see.

Fly well out there kiddies, and srsly don't bash the Ris, because you might hurted his feelings Roll-- and that might make the purple dinosaur cry.


Don't take me so seriously, -- it could very well be that I'm not seeing the point when so many others do. It happens *shrug* but i'd like to know what it is.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
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