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Crime & Punishment

 
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Crime and NO punishment

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Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#121 - 2017-06-13 05:40:25 UTC
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:

Why do you have to keep throwing the same tired comments about AG. In any case you don't fund ganks on tears, you need ISK, ganking bumpers is not like ganking freighters.

Actually you can fund yourself off tears. Especially from the right people in the right place. I once killed a goon and his booster alt in Lanngisi who was making use of drones shooting back when you attacked the mobile tractor unit in the first month of their release. Anywho the fact he was a goon, was crying in local to leave him alone 'I haven't done anything to you why are you doing this' etc and had just spent the last 30 mins shooting peoples MTU's when I trolled him in local and linked his KM and his booster KM local started trolling him. He got salty and suddenly convo's and isk deposits started rolling in. Some people paid me small ammounts while 1 guy paid me the value of both KM's. After all was said and done 2 of us split a little under 5bil for 15mins of tracking and killing. Taught me a valuable lesson about how to turn tears into isk


Damn that is awesome, I have been given rewards for saving people, got 1bn for one jump freighter which I bumped out of optimal at the right time, but it was NCDOT., not the poor saps in hisec....

I stopped 'saving freighters' as opposed to killing gankers when one freighter pilot told me 'but thats your job' when I asked for a donation for saving him. I lost 2 ospreys cause duel and was told that's my job... Ever since anytime I've 'anti ganked' it's been focused on catching gankers with KR's before they warp to grid. Bloody greedy freighter pilots :D


I think in total I got donated to three times, though once was 1bn, another 500m and the last 100m. I also received some ISK from people who had got a reward as part of the fleet at least seven times, when I received a donation I shared it with my fellow AG fleet members.

Yeah some of the freighter players are down right obnoxious at times, but then again the gankers love to trick them so they are super paranoid at anyone who helps as they think we are part of a scam. Again it shows just how successful the gankers are with this attitude. I had some fun and great moments doing this, but I am enjoying null sec a lot more.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#122 - 2017-06-13 05:42:32 UTC
Trump The King wrote:
Came to read more dracvlad salty tears.

didn't leave disappointed.

Thankyou for the tears.


If you say so, but I think you are the salty one.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#123 - 2017-06-13 05:58:15 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:

Why do you have to keep throwing the same tired comments about AG. In any case you don't fund ganks on tears, you need ISK, ganking bumpers is not like ganking freighters.

Actually you can fund yourself off tears. Especially from the right people in the right place. I once killed a goon and his booster alt in Lanngisi who was making use of drones shooting back when you attacked the mobile tractor unit in the first month of their release. Anywho the fact he was a goon, was crying in local to leave him alone 'I haven't done anything to you why are you doing this' etc and had just spent the last 30 mins shooting peoples MTU's when I trolled him in local and linked his KM and his booster KM local started trolling him. He got salty and suddenly convo's and isk deposits started rolling in. Some people paid me small ammounts while 1 guy paid me the value of both KM's. After all was said and done 2 of us split a little under 5bil for 15mins of tracking and killing. Taught me a valuable lesson about how to turn tears into isk


Damn that is awesome, I have been given rewards for saving people, got 1bn for one jump freighter which I bumped out of optimal at the right time, but it was NCDOT., not the poor saps in hisec....

I stopped 'saving freighters' as opposed to killing gankers when one freighter pilot told me 'but thats your job' when I asked for a donation for saving him. I lost 2 ospreys cause duel and was told that's my job... Ever since anytime I've 'anti ganked' it's been focused on catching gankers with KR's before they warp to grid. Bloody greedy freighter pilots :D


I think in total I got donated to three times, though once was 1bn, another 500m and the last 100m. I also received some ISK from people who had got a reward as part of the fleet at least seven times, when I received a donation I shared it with my fellow AG fleet members.

Yeah some of the freighter players are down right obnoxious at times, but then again the gankers love to trick them so they are super paranoid at anyone who helps as they think we are part of a scam. Again it shows just how successful the gankers are with this attitude. I had some fun and great moments doing this, but I am enjoying null sec a lot more.

Oh I get it it just seems the business model of inflicting damage over preventing it is more profitable and as a mercenary at the time well... Lol

Member and Judge of the Court of Crime and Punishment

Noragens basically the Chribba of C&P - Zimmy Zeta

Confirming that we all play in Noragen's eve. - BeBopAReBop

ISD Buldath favorite ISD

'"****station games" - Sun Tzu' - Ralph King Griffin
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#124 - 2017-06-13 06:41:50 UTC
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:

Oh I get it it just seems the business model of inflicting damage over preventing it is more profitable and as a mercenary at the time well... Lol


Yeah by many orders of magnitude, also the fun factor too, strangely the biggest buzz I got from AG work was knowing how salty the gankers got when they failed, one of my biggest regrets is not recording Loyalannon ranting after AG ganked a wreck, was such an epic salty moment.....

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#125 - 2017-06-13 06:48:51 UTC
I'm sure it is impossible to lose as much salt as drac does in a typical AG whine thread without some dietary saline supplements.

Evil RatKid
Aeryn Maricadie
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#126 - 2017-06-13 09:11:29 UTC
The thing is one should not compare the risk/rewards of AG work to ganking. AG should be considered as part of industry itself. Industrialists must either bear the cost of protection or risk loss. This functions just like IRL piracy.

The salt comes into play when people claim that CCP should not allow ganking at all, because there should be a safe space for people that do not want to be involved in PVP. This is incorrect because EVE is based around PVP. Just because someone does not shoot at other people's spaceships does not mean they aren't engaged in PVP. Everyone that uses the market has engaged in competition with other players, because almost everything in the game is produced by players. This is why CCP is entirely ok with miner bumping, and other such activities. Basically anything someone does in this game affects everyone else playing therefore everyone else may affect you in turn.

This is all CODE is really about. As I understand it, it is an open secret that they are funded by GSF. Hence James' praise of the Mittani on his minerbumping website. CODE is funded to suppress hi sec mineral production thereby increasing the value of the metric cap tons of ore mined in Delve. It is absolute genius, as long as the amount destroyed in a gank is greater than the loss they profit, that is why CODE can fund an SRP for ganking. Any loot that drops is just icing on the cake.
Saeger1737
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#127 - 2017-06-13 10:30:07 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Saeger1737 wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Saeger1737 wrote:
You could bump the bumpers or bump the freighters to safety instead of crying everyday on the forum... It seems AG is like Green peace, complain enough and things may change but in the process of complaining freighters die.


Try it, it is not as easy as you think, there is a heap of difference between bumping a freighter and bumping a bumper, we used to bump the freighter out of optimal at a key moment, but that is why the gankers switched to SB's.

I have detailed above the advantages that gankers have in terms of certain key mechanics, at the end of the day it comes down to a straight damage and damage mitigation fight before CONCORD intervenes. Rather hard to be proactive on that one, but it is great when the freighter survives...

Bump freighter drop smartbombers on the stealth bombers stop making excuses, these Anti-code posts are getting ridiculous.


I ran out of time to continue this post as wife aggro, the counter bumping works in one way, which is counter bump the freighter to slow it down so it can warp and have people in interceptors or fast frigates at different points in the direction of travel so it can warp to them. This requires the freighter pilot to actually talk to you and trust you, which is an issue in itself. One of my last AG actions was saving an incursion runners bowhead in this way, with him accepting the fleet and a new AG player doing the fast frigate job, he warped out as the gank fleet arrived at their initial perch.

As for the smart bomb approach, do you know their perch and if they have SB's don't forget they have 50+ km range, so where are you going to smart bomb them? Again think it through, it is not me being ridiculous, until you actually try it yourself your comments are hot air.


How long does it take to kill a freighter? Like a minute place an alt on their fleet cloaked up and warp your battleship there warp the alt off before the bombing begins.... Should take out enough of their Dps before Concord kills the rest, then rep the freighter and send him on his way. I've literally Merced the last 6 years and combat is what I do. And there's only letters in this post not hot air.

MERC WITH A MOUTH, Send me DPS and my fleet will double it back! Special offer!
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#128 - 2017-06-13 10:55:10 UTC
Aeryn Maricadie wrote:
As I understand it, it is an open secret that they are funded by GSF.

Just check the minerbumping page, it is pretty obvious how this is founded. It even lists the name of all the donators. We are pretty open with everything we are doing.

Also most gankers are self sufficient. Even with miner ganking you can get to the point where it at least covers the cost.

Evil RatKid
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#129 - 2017-06-13 11:11:51 UTC
Saeger1737 wrote:
How long does it take to kill a freighter? Like a minute place an alt on their fleet cloaked up and warp your battleship there warp the alt off before the bombing begins.... Should take out enough of their Dps before Concord kills the rest, then rep the freighter and send him on his way. I've literally Merced the last 6 years and combat is what I do. And there's only letters in this post not hot air.


22 seconds is what they have to kill it in due to CONCORD.

Note that they are mostly -10 so have to keep moving due to faction police.

I know you know your stuff as a merc, that goes without saying, but would you burn a spy for that? Because you will have to drop fleet to warp your smart bomber in and they will notice, then you have the warp in and so on in terms of time, nah ain't going to work in practice. A number of people looked at smart bombing as one approach but its not really that great in most cases, we wanted to use it to kill the torps.

There are a number of things to do, one good one is shoot the freighter with a noob ship as they set up for the gank fleet to warp in, so pre-loads CONCORD. The bump the freighter and warp to safe trick also works, repping the target works, also ECM'ing their DPS works but they all fitted sebos, bumping out of optimal worked so they switched to SB's. They know their stuff and adjust very well.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#130 - 2017-06-13 11:22:42 UTC
Aeryn Maricadie wrote:
The thing is one should not compare the risk/rewards of AG work to ganking. AG should be considered as part of industry itself. Industrialists must either bear the cost of protection or risk loss. This functions just like IRL piracy.

The salt comes into play when people claim that CCP should not allow ganking at all, because there should be a safe space for people that do not want to be involved in PVP. This is incorrect because EVE is based around PVP. Just because someone does not shoot at other people's spaceships does not mean they aren't engaged in PVP. Everyone that uses the market has engaged in competition with other players, because almost everything in the game is produced by players. This is why CCP is entirely ok with miner bumping, and other such activities. Basically anything someone does in this game affects everyone else playing therefore everyone else may affect you in turn.

This is all CODE is really about. As I understand it, it is an open secret that they are funded by GSF. Hence James' praise of the Mittani on his minerbumping website. CODE is funded to suppress hi sec mineral production thereby increasing the value of the metric cap tons of ore mined in Delve. It is absolute genius, as long as the amount destroyed in a gank is greater than the loss they profit, that is why CODE can fund an SRP for ganking. Any loot that drops is just icing on the cake.


Well when it comes to the point that you can gank the bumper then the risk and reward aspect is very important, it is such a stupid throw away line because it is 100% risk and zero reward, it removes a bumper from a very rich player and as Macherials had gone down so much was not really a hit, though the patch will change things a bit. So if you choice is only to gank the bumper then it is entirely relevant.


Where on earth do you people get the impression taht anyone talking about balance in terms of ganking thinks that ganking should be banned and there should be totally safe places, not a single one of the AG players I met ever thought that, that is gankers putting such stupid ideas in as part of their meta gaming to keep focus away from the advantages they have, just the same as them personally attacking anyone who points out the in-balances.

I know all about CODE, Miniluv and the GSF, are you even aware that hey have a blue list of freighters that they do not gank, what amuses me is that I have an alt on that blue list and they keep denying that it exists, it is hilarious...

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Aeryn Maricadie
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#131 - 2017-06-13 13:09:09 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:


Where on earth do you people get the impression taht anyone talking about balance in terms of ganking thinks that ganking should be banned and there should be totally safe places, not a single one of the AG players I met ever thought that, that is gankers putting such stupid ideas in as part of their meta gaming to keep focus away from the advantages they have, just the same as them personally attacking anyone who points out the in-balances.

I know all about CODE, Miniluv and the GSF, are you even aware that hey have a blue list of freighters that they do not gank, what amuses me is that I have an alt on that blue list and they keep denying that it exists, it is hilarious...


As far as the tears go, I am not referring to AG's specifically. I don't really know any so I wouldn't comment on them. I am sure there are plenty of AG's that are sporting good chaps, and some not so much. At the same time there are plenty of people that do in fact think ganking should not be a part of the game. There are many threads on the subject.

As for dealing with the bumping Machs there are options other than trying to gank it which will succeed in saving the freighter. You can always bump him away from the freighter, if the freighter is unable to warp before the mach recovers from the bump you can try it again and sacrifice a perfectly cheap T1 frigate to scram/web it before it can bump again. The important thing to remember here is that killing the Mach is not the reward, the safe arrival of the cargo is.

As for surviving the gank there are two ways I have seen freighters brought down, gankalyst and Torpedo bomber. A smart bombing target breaking scorpion is a relatively cheap counter to both methods. If they try TB's then smart bombs will kill some of the incoming torps mitigating damage as well as the target breaker. If they bring Catalysts they have to bunch up on the freighter in order to be in blaster range and they typically don't have much tank, so a smart bombing BB should kill them and as a bonus you will get pods too. A lot of those gankers do in fact use implants themselves to squeeze a little extra dps out.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#132 - 2017-06-13 13:59:21 UTC
Aeryn Maricadie wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:


Where on earth do you people get the impression taht anyone talking about balance in terms of ganking thinks that ganking should be banned and there should be totally safe places, not a single one of the AG players I met ever thought that, that is gankers putting such stupid ideas in as part of their meta gaming to keep focus away from the advantages they have, just the same as them personally attacking anyone who points out the in-balances.

I know all about CODE, Miniluv and the GSF, are you even aware that hey have a blue list of freighters that they do not gank, what amuses me is that I have an alt on that blue list and they keep denying that it exists, it is hilarious...


As far as the tears go, I am not referring to AG's specifically. I don't really know any so I wouldn't comment on them. I am sure there are plenty of AG's that are sporting good chaps, and some not so much. At the same time there are plenty of people that do in fact think ganking should not be a part of the game. There are many threads on the subject.

As for dealing with the bumping Machs there are options other than trying to gank it which will succeed in saving the freighter. You can always bump him away from the freighter, if the freighter is unable to warp before the mach recovers from the bump you can try it again and sacrifice a perfectly cheap T1 frigate to scram/web it before it can bump again. The important thing to remember here is that killing the Mach is not the reward, the safe arrival of the cargo is.

As for surviving the gank there are two ways I have seen freighters brought down, gankalyst and Torpedo bomber. A smart bombing target breaking scorpion is a relatively cheap counter to both methods. If they try TB's then smart bombs will kill some of the incoming torps mitigating damage as well as the target breaker. If they bring Catalysts they have to bunch up on the freighter in order to be in blaster range and they typically don't have much tank, so a smart bombing BB should kill them and as a bonus you will get pods too. A lot of those gankers do in fact use implants themselves to squeeze a little extra dps out.


Not a bad post and I am glad to see you have not fallen for the meta gaming crying of AG want to end ganking and want safe spaces.

I among others have tried bumping them, the better option is bumping the freighter to reduce its speed so it can get into warp to a fast ship in the direction of travel.

The issue about doing a criminal act for the grand majority of AG players is that they use those toons in hisec to do stuff and do not have multiple accounts like gankers. What you said sounds easy to do, but the majority of hisec players are not able to do that without significant cost. The objective was always understood to be the safe arrival of the cargo and the ship, but this does not mean that you can ignore the risk reward element of criminal acts to prevent ganking for those players.

Talos, Brutix, Catalysts, SB's either Hound or purifier, sometimes thrashers, Catalysts have a poor optimal so bumping the freighter out of optimal is very worthwhile, you should also note that gankers will fit ECCM scripts, and the Scorpion is about 9.6 at max. The gankers seem to be using Catalysts on some recent ganks which mean the bumping out of optimal will impact them, but they will quickly switch back to SB's. The smart bomber sounds like a great idea but in practice it is not that easy to do and is easy to counter and the gankers are very good at adaptive tactics.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Super Perforator
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#133 - 2017-06-13 18:15:33 UTC
Daring to head slightly back towards the original poster... he has a new series starting.

http://www.minerbumping.com/2017/06/rusells-revenge-part-1.html

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5610165#post5610165

Praise James!
Dom Arkaral
Bannheim
Cuttlefish Collective
#134 - 2017-06-13 18:17:43 UTC
Super Perforator wrote:
Daring to head slightly back towards the original poster... he has a new series starting.

http://www.minerbumping.com/2017/06/rusells-revenge-part-1.html

Awww yuss
That's going on my tto-do list tonight :D

Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester.

Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER

Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome

CCL Loyalist
Rendiir
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#135 - 2017-06-13 20:04:26 UTC
WoW!... if you're that bothered about gankers then move to null sec..
You make a **** tonne more isk in a fraction of the time.
High-sec = newbie territory
Saeger1737
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#136 - 2017-06-13 21:28:14 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Saeger1737 wrote:
How long does it take to kill a freighter? Like a minute place an alt on their fleet cloaked up and warp your battleship there warp the alt off before the bombing begins.... Should take out enough of their Dps before Concord kills the rest, then rep the freighter and send him on his way. I've literally Merced the last 6 years and combat is what I do. And there's only letters in this post not hot air.


22 seconds is what they have to kill it in due to CONCORD.

Note that they are mostly -10 so have to keep moving due to faction police.

I know you know your stuff as a merc, that goes without saying, but would you burn a spy for that? Because you will have to drop fleet to warp your smart bomber in and they will notice, then you have the warp in and so on in terms of time, nah ain't going to work in practice. A number of people looked at smart bombing as one approach but its not really that great in most cases, we wanted to use it to kill the torps.

There are a number of things to do, one good one is shoot the freighter with a noob ship as they set up for the gank fleet to warp in, so pre-loads CONCORD. The bump the freighter and warp to safe trick also works, repping the target works, also ECM'ing their DPS works but they all fitted sebos, bumping out of optimal worked so they switched to SB's. They know their stuff and adjust very well.

Pull concord to the spot with suicide ibis's use an alt to put Concord on grid and cut the time down.

MERC WITH A MOUTH, Send me DPS and my fleet will double it back! Special offer!
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#137 - 2017-06-14 05:55:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Dracvlad
Saeger1737 wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Saeger1737 wrote:
How long does it take to kill a freighter? Like a minute place an alt on their fleet cloaked up and warp your battleship there warp the alt off before the bombing begins.... Should take out enough of their Dps before Concord kills the rest, then rep the freighter and send him on his way. I've literally Merced the last 6 years and combat is what I do. And there's only letters in this post not hot air.


22 seconds is what they have to kill it in due to CONCORD.

Note that they are mostly -10 so have to keep moving due to faction police.

I know you know your stuff as a merc, that goes without saying, but would you burn a spy for that? Because you will have to drop fleet to warp your smart bomber in and they will notice, then you have the warp in and so on in terms of time, nah ain't going to work in practice. A number of people looked at smart bombing as one approach but its not really that great in most cases, we wanted to use it to kill the torps.

There are a number of things to do, one good one is shoot the freighter with a noob ship as they set up for the gank fleet to warp in, so pre-loads CONCORD. The bump the freighter and warp to safe trick also works, repping the target works, also ECM'ing their DPS works but they all fitted sebos, bumping out of optimal worked so they switched to SB's. They know their stuff and adjust very well.

Pull concord to the spot with suicide ibis's use an alt to put Concord on grid and cut the time down.


I was going to do this with a specifically trained up alpha account, but I moved on from hisec. Actually I went back to null more like..., as a footnote I made a lot of ISK in hisec just with PI and mining Mex, the last month or two was especially easy with two Orca's, which I found to be the perfect mining ship while writing.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#138 - 2017-06-14 06:01:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Dracvlad
Super Perforator wrote:
Daring to head slightly back towards the original poster... he has a new series starting.

http://www.minerbumping.com/2017/06/rusells-revenge-part-1.html


Rusell was someone who was actually doing stuff, I rather liked his enthusiasm, but he was a bit up and down in terms of activity, also I got the feeling he wanted to develop something more organised out of AG, but I got the sense he was frustrated by the ad hoc attitude of many of the AG. I don't think he was in the HSM, but then again I wasn't either.

Try not to over do it with personal stuff and insults, he is a nice lad, if a bit intense. Question

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Trump The King
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#139 - 2017-06-15 04:29:58 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:


Try not to over do it with personal stuff and insults, he is a nice lad, if a bit intense. Question


That's rich considering Russell levels insults at code/gankers every hour hes online. do you also ask him to tone it down or do you only hold gankers up to a "moral" code?
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#140 - 2017-06-15 07:06:36 UTC
Trump The King wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:


Try not to over do it with personal stuff and insults, he is a nice lad, if a bit intense. Question


That's rich considering Russell levels insults at code/gankers every hour hes online. do you also ask him to tone it down or do you only hold gankers up to a "moral" code?


You guys can go stupid over the top mode if you get too full of it, I refer to the dropping in local of a link to minerbumping to a comment directly under a post by Loyalannon about a certain tragic event after a successful gank which we had failed to save. It was obviously in the heat of success to rub in our failure and rather a sad thing to do.

I spoke to the player concerned a couple of months later when he private convo'd me and he was fine, but it was a pity that he had done that link, and by the way I did not report it unlike some of you snowflakes would have done, though I did mention it in the AG channel and they all said to ignore it, which was what I had decided to do anyway, I was merely expressing my surprise at such an over the top link.

Does that help in understanding what I mean, or do you want to ram some other morals up my rear end?

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp