Intergalactic Summit

What in the world is going on here?

Conversational deviance

It should be pretty clear from the sheer number of non-believer entities cheerfully enslaving people that "God said to" isn't needed, Arrendis.

Deciding "it is possible to have property rights over people" pretty well does it. Most of the outer, "pirate" societies have done just that.

Unless you're really willing to say that the ships they fly are full of nothing but people who deserve to die, it seems hard to say that what you claim is so intuitively obvious is actually so obvious.

If humans do a thing, it is within human capacities to do it. If humans do a thing in large numbers, as whole societies, then it's hard to say it's even against human tendencies to do that thing.

People differ. Societies differ. Moral codes differ.

There are some things (like stealing from your neighbor, as opposed to that person from two towns over) that humans really do seem to be wired against.

For good or ill, taking slaves isn't one.




(I think my predecessor must have had this argument a lot when she was working for the Cartel. This line of argument blends in my head into moral equivalencies between the empires and the pirate factions, arguing that they're nations, civilizations unto themselves, that are just a little rougher around the edges because of the harsh conditions they live in.)

Nope. It's not needed. It is however, the excuse the Amarr use for why it's ok. The Angels and other criminal groups, on the other hand, don't even claim it's ok, only that they can do it, so why the hel not?

And yes, as you assert the 'property rights' claim, that still doesn't mean any of those groups have claimed it to be ethical or morally-sound, only that they can get away with it, much like murder and theft.

So if your defense of the Amarr is 'criminals do it too', that's really not exactly a great defense.



You mean those pirtate organizations? Like the Angels, the Blood Raiders, etc?

Yeah. They all deserve to die. That's why we're killing close to a million Blood Raider ships a month, you know?



Actually, no. People aren't wired against 'it's ok to steal from your neighbor' any more than they're wired against slavery. 'You shouldn't steal from your neighbor' is an outgrowth, of, you know, any given person being outnumbered by their neighbors. Coincidentally enough, most people will also say 'you shouldn't up and enslave your neighbor'.

All that unpleasantness is reserved for 'two towns over'. For 'The Other', regardless of who that is. It's all basically tribalism in action. Members of the group are protected, those not in the group are fair game. And no, slavery is no different from theft or murder in those cases.

After all, how often do you hear the Amarr saying 'you know what? We should totally enslave one another'? Y'don't. I wonder why. Oh, right, they're members of the tribe.

As long as it gets done, both are ok solutions.

I´m really not picky.

Are you saying you're not going to erect something for her?

So did she.

I can focus on more than one thing at a time

So ... Arrendis? I need to stop talking with you about this, now.

I'm sorry. I'd kind of like to continue, but, actually, I don't just speak for myself anymore, and I don't want to make trouble.

To restate a couple things I've always been pretty clear about: I'm a moral relativist, and there's no one in this world I want to see dead ... which doesn't stop me killing them.

No one has to deserve death-- or any other awful thing that might happen to them. The world doesn't work on such a convenient basis. It's not so neatly divided for your guns, or mine. This is filthy work we do, and we're rewarded for it handsomely.

This maybe isn't a very popular point of view.

That's okay, though.

No one's requiring my silence. It's a judgment call, one I'm making.

The Praefecta's faith is different from mine. The way I'd go about defending her civilization kind of leaves out something a little ... important, to her and those around us. To me, God's presence or absence makes basically no difference. That's not, of course, the way the Amarr themselves see it, though. Faith is a little central to their sense of themselves.

For me, too. Just, differently.

But I don't do any favors to the Praefecta, or, really, to myself, by defending them as my Angel predecessor would have, even if that's a well-worn path in my head. So ... for now, that's enough.

And Arrendis, before you start in with something smug about God? God is probably the reason the Amarr are so strong.

Whether He exists or not.