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Faction Warfare: Moving Forward.....

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Laerise
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#861 - 2012-01-21 07:59:09 UTC
Shukuzen Kiraa wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Hey guys

Great feedback in this thread. I'm taking a few notes and getting a few ideas.

One thing we might be able to do very easily is remove the faction NPCs, letting you freely travel in other factions space. How would you guys feel about that change? I've always found it a bit sad that we've isolated FW in low-sec when it could be done on a much larger scale.


Best...idea....EVER!
+1


Yeah, right, take away the only drawback of FW. Actions should have consequences, or as it was said in the CSM minutes "EVE is not a game for wusses".
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#862 - 2012-01-21 11:28:40 UTC
Shukuzen Kiraa wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Hey guys

Great feedback in this thread. I'm taking a few notes and getting a few ideas.

One thing we might be able to do very easily is remove the faction NPCs, letting you freely travel in other factions space. How would you guys feel about that change? I've always found it a bit sad that we've isolated FW in low-sec when it could be done on a much larger scale.


Best...idea....EVER!
+1


The reason that Faction Warfare pilots are against this change is simple - one of the most badass things you can pull off in Faction Warfare is a high sec kill - and its badass precisely because you have to brave both enemy pilots and enemy NPC's make your kill.

The danger and challenge of pushing into enemy highsec and still achieving a kill brings a much greater high and a much greater respect level for those who pull it off.

Removing NPC's would mean there was no difference between low sec and high sec for Faction Warfare pilots, and eliminate one of the most difficult and rewarding ways to prove your combat prowess.

Pilots like Jalmon that live like Rambo behind enemy highsec lines, stacking solo kills in a more challenging environment than he would ever face in lowsec - become heroes in their respective factions. There is no need to nerf the difficulty level of half the territory where miliitia pilots can already freely travel and fight - IF they truly have the balls and the skill.



CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#863 - 2012-01-21 16:57:09 UTC
Corpse Swallower wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Hey guys

Great feedback in this thread. I'm taking a few notes and getting a few ideas.

One thing we might be able to do very easily is remove the faction NPCs, letting you freely travel in other factions space. How would you guys feel about that change? I've always found it a bit sad that we've isolated FW in low-sec when it could be done on a much larger scale.


Awesome idea!


terribad idea. if anything increase the npcs in highsec. they should **** your **** up when you enter enemy highsec.

if you remove npcs from highsec. thats gonna make as much sense as flying threw planets.

Amarr Militia Representative - A jar of nitro
Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#864 - 2012-01-21 17:00:45 UTC
Flyinghotpocket wrote:
Corpse Swallower wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Hey guys

Great feedback in this thread. I'm taking a few notes and getting a few ideas.

One thing we might be able to do very easily is remove the faction NPCs, letting you freely travel in other factions space. How would you guys feel about that change? I've always found it a bit sad that we've isolated FW in low-sec when it could be done on a much larger scale.


Awesome idea!


terribad idea. if anything increase the npcs in highsec. they should **** your **** up when you enter enemy highsec.

if you remove npcs from highsec. thats gonna make as much sense as flying threw planets.


i think having the faction police in opposing high secs, i just think they need ot be toned down a little more and should scale with larger gangs better.

Right now you NEED a craptonne of reps to do anything in a 1.0 for any amount of time, it should be hard for a solo guy but not near impossible and scale up wiht more gang members and reps.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
#865 - 2012-01-21 17:27:18 UTC
How many militia raids on urban centres/capitals have you heard of in the entirety of human history?

The 0.9-1.0 raids should be nigh impossible to pull off .. harder than now if you ask me, unfortunately mechanics/AI are so poor that there are loopholes galore that allows even small teams unfettered access to anywhere.

The lower security areas (0.5-0.8), ie. suburbs, farms/fields on the other hand could be made easier to access for disorganized gangs .. but blank removal of all NPC's .. I feel sorry for the immortal soul that is trapped within the confines of the useless meatsuit that came up with it.

PS: Yeah, I am not much of a soundwave fan .. Smile
Schalac
Apocalypse Reign
#866 - 2012-01-21 22:03:11 UTC
I say remove the NPCs, people are already circumventing them anyway. But gate guns and faction owned station guns should fire on the enemy WTs. And enemy WTs shouldn't be given permission to dock at stations that the guns are firing on them from.

SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN!! http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schalac
Damassys Kadesh
Royal Khanid Hunting Society
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#867 - 2012-01-22 04:55:03 UTC
Schalac wrote:
I say remove the NPCs, people are already circumventing them anyway. But gate guns and faction owned station guns should fire on the enemy WTs. And enemy WTs shouldn't be given permission to dock at stations that the guns are firing on them from.


There is no reason to open up more space for the current number of pilots to fight in. Plus we'd be accepting that the war means nothing to the faction's space you're in... go ahead Gallente, run around and shoot some Caldari in our space, we have no Navy to oppose you with...

The only reason this would ever make any sense, both logistically and story-wise, is if war participation grew beyond the point of being geographically sustainable in low-sec, and factions could actually attack and take over high-sec systems.

The effort required to circumvent the NPCs is pretty balanced with the reward. It's not particularly easy to get everyone organized to do it, but when you do, you have more opportunity to catch people off guard.

Station guns firing on enemies could be added to low and/or high sec in my opinion. That is an idea that could be fleshed out.

Sourem Itharen > Congratulations Lady Kadesh, you have been selected by trial of fire and blood, under the watchful eyes of God, to represent Lord Khanid as his champion in the Imperial Succession trials -YC117
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#868 - 2012-01-22 06:16:05 UTC
Nice signature BTW, Damassys. Thanks for supporting the cause!

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Damassys Kadesh
Royal Khanid Hunting Society
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#869 - 2012-01-22 06:59:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Damassys Kadesh
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
Nice signature BTW, Damassys. Thanks for supporting the cause!


lol, I'm actually just grabbing the link to this thread to paste to militia chat right now ;)

Go team FW!

Sourem Itharen > Congratulations Lady Kadesh, you have been selected by trial of fire and blood, under the watchful eyes of God, to represent Lord Khanid as his champion in the Imperial Succession trials -YC117
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#870 - 2012-01-22 16:13:33 UTC
Hirana Yoshida wrote:
How many militia raids on urban centres/capitals have you heard of in the entirety of human history?



We haven't been able to warp huge fleets of spaceships from solar system to solar system. If we could then there might be more attacks at capitals.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#871 - 2012-01-22 17:18:35 UTC
Muad 'dib wrote:
Flyinghotpocket wrote:
Corpse Swallower wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Hey guys

Great feedback in this thread. I'm taking a few notes and getting a few ideas.

One thing we might be able to do very easily is remove the faction NPCs, letting you freely travel in other factions space. How would you guys feel about that change? I've always found it a bit sad that we've isolated FW in low-sec when it could be done on a much larger scale.


Awesome idea!


terribad idea. if anything increase the npcs in highsec. they should **** your **** up when you enter enemy highsec.

if you remove npcs from highsec. thats gonna make as much sense as flying threw planets.


i think having the faction police in opposing high secs, i just think they need ot be toned down a little more and should scale with larger gangs better.

Right now you NEED a craptonne of reps to do anything in a 1.0 for any amount of time, it should be hard for a solo guy but not near impossible and scale up wiht more gang members and reps.


muad they do scale with gangs. if you shot em more will arrive with as much dps as they need to kill the target that shot you in 8 seconds.

Amarr Militia Representative - A jar of nitro
Schalac
Apocalypse Reign
#872 - 2012-01-22 18:42:03 UTC
Damassys Kadesh wrote:
Schalac wrote:
I say remove the NPCs, people are already circumventing them anyway. But gate guns and faction owned station guns should fire on the enemy WTs. And enemy WTs shouldn't be given permission to dock at stations that the guns are firing on them from.


There is no reason to open up more space for the current number of pilots to fight in. Plus we'd be accepting that the war means nothing to the faction's space you're in... go ahead Gallente, run around and shoot some Caldari in our space, we have no Navy to oppose you with...

The only reason this would ever make any sense, both logistically and story-wise, is if war participation grew beyond the point of being geographically sustainable in low-sec, and factions could actually attack and take over high-sec systems.

The effort required to circumvent the NPCs is pretty balanced with the reward. It's not particularly easy to get everyone organized to do it, but when you do, you have more opportunity to catch people off guard.

Station guns firing on enemies could be added to low and/or high sec in my opinion. That is an idea that could be fleshed out.

You don't get it do you. We are supposed to be the ones that keep the enemy out of our highsec. Not the Navy. That is what a militia is and does. Reliance on NPCs is why cal mil is so sad to begin with.

SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN!! http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schalac
Super Chair
Project Cerberus
Templis CALSF
#873 - 2012-01-22 19:10:21 UTC
Schalac wrote:
Damassys Kadesh wrote:
Schalac wrote:
I say remove the NPCs, people are already circumventing them anyway. But gate guns and faction owned station guns should fire on the enemy WTs. And enemy WTs shouldn't be given permission to dock at stations that the guns are firing on them from.


There is no reason to open up more space for the current number of pilots to fight in. Plus we'd be accepting that the war means nothing to the faction's space you're in... go ahead Gallente, run around and shoot some Caldari in our space, we have no Navy to oppose you with...

The only reason this would ever make any sense, both logistically and story-wise, is if war participation grew beyond the point of being geographically sustainable in low-sec, and factions could actually attack and take over high-sec systems.

The effort required to circumvent the NPCs is pretty balanced with the reward. It's not particularly easy to get everyone organized to do it, but when you do, you have more opportunity to catch people off guard.

Station guns firing on enemies could be added to low and/or high sec in my opinion. That is an idea that could be fleshed out.

You don't get it do you. We are supposed to be the ones that keep the enemy out of our highsec. Not the Navy. That is what a militia is and does. Reliance on NPCs is why cal mil is so sad to begin with.


They shouldn't be "kept out", but rather its just dangerous to lead an incursion deep into enemy terroritory (such as their capital). Enter NPC Navy to do this. No where should be 100% safe.
Damassys Kadesh
Royal Khanid Hunting Society
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#874 - 2012-01-22 21:27:35 UTC
The reason any militia is sad atm is because it's hard to justify fighting for something that has no consequences, not because there are NPCs in high-sec.

Having a level of protection is important because otherwise FW would turn into 100% griefing on stations where you are trying to buy ships to go out and do real PvP in the designated low-sec areas. THAT would be sad.

Having the occasional destroyer trying to gank at Jita station, or the occasional fleet rip through high-sec and catch inattentive pilots is one thing, perma-camping Jita and forcing people to rework their logistics is just a huge pain and would only hurt the fun, people would probably un-sub, and you'd have even less good fighting overall.... terrible idea in every way.

Sourem Itharen > Congratulations Lady Kadesh, you have been selected by trial of fire and blood, under the watchful eyes of God, to represent Lord Khanid as his champion in the Imperial Succession trials -YC117
gunnergonk
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#875 - 2012-01-22 21:42:53 UTC
im a fw vet,
reason i dont fly in fw fleets or fly in black rise is because you just cant fight fw.
example, 6 caldari on a gate camp 11 neutrals in local, spys/intel says 4 gallente about to jump in great! as we take down the first 2 ships we get blobbed by 9 of the 11 neutrals and get slaughtered! so wheres the factional warefare in that?
got bored of too many pirates in black rise, imho thats whats wrong with fw.
fw should be fw. not planning for an fw fight then having a load of pirates and neutrals warp in and nail all the fw ships!

ok call me a coward but i signed up to foght the gallente and the minmatards not every tom **** or harry that flys in black rise and sees im in a fight so decides to add some dps!

gunner.
Damassys Kadesh
Royal Khanid Hunting Society
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#876 - 2012-01-23 00:05:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Damassys Kadesh
double-post :(

Sourem Itharen > Congratulations Lady Kadesh, you have been selected by trial of fire and blood, under the watchful eyes of God, to represent Lord Khanid as his champion in the Imperial Succession trials -YC117
Damassys Kadesh
Royal Khanid Hunting Society
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#877 - 2012-01-23 00:05:52 UTC
gunnergonk wrote:
im a fw vet,
reason i dont fly in fw fleets or fly in black rise is because you just cant fight fw.
example, 6 caldari on a gate camp 11 neutrals in local, spys/intel says 4 gallente about to jump in great! as we take down the first 2 ships we get blobbed by 9 of the 11 neutrals and get slaughtered! so wheres the factional warefare in that?
got bored of too many pirates in black rise, imho thats whats wrong with fw.
fw should be fw. not planning for an fw fight then having a load of pirates and neutrals warp in and nail all the fw ships!

ok call me a coward but i signed up to foght the gallente and the minmatards not every tom **** or harry that flys in black rise and sees im in a fight so decides to add some dps!

gunner.


That's a problem in high-sec boarder systems and other pie headquaters. But I don't find that to be a big problem if you're roaming around the pipes. Sometimes you run into other roaming pirate gangs, but you can never fully avoid that.

Sourem Itharen > Congratulations Lady Kadesh, you have been selected by trial of fire and blood, under the watchful eyes of God, to represent Lord Khanid as his champion in the Imperial Succession trials -YC117
Lubomir Penev
Prey Drive
#878 - 2012-01-23 07:09:34 UTC
gunnergonk wrote:
im a fw vet,
reason i dont fly in fw fleets or fly in black rise is because you just cant fight fw.
example, 6 caldari on a gate camp 11 neutrals in local, spys/intel says 4 gallente about to jump in great! as we take down the first 2 ships we get blobbed by 9 of the 11 neutrals and get slaughtered! so wheres the factional warefare in that?
got bored of too many pirates in black rise, imho thats whats wrong with fw.
fw should be fw. not planning for an fw fight then having a load of pirates and neutrals warp in and nail all the fw ships!

ok call me a coward but i signed up to foght the gallente and the minmatards not every tom **** or harry that flys in black rise and sees im in a fight so decides to add some dps!

gunner.


From someone in a corp that made its name killing AFK Gallente pilot in Genesis highsec, that's rich.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#879 - 2012-01-23 07:19:15 UTC
gunnergonk wrote:
im a fw vet,
reason i dont fly in fw fleets or fly in black rise is because you just cant fight fw.
example, 6 caldari on a gate camp 11 neutrals in local, spys/intel says 4 gallente about to jump in great! as we take down the first 2 ships we get blobbed by 9 of the 11 neutrals and get slaughtered! so wheres the factional warefare in that?
got bored of too many pirates in black rise, imho thats whats wrong with fw.
fw should be fw. not planning for an fw fight then having a load of pirates and neutrals warp in and nail all the fw ships!

ok call me a coward but i signed up to foght the gallente and the minmatards not every tom **** or harry that flys in black rise and sees im in a fight so decides to add some dps!

gunner.


well as long as people plays it .. such behavior is to be expected.
People are ******.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#880 - 2012-01-23 11:31:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Cearain
Hirana Yoshida wrote:


Restrict FW store access to active FW pilots (tie to VP/LP/Kills), ...!



I put a thread up in assembly hall for this idea. I think its a good one.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=60820&find=unread

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815