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What's best for L3s: T3D, BC, or Low-SP BS?
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Nyx Nirvana
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1 - 2017-04-04 09:52:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Nyx Nirvana
Just asking for the future: I'm an alpha with a couple of PLEX waiting to be activated when I'm as trained as an alpha can go.

I'm mission running in highsec, and am looking for the higher missions (L3s/L4s) to be my main source of income for the future. Specifically, I want to try and get to L4s as quickly as possible. As a Caldari player, I want to keep down the Caldari ship route for the future. I've had varying responses as to which of these three is better. When I activate my PLEX, should I:

1) Start training into a Jackdaw (with decent backup skills): I've heard that they can run L3s pretty well, and can solo harder combat sites/escalations well too.

2) Start training into a Drake (with decent backup skills): Drakes appear to be the most solid and "safe" choice for L3s.

3) Start training as quickly as possible into a Raven (with meh backup skills): A friend of mine said that a low-skill Raven can run L3 missions, and as your skills get higher, you can jump to L4s without having to buy a new hull/fit (except upgrades to better modules).

4) Any other ship/skillplan


Would really appreciate it if someone can tell me the best route to train for. Thanks! Big smile
Ploing
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
#2 - 2017-04-04 13:14:18 UTC
4.

i would take a look at the tengu. over 1000 dps and a brick tank. then she is so flexible with the subsystems.
Nyx Nirvana
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#3 - 2017-04-04 13:23:59 UTC
Ploing wrote:
4.

i would take a look at the tengu. over 1000 dps and a brick tank. then she is so flexible with the subsystems.


The Tengu is a great ship I would like aim for eventually. It's just something I can't speed-train into from an alpha state
Zarek Kree
Lunatic Legion Holdings
#4 - 2017-04-04 13:25:19 UTC
A Jackdaw, Drake or Raven are all viable options with different advantages/disadvantages. The Drake and Raven are pretty versatile PvE ships and you can't go wrong with either. The Jackdaw is far less versatile for PvE but comes with the advantage of being a good PvP ship if you're ever so inclined. If it were me, I'd get the Drake and then move up to a Raven later.

I'll throw one more option out as well. If you want to delay going Omega a bit longer, you can run L3s in a Gnosis (a BC without skill requirements, so an alpha can fly it).
Nyx Nirvana
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#5 - 2017-04-04 13:34:32 UTC
Zarek Kree wrote:
A Jackdaw, Drake or Raven are all viable options with different advantages/disadvantages. The Drake and Raven are pretty versatile PvE ships and you can't go wrong with either. The Jackdaw is far less versatile for PvE but comes with the advantage of being a good PvP ship if you're ever so inclined. If it were me, I'd get the Drake and then move up to a Raven later.

I'll throw one more option out as well. If you want to delay going Omega a bit longer, you can run L3s in a Gnosis (a BC without skill requirements, so an alpha can fly it).


Gnosis is a nice idea, but it's pretty pricey at the moment. I might give it a try.

Do you know if a Raven can actually run L3s successfully, or otherwise?

Thanks for the help :)
Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
#6 - 2017-04-04 13:50:31 UTC
Nyx Nirvana wrote:

4) Any other ship/skillplan

I’m currently testing a Gila in L4 missions on a low SP alt and so far the results are great.

For the Gila you need to have Caldari and Gallente cruiser skills (I trained both to L5), missile skills, drone skills and support skills (powergrid, cpu, tank, etc.). Gallente cruiser is worth it and you need the other skills anyway.

Using an omni buffer tank, an AB, Rapid Lights with faction missiles and mission specific T2 medium drones, I come close to 90k EHP before overheat and 700dps while being cap stable and with most skills at 4 and only a few skills at 5. So far the tank is more than sufficient and the ship is actually fun to fly, even in missions.
Ploing
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
#7 - 2017-04-04 13:51:38 UTC
a raven can handle L3 easily. its not the fastest option but you dont look at that at the moment.
Zarek Kree
Lunatic Legion Holdings
#8 - 2017-04-04 14:00:41 UTC
Absolutely no reason a Raven can't do L3s - it's just not as optimal as something smaller like a Drake. Plus, I think the isk savings of having just one ship for L3s and L4s is a bit illusory. A Raven is much slower than a Drake and won't apply damage to the smaller ships in an L3 as well, thus reducing your isk/hr. You can also sell the Drake when you're done with L3s and apply that to an L4 missioning ship, so you lose very little. It also reduces your out of pocket expenses now.

That said, I don't want to talk you out of a Raven if that's what you want. It's a perfectly viable option.
Nyx Nirvana
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#9 - 2017-04-04 14:44:19 UTC
Myriad Blaze wrote:
Nyx Nirvana wrote:

4) Any other ship/skillplan

I’m currently testing a Gila in L4 missions on a low SP alt and so far the results are great.

For the Gila you need to have Caldari and Gallente cruiser skills (I trained both to L5), missile skills, drone skills and support skills (powergrid, cpu, tank, etc.). Gallente cruiser is worth it and you need the other skills anyway.

Using an omni buffer tank, an AB, Rapid Lights with faction missiles and mission specific T2 medium drones, I come close to 90k EHP before overheat and 700dps while being cap stable and with most skills at 4 and only a few skills at 5. So far the tank is more than sufficient and the ship is actually fun to fly, even in missions.


That's something I didn't consider. I love the Gila as a ship (any Guristas ships to be honest), but I wasn't sure if I could train up to a high enough Gallente cruiser level quickly to use it properly.

I'll definitely take a look. Thanks!
Nyx Nirvana
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2017-04-04 14:49:24 UTC
Zarek Kree wrote:
Absolutely no reason a Raven can't do L3s - it's just not as optimal as something smaller like a Drake. Plus, I think the isk savings of having just one ship for L3s and L4s is a bit illusory. A Raven is much slower than a Drake and won't apply damage to the smaller ships in an L3 as well, thus reducing your isk/hr. You can also sell the Drake when you're done with L3s and apply that to an L4 missioning ship, so you lose very little. It also reduces your out of pocket expenses now.

That said, I don't want to talk you out of a Raven if that's what you want. It's a perfectly viable option.

That's a good point. I may head down the Drake route then, and move to a Raven shortly after once my skills are better.

Thanks for your help!
Zanar Skwigelf
HIgh Sec Care Bears
Brothers of Tangra
#11 - 2017-04-04 17:05:08 UTC
Nyx Nirvana wrote:

That's something I didn't consider. I love the Gila as a ship (any Guristas ships to be honest), but I wasn't sure if I could train up to a high enough Gallente cruiser level quickly to use it properly.

I'll definitely take a look. Thanks!


Keep in mind that the rule of thumb with skilling in EVE is:

1) if you want to use a skill get it to 3
2) if you use a skill regularly get it to 4
3) if you can't think of something better to train get it to 5.

there are exceptions to (3), but your posting in this thread implies that you will wait until you have lvl 5 skills before you start doing something in EVE. This is a fantastic way to get bored and leave the game.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2017-04-05 00:22:01 UTC  |  Edited by: DeMichael Crimson
The basic rule for ship class verses mission levels :

Level 1 = Frigate, Destroyer
Level 2 = Cruiser
Level 3 = Battlecruiser
Level 4 = Battleship
Level 5 = Carrier, Fleet with logistics

Personally I like T3 Cruisers, they are very versatile and can fit a better defense than most other ships in their class and higher. They can put out enough DPS to take down most NPC's quickly and easily. Some NPC's may take a little bit of time but due to T3's defensive stats, they can stay engaged and wear down the defense of tough NPC's.

T3 Cruisers can be refit for numerous careers, everything from cloaky scout to exploration. The only drawback is they can't enter DED 3/10 and 4/10 exploration sites. The main problem with using T3 Cruiser in PvP is when it gets destroyed, you lose one level of a trained sub-system skill. However the saving grace of T3 Cruisers is the sub-system skills don't take very long to train up.


DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#13 - 2017-04-05 21:17:43 UTC
Raven is a fine lv3 ship, just requires some creative fitting. I will admit I haven't flown it in lv3s so there is plenty of room to play around with fittings.

lows, bcus are a pretty obvious choice, 3-4 are pretty standard, and I picked a nano for the extra speed and agility, could perhaps go 3 bcu 2 nano for a bit more speed

mids: some tank but don't need too much, overwhelming dps and bs ehp should be enough to tank almost all lv3s. cap booster to fuel the booster or mwd, MWD for the speed, sensor boosters are needed to speed up lock time, as BS have pretty bad scan res, and I wasn't sure what else to throw on so I added a missile guidance computer.

highs: rapid heavy launchers are great for dps on small stuff, sitting through the reload kinda sucks but even with the reload it will do more damage than a drake. Although with lv3s you usually don't have to destroy too much and can just blap the objective and complete the mission.

ammo choice, since it has been a while since I used heavies in lv3s I can't say exactly but play around with faction/t2 ammo. Fury is a nice damage boost, but faction should apply well and have more range.

drones: I like lights for the most part, the two sentry drones are nice to have as they are good at finishing things off or adding a bit more damage on your current target. but by no means are the sentries needed, another 2 flights of lights are what I often carry in ships with 75m3 drone bays.

[Raven, warp speed]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Pith C-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
500MN Microwarpdrive II
Missile Guidance Computer II, Missile Range Script
Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script
Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script

Rapid Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Rapid Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Rapid Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Rapid Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Rapid Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Rapid Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Small Tractor Beam II

Large Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Large Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Large Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I

Hobgoblin II x5
Garde II x2

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Alasdan Helminthauge
AirHogs
Hogs Collective
#14 - 2017-04-06 02:05:46 UTC
If the op really want to use the same ship for lv3s and lv4s, try a tengu or a gila. The bs are slow and always overtanked for the lv3s.
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#15 - 2017-04-06 04:06:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Eli Apol
Don't some L3s have a 'no battleship' gate restriction?

Id say go drake or a cruiser anyways, better application on the more numerous small targets

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager
Alicia Dnari
Dnari Mining and Manufacturing
#16 - 2017-04-07 19:13:25 UTC
Are you looking at what you can do once you've gone Omega, or at what you can do now as an Alpha? If the latter, I think you're looking at level 3 missions at best, and at, as someone upthread suggested, a Gnosis, which is the only BC you can fly. Another possibilty is a Navy cruiser (whichever one(s) are available to your race). Once you start doing that, you might look at what you need to train for ships not currently available to you. Most of the "mastery" skills for any subcapital (except large weapons) you should already have, but there may be some holes to fill in. Once you go Omega, of course, you can train whatever you need. Racial BC if you're still doing L3s, or Racial BS if you want to go to fours. Alternatives for 4s: T3 cruiser, HAC, Marauders. You can cross-train other racial ships, which will also give you faction ships, but that can take a while, particularly if you're not interested in actually flying the lower level ships, but just want to get to lvl 4s ASAP. As to which is "best", that's really a matter of personal preference. I've never had any problem sticking to the T1 progression Michael DeCrimson mentions above.
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#17 - 2017-04-07 20:31:07 UTC
Eli Apol wrote:
Id say go drake or a cruiser anyways, better application on the more numerous small targets

looks at rhml, looks at drake/crusier hulls uhh what?

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#18 - 2017-04-08 02:16:21 UTC
I believe RLMLs on a gila do indeed have better application than RHMLs on a battleship... your point?

Also you didnt deal with the gate restriction issue...

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager
Zarek Kree
Lunatic Legion Holdings
#19 - 2017-04-08 16:17:52 UTC
Eli Apol wrote:
Also you didnt deal with the gate restriction issue...



Not an issue. L3 gates allow everything up to T2 battleships.
Alasdan Helminthauge
AirHogs
Hogs Collective
#20 - 2017-04-08 16:54:22 UTC
Zarek Kree wrote:
Eli Apol wrote:
Also you didnt deal with the gate restriction issue...



Not an issue. L3 gates allow everything up to T2 battleships.


confirmed, today I used a machariel to do a bunch of lv3 missions. All mission pockets allowed me in.
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