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How many more players must we lose to bullying

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Jacques d'Orleans
#441 - 2017-04-01 00:08:20 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
The retardation is strong in this thread.


That coming from you. Oh the irony.

Breakfast is the most important drink of the day.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#442 - 2017-04-01 01:12:20 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
The retardation is strong in this thread. There are 8000 systems to PvP in. That includes high with wardecs. EvE is big enough for multiple play styles. The game needs carebear space and that is high, that's how it was designed. That's what CCP needs to rethink. You won't have PvP anywhere if EvE continues to slide in sub's.


The game was designed to do anything anywhere, regardless of 'sec'. Highsec is not 'carebear space' and as much is evident in the number of carebears that get around in low and nul and wh. If you haven't seen them there, it only means you haven't been there. Risk aversion isn't exclusive to high sec because at the end of the day, high sec ISN'T SAFE and was never meant to be, and people who aren't stupid know that. If there's any 'retardation' in this thread, it's coming from people in denial of these facts, such as yourself.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Dom Arkaral
Bannheim
Cuttlefish Collective
#443 - 2017-04-01 02:08:46 UTC
Apparently I'm going to put this wherever carebears cry :D

Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester.

Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER

Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome

CCL Loyalist
Chopper Rollins
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#444 - 2017-04-01 03:04:10 UTC
Hisec is beginner space, for mining, mission running, pvp, exploration, everything.
All the mining i've done since 2011 has been in nullsec because everywhere else it isn't worth it.


Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.
Aaron
Eternal Frontier
#445 - 2017-04-01 03:53:28 UTC
DRDNOUGHT wrote:
A New Beginning

So, you like playing Eve-Online ?

Is it because you like to shoot stuff, getting the kill is fun yes ?

Does that include shooting guys who don't want to PVP ?

Care Bears or industrialists who play the game for the mining and building stuff or trading ?

They have the right to play eve too don't they ?

Who said they had to be PVP'ers to Play Eve-Online ?

All games, just like real life have risks, the ganker can sneak up on you at any moment, social misfits or someone enjoying their freedom to act in a way they could never get away with in real life. That's the fun behind immersing one self in the virtual world so as to get away with the actions and activities we could never experience in real life.

Now think about this, If you where to go onto Face Book or Twitter, choose an individual or individuals and continuously harass them, troll the life out of them and generally make their lives a misery to the point they couldn't continue to use those social media sites....

Would you be allowed to get away with it ?

Wait, the ganker rarely bothers the same guys more than once, a couple of times in rare circumstances. Surely this doesn't relate to them.....that may be correct.

War deccers, now that's a different matter.

Many war deccers will declare war on corps who have no experience or no interest in pvp. Corps with new players with low skills and no experience. Forcing them to take the only option available to them and that is to stop playing till the war dec is finished.
What then ? A new war dec, same guys or different ones, maybe two together.

How does our player deal with this one....that's right.....he stops playing again till the war dec is over.

Are you now seeing a pattern.....how long is this guy going to put up with this....Alpha or Omega no difference.....if he can't enjoy his game he is going to quit. FACT !

And they do Quit, I know, I've been playing now for 12 years and the numbers of guys I've Known who have stopped playing for that reason alone is phenomenal.

Even Players that join with PVP as their career path are not going to be skilled enough for several months to be able to defend themselves in a war situation. No amount of enthusiasm is going to overcome the boredom of being station bound or being unable to play due to a wardec that could potentially last for weeks.

Me? doesn't bother me, I have 4 accounts, always one of them in a situation where there is no war, so not a problem for me to play.



Over to you CCP

Time to start backing "all" your players instead of just the ones with the biggest voices.







Op, I will read your post in great detail I just had to respond to a couple of points you made real quick.

The solution to your problem is to simply not be in a corp until you are in a position to defend yourself or be in a corp where you an integral part of a defence fleet who understands pvp.

Perhaps you could learn the art of fighting just so you understand what these folk are trying to do to you.

Another solution is to stay as NPC. this solution is looking you right in the face and honestly I am not sure why people are so eagar to be in a corp. I get that you have a level of control and you can administrate others, the fact is once you create a corp immediately there is a massive cross hair on it.

I am in the process of creating a venture where we stay in npc corps and work together as best we can. here is the link too the thread. NPC HI-Sec Community

Try to see Eve Online as a carrot being dangled in front of us and we are the donkey. This carrot is being dangled in front of pvp'ers as well. From a real life perspective CCP makes their money by configuring the game to promote PVP, some have chosen not to fight which is what feeds the economy because you will be attacked and have to replace your ship.

I'm happy to talk with you further if you spend some time with us when the venture goes live. I think we can help make the game more fun for you if you would like to give it a go.

Fear no one, live life, be free, accept the truth, do not judge others, defend yourself, fight hard till the end, meditate on problems and be prosperous. Things to exist by. -- RAIN Arthie
Aaron
Eternal Frontier
#446 - 2017-04-01 04:16:20 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Mr Mieyli wrote:


Some of the posts here show just how serious people like Jenn aSide take this game. That's your own personal problem, its just a game miner chill.


And yet you keep talking about it. "It's not important to me but I'm going to keep talking about it" is an example of a person lying to themselves. That's your personal problem.


Quote:

Many people surprisingly find laid back games fun


I'm sure they do. I enjoy a nice game of solitaire from time to time lol. What I don't do is complain to the makers of solitare that their game would be so much better if they modified it's basic core identity to be a multiplayer game with unicorns that crap diamonds lol.

This is basically what you do. You've come to a game that at it's core is ANTI-laid back and advocated a total change for your personal enjoyment, and then (in standard dishonest fashion) pretended that this personal desire is somehow "for the good of the game and new players".

I've been watching people do that on this forum for 10 years and I find it irritating. It's not devastating because it's only a forum and you have no power that would actually matter (CCPs disastrous path of safing up and dumbing down the game for the last 5 years didn't come from forum feed back, but more likely from a combination of stakeholder desire for more profit and internal misguided beliefs about what sells in the current mmo market).



Quote:

, and that is exactly the reason any war dec groups operate in hs, concord protection, easy targets, etc. I'm going to stand by my belief that people don't enjoy being slapped in the face, but feel free to continue trying to convince me. You'll need to show that eve is open to changes because nothing is perfect as is.


If you think I'm trying to convince you, then your thought process is more damaged than I imagined. I don't really care what you believe, and while my demonstrating to you why what you believe is wrong might (one day) help you, that's not the reason either.

I'm simply a member of this community that wants the record to be straight about what's happening with this game. It's a shame to see one of the only real adult games suffer from the do-gooder "save the children" attitudes modern people have. It's a shame to see people WANT CCP to continue to move this unique game into the kind of same mushy bullshit most other games are/have become.

EVE Online is one of the last video game refuges for people of my gaming generation, gamers that don't need or appreciate hand holding or being told we're "special" and thus deserving of 'protection' from harsh reality. And it's slowy being eroded into cheerful protectionist bullshit. Which again isn't the end of the world because it's just a video game, but still a damn shame.




HAHA!! I think you being harsh there Jenn, Eve is still Eve and I love it. The thrill of victory and the agony of defeat is still there it's the same as it was in 2003.

Everyone has their very own unique perspective. Some may like multiplayer space games but only have 30 minutes every few days to play....their requirement is going to be different from mine because i have more hours to play. CCP have to listen to the general consensus of their customers and produce something that is inline with their goals as well as customer satisfaction.

Speaking honestly if I were to rate this game I'd have to give it a consistent 100%, whatever CCP do will always be cool with me i suppose, I simply respect the fact this game is here and I am part of it.

Fear no one, live life, be free, accept the truth, do not judge others, defend yourself, fight hard till the end, meditate on problems and be prosperous. Things to exist by. -- RAIN Arthie
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#447 - 2017-04-01 07:08:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Herzog Wolfhammer
Dracvlad wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
...I don't use freighters so it is not an issue for me...


You guys heard it here first, folks! Freighter ganking is not an issue for Drac, despite the fact that he cries about it at great length, at every opportunity, to anyone who will listen.

Other things that don't bother Dracvlad in the slightest:

Wreck HP buffs




Wreck EHP buffs, only due to the fact that it completely destroyed emergent gameplay, which I seem to recall that players like you moan about all the time in terms of any nerf to ganking. Which is why I call you hypocrites...

As for the freighter comment, it no longer personally affects me as I have given up on a T1 freighter completely, just as I gave up on mining ships when all of them had the tank of a wet paper bag. Simple fact is that people who play this game need to walk away from ships or activities that give easy rich kills to tear and kill farmers. But thankfully for you there are enough stupid useless players to farm ad nauseum, or is there...? TwistedEvil

o7 Mr Pig

EDIT: Back to the emergent gameplay, my biggest regret during the brief time that AG was able to operate on an equal footing to the gankers was that I did not record Loyal ranting like a complete madman after Herzog's wreck ganker had blown up an especially rich wreck, I have started to laugh at the memory of it, even better still is that you have no idea who my spy account is. I often think that his deranged attack on a tragic event that cost him was due to the build up of rage from that short period of defeat. For me it was a grand period of emergent gameplay. o7... Do you want to keep mentioning it?




Good times my friend good times. Loyal's salt was glowing gold and could heal all wounds and raise the dead. It was Jesus Salt.

Crying about EHP buffs... no crying. It was just a proof point. Taking forever to get "nerfs to ganking" in the form of defense enhancements, and the long awaited fix to permabumping has not come. But once the gankers started crying about wrecks getting shot it changed in very short time. This is proof enough that the game caters to the gankers and why nobody else should bother starting it.

Meanwhile, your comments about highsec make me imagine if new players started out in nullsec. Boy would that be a thing. But with the same "no killing noobs" rule. Because we already know exactly what quality of human being plays Eve and exactly how much time they have to sit outsite a nullsec noob station and kill everything that comes out (while calling it "PVP").

Gevlon was right about highsec though. It is fun watching "them" feed off each other.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#448 - 2017-04-01 07:13:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Herzog Wolfhammer
Galaxy Pig wrote:
So you're giving up at this too. Huge surprise.

Just concede that AG is fail and try to distance yourself from them, good strategy bro.



Actually the reason why we "gave up" and did not adapt is that once it was demonstrated that CCP coddles you guys, the feeling was "why bother?".

Besides, that CCP had to change your diapers was victory enough. Your success became meaningless at that point, so there was no further point in playing with you and trying to stop you.

Until Brad Neece started bumping your targets and you had to resort to bombers....

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#449 - 2017-04-01 07:57:50 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
So you're giving up at this too. Huge surprise.

Just concede that AG is fail and try to distance yourself from them, good strategy bro.



Actually the reason why we "gave up" and did not adapt is that once it was demonstrated that CCP coddles you guys, the feeling was "why bother?".

Besides, that CCP had to change your diapers was victory enough. Your success became meaningless at that point, so there was no further point in playing with you and trying to stop you.

Until Brad Neece started bumping your targets and you had to resort to bombers....


You gave up because you had to move from a single insta locking thrashers to needing to use a pair of tornados
Not even a month later CCP gifted freighters a buff 10x stronger but gankers adapted.

That says it all about you bears.
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
#450 - 2017-04-01 08:01:19 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
The game needs carebear space and that is high, that's how it was designed.

I care to disagree with your opinion.

What we do need though, did need all the time actually, is a better and more adequate advertising of the game and it's nature by CCP. They are mostly failing at this.

Remove standings and insurance.
Mr Mieyli
Doomheim
#451 - 2017-04-01 08:10:06 UTC
Overspecialize, and you breed in weakness. It's slow death.

This post brought to you by CCP's alpha forum alt initiative. Playing the eve forums has never come cheaper.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#452 - 2017-04-01 08:16:57 UTC
Mr Mieyli wrote:
Overspecialize, and you breed in weakness. It's slow death.


Stats don't back that statement up.

EVE saw nothing but growth until 2013. What happened in 2013? CCP decided to nerf the difficulty and increased safety by nerfing pvp.
Mr Mieyli
Doomheim
#453 - 2017-04-01 08:18:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Mieyli
baltec1 wrote:
Mr Mieyli wrote:
Overspecialize, and you breed in weakness. It's slow death.


Stats don't back that statement up.

EVE saw nothing but growth until 2013. What happened in 2013? CCP decided to nerf the difficulty and increased safety by nerfing pvp.


You know I'll be right eventually Blink

Soon TM

(this is a joke post)

This post brought to you by CCP's alpha forum alt initiative. Playing the eve forums has never come cheaper.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#454 - 2017-04-01 08:25:28 UTC
Mr Mieyli wrote:
Overspecialize, and you breed in weakness. It's slow death.


Tell that to Ferrari, Lamborghini, Maserati, ASUS, Intel, Rockwell Industries, GEC-Marconi, Martin-Baker, Lockheed Martin, Boeing, and a few thousand other companies that 'over-specialise' and do incredible business exactly because they specialise. Hell, some of these companies make all their money off a single product. Martin-Baker make ejection seats and virtually nothing else. Don't sit there and pretend like niche markets don't do extraordinarily well, because that does little more than demonstrate your own ignorance.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#455 - 2017-04-01 08:36:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Dracvlad
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
So you're giving up at this too. Huge surprise.

Just concede that AG is fail and try to distance yourself from them, good strategy bro.



Actually the reason why we "gave up" and did not adapt is that once it was demonstrated that CCP coddles you guys, the feeling was "why bother?".

Besides, that CCP had to change your diapers was victory enough. Your success became meaningless at that point, so there was no further point in playing with you and trying to stop you.

Until Brad Neece started bumping your targets and you had to resort to bombers....

Well said Herzog, that was totally what I felt. It became meaningless as a war because CCP have made it too easy for them and were protecting them, that is why I thought nope, no reason to continue.

Also I love their comments about AG failing, because why do gankers use bombers, that was due to the wonderful Brad Neece who you mention who is still there doing his stuff, but his freighter bumping omen knocking the freighter out of Catalyst optimal cost those gankers a lot, so Mr Pig they fail do they? Shocked In a game where people were actually fair about their oppoenents the gankers would acknowledge that, and this is again showing the weakness of the gankers and their having to over do the meta on the forums.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#456 - 2017-04-01 08:47:10 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
So you're giving up at this too. Huge surprise.

Just concede that AG is fail and try to distance yourself from them, good strategy bro.



Actually the reason why we "gave up" and did not adapt is that once it was demonstrated that CCP coddles you guys, the feeling was "why bother?".

Besides, that CCP had to change your diapers was victory enough. Your success became meaningless at that point, so there was no further point in playing with you and trying to stop you.

Until Brad Neece started bumping your targets and you had to resort to bombers....


You gave up because you had to move from a single insta locking thrashers to needing to use a pair of tornados
Not even a month later CCP gifted freighters a buff 10x stronger but gankers adapted.

That says it all about you bears.




We were using rifters.

The 10X freighter buff was to cover their ass after realizing they handed a win to the gankers. But that cat's already out of the bag and the perception of favoritism already did damage proving that new players are food. We're still waiting for that fix to bumping.

Once you make the impression that one side is played favorite, there's no more game. But we see that CCP wants only gank versus gank and yes some AG are adapting.

Me I haven't played in months. My PC overheats. I'm up late working on it now in fact. But spring is here. I'll just stick around and remind players of the past in the meantime.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#457 - 2017-04-01 08:56:47 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
So you're giving up at this too. Huge surprise.

Just concede that AG is fail and try to distance yourself from them, good strategy bro.



Actually the reason why we "gave up" and did not adapt is that once it was demonstrated that CCP coddles you guys, the feeling was "why bother?".

Besides, that CCP had to change your diapers was victory enough. Your success became meaningless at that point, so there was no further point in playing with you and trying to stop you.

Until Brad Neece started bumping your targets and you had to resort to bombers....


You gave up because you had to move from a single insta locking thrashers to needing to use a pair of tornados
Not even a month later CCP gifted freighters a buff 10x stronger but gankers adapted.

That says it all about you bears.




We were using rifters.

The 10X freighter buff was to cover their ass after realizing they handed a win to the gankers. But that cat's already out of the bag and the perception of favoritism already did damage proving that new players are food. We're still waiting for that fix to bumping.

Once you make the impression that one side is played favorite, there's no more game. But we see that CCP wants only gank versus gank and yes some AG are adapting.

Me I haven't played in months. My PC overheats. I'm up late working on it now in fact. But spring is here. I'll just stick around and remind players of the past in the meantime.



CCP have been playing favourites but sure as **** isn't with gankers. Ganking is by a long way the single most nerfed activity in EVE. You had one nerf and even that wasn't aimed at you.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#458 - 2017-04-01 09:51:26 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
So you're giving up at this too. Huge surprise.

Just concede that AG is fail and try to distance yourself from them, good strategy bro.



Actually the reason why we "gave up" and did not adapt is that once it was demonstrated that CCP coddles you guys, the feeling was "why bother?".

Besides, that CCP had to change your diapers was victory enough. Your success became meaningless at that point, so there was no further point in playing with you and trying to stop you.

Until Brad Neece started bumping your targets and you had to resort to bombers....


You gave up because you had to move from a single insta locking thrashers to needing to use a pair of tornados
Not even a month later CCP gifted freighters a buff 10x stronger but gankers adapted.

That says it all about you be.




We were using rifters.

The 10X freighter buff was to cover their ass after realizing they handed a win to the gankers. But that cat's already out of the bag and the perception of favoritism already did damage proving that new players are food. We're still waiting for that fix to bumping.

Once you make the impression that one side is played favorite, there's no more game. But we see that CCP wants only gank versus gank and yes some AG are adapting.

Me I haven't played in months. My PC overheats. I'm up late working on it now in fact. But spring is here. I'll just stick around and remind players of the past in the meantime.



CCP have been playing favourites but sure as **** isn't with gankers. Ganking is by a long way the single most nerfed activity in EVE. You had one nerf and even that wasn't aimed at you.

Yeah right. Zombie was banned from game permanatly for exploiting grids to do what gankers now do legally every day in EvE today. Ganking has been buffed to hell. The sec buff alone saves you around 2 weeks of grinding NPCs in null per gank session. The reason ganking is so common is because its now so easy. When freighters first came out you needed 30 high skilled BS pilots woth 30 plat insured battleships. Now one can be ganked by a single player multiboxing 12ish bombers and sec loss is negligible

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Sasha Nemtsov
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#459 - 2017-04-01 10:59:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Sasha Nemtsov
Infinity Ziona wrote:
The sec buff alone saves you around 2 weeks of grinding NPCs in null per gank session.

Just a small point, Infinity Ziona. The majority of New Order gankers sport a sec status of well below 0. This status is maintained, and not repaired.

The reason is that we have gank alts/mains, specifically used for the purpose. Our other alts/mains (with higher sec status) do the work which requires them to maintain those higher levels.

The only gankers you're likely to find using tags to improve their status are those with perhaps a single account, or other constraints. I don't know of any, but you may have encountered one or two in your fact-gathering tours of Atlantis...

Lowsec inhabitants also benefited from that new feature, as did anyone in New Eden needing a quick solution to an urgent problem.

minerbumping

New Order Audio Archive

NEW! MinerBumping Video Vault
Olmeca Gold
The Free Folk
#460 - 2017-04-01 14:04:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Olmeca Gold
Let me break a fact to PvE'rs that want safe spaces in this thread:

For an MMO in 2017, PvE in Eve is extremely boring, dull and repetitive. It is not like doing dungeons in games like WoW which can be fun because there is an interesting variety, constant adding of new content, and the available room showcase player skill. Eve PvE is all about fitting the right ship and doing a few things over and over again. If all Eve had to offer was this PvE experience, then CCP was bankrupt years ago. Furthermore, it would take a non-feasible amount of resources for CCP to make EvE PvE be able to compete with other games.

Luckily, Eve is also perhaps the best space politics/economics simulator with emergent gameplay and player driven stories. And this all derives from Eve being a PvP game, be it the market PvP, the political powerplay, or a simple gank. This is the reason majority of the people plays this game, and it is the reason why it survived and thrived all this years.

So, what Eve does, and should keep doing, is using PvE a tool to foster PvP. It does it either by accumulation of wealth to fund PvP activities, or by creating gank situations or even fleet fights over expensive PvE capitals. All of these are content that we keep playing this game for.

In WoW PvE and PvP are almost different games, as items that benefit PvE will benefit less to PvP and vice versa. But Eve is not WoW, and separating these aspects by making Eve PvE safer would deal a great blow to how fun Eve is.

Eve has always been a risk/reward game. The more risk you take in PvE the more reward you get. And the risk factor here is often supposed to be the PvP that might occur. If you really want safe systems that you can't get hit you should also earn much less ISK than everyone else, or the risk/reward balance is broken. And I am pretty positive you wouldn't be happy if CCP gave you safe systems to PvE in, but your income was no more than 10m/hr. But completely safe PvE in Eve is not entitled to more than that really.

Eve has problems implementing this core risk/reward idea, but still it is the goal that Eve should aspire to. And your suggestions are entirely opposite of that.

Really, for every 5 person who leaves Eve because there is no completely safe PvE, or how PvE reward is balanced with the risk you take, I bet 500 other person keeps playing for the same reason.

Covert Cloaky FC. Sustainable Whaler.

Youtube channel.