EVE General Discussion

Some time ago, to not honour a ransom was considered to be really bad form.

Unfortunately, especially for the honourable pirate profession, this is no longer the case.

To pay a ransom in the majority of cases nowadays, means the loss of the isk and the loss of your ship.

Just because 'pirates' do not have to honour a ransom demand does not mean that they shouldn't.

I don't often offer ransoms, it actually depends on the circumstances of the engagement for me.
When I do, I tend to either go for something moderate, like 50-70% of the hull value of the ship in question.
I'm also more likely to do this for younger players, older players tend to get more outlandish terms.

Regardless of case, if the ransom is offered and then accepted, it is honored.

When I engage in space shenanigans I'm flying the flag of both my corp and my alliance. Considering that my particular brand of no-goodery is more of a hobby than our business, I can't let my play detriment the reputation of the people I fly with.
If I say I'll let you go if you pay me X then I'll let you go if you comply. (It helps pay for my ammo, cap charges and nanite paste)

I'm not trying paint myself as the model of virtue here, btw. More often than not I'll just poke holes in a boat til the candy falls out.

At least one lowsec corp, The Bastards, used to sell similar services to people operating in their space; they honoured their ransoms too.

oi. sometimes that candy is top notch stuff.
don't begrudge a man for doing violence for profit.
I got a tasty 300 mil isk module off a guy who chose poorly just a couple weeks ago.
Paid for the outfitting of my Navygeddon.
Sometimes you just know, especially after being all so intimate with a customer for a few minutes, where the money is at. If it's in their wallet instead of on their ship then it's in your best interest to hit the wallet.
My point was mainly that if your'e going to actually offer to set them free for a price then you most likely should, as what happens next can affect both your own reputation and that of those whom you associate with.

Honoring bounties has less to do with honor per se, but with business. Typically you make more money off a ransom than a kill, and you will want to be known as a guy who honors ransom, otherwise nobody will pay. Unfortunately, these days this does almost never work anymore. People go in expecting ransoms to not be honored, and no matter how well-known you may be, most of the juicier targets you manage to catch are not even aware of their immediate surroundings, much less so of the pirates roaming the region, so they wouldn't know whether a certain individual, corp or alliance honors ransoms or not.

Yes, so we return to the frustration that inspired the post that began this thread. The consensus seems to be that nothing is ever going to change because the players do not want it to change. I hope that this game we all enjoy will not suffer as a result.

First of all, I have no idea what "FFS" means. Maybe it's a generational thing--I suspect that I'm much older than most people here. But I don't speak d00d. Sorry.

Second, if you are implying that I want to "nerf other people's game," please go back and read what I have written, assuming that you actually care about understanding the issues being discussed here. I don't care about "nerfing" anyone's game. If you are implying that the person who began this thread wants to "nerf other people's game," then quote him/her directly.

I play the way I want to play and you and everyone else can play the way you want to play. I could not possibly care less how you play. If you are in 0.0 space I am never going to meet you, so have fun doing whatever you want to do. I mean that sincerely. This is a great game and we should all enjoy it.

I suggested a possible answer for those who want to encourage more hi-sec types to venture into 0.0. The consensus seems to be that such a player-agreed change in how piracy/gate camping is conducted is not practical.

Fair enough.

I'm getting tired of repeating myself to people who don't bother to read what I wrote earlier, so this is my last post in this thread.

Happy flying, everyone!

Heh, not sure you are older than me...but maybe, I'm closing in on 49.

But yes, Jonah has it right. Consider it an expression of exasperation.

My point is that the OP was just being obstinate and foolish. He kept running into the same obstacle and didn't sit down and figure out if there is a way around that obstacle. In this case there literally is. To gain access to the LS pocket of which Tama in one entry point there are at least 2 others that are much, much less heavily camped.

BTW, here is the dotlan map, not Tama is highlighted.

http://evemaps.dotlan.net/map/The_Citadel/Tama#kills24

Here is another entrance to that pocket.

http://evemaps.dotlan.net/map/The_Citadel/Hysera#kills24

Here is another entrance,

http://evemaps.dotlan.net/map/The_Citadel/Tannolen#kills24

And yet another,

http://evemaps.dotlan.net/map/The_Citadel/Nagamanen#kills24

So literally 3 routes into that pocket. And there are numerous other pockets of LS to explore many of which are far less violent. Did the OP even come here and ask about Dotlan?

No, much better to come here and rage like a petulant baby then stomp off and go play some other ****** game. Literally...screw him. Sorry if that is harsh.

Yet instead of coming here and asking advice, looking at the in game map, looking at dotlan the OP comes here and posts in a butthurt and rage quitting manner. TBQH he is probably gone an no longer following this thread. But if that is the case good riddance. I don't say that to be an *******, but because I love EVE...as it is and even more as it was. People coming here and saying, "Too hard!!!" "Too much PvP!!!" "Gankers suck!!!!" Leads CCP, in desperation IMO, to keep dumbing down and nerfing the styles of play that lead to growth in the game. Maybe I'm wrong, but successive nerfs to HS PvP seem to coincide with declining PCU.

And here is the Grand Mother Phoking* Irony of this. If the OP had come here and said, "What am i doing wrong, please help." He'd likely have gotten good advice. Yeah, some forum boobs might post nonsense or troll him, but sifting through that nonsense he'd have found people pointing out a number of things to do....like don't go through Tama it is one of the most violent LS systems in game, and maybe one of the most violent systems overall. You can get into NS and LS, just don't be stupid about it. Don't go through HED-GP to get into Catch and don't go through Tama.

Again and again I see these claims of "The consensus seems to be that such a player-agreed change in how piracy/gate camping is conducted is not practical." But where is this consensus? That people come here and whine? Sure if a player is bad and loses multiple ships do you think he might be more prone to show up here and whine than if he were successful or to pick an alternate route? In short you consensus is likely bullshit just like newspapers are likely bullshit. They pick stories that will sell add revenues not stories to inform you or make you more well rounded.

I'm sorry you feel I'm too harsh, but your going off of biased data. Did you know CCP looked at ganks for new players and found, surprisingly, that new players who were ganked stayed with the game longer than those who were killed legally and those not killed at all? No? Gee.**

*Phoking is a Vietnamese restaurant in Orange County CA. You can even buy t-shirts with phrases like "How may I phoking help you?" And Pho is pronounced more like 'fuh'.

**Watch the statistical know-nothings will show up to poo-poo that study based on lies and half-truths.

The reason you get pushback is because it's an obvious case of "correlation is not causation".

Imagine you asked all current "old-timers":

• Have you ever been ganked?
• Were you ever ganked as a rookie?

What answers would you get? What conclusion could you draw from the answers? None - in a game like EVE those answers carry no information at all.

A supporting issue: it would be nearly impossible to get answers from everyone who stopped playing EVE. It would be difficult enough to get good answers from any beginner.

How could "what's the main reason you stopped playing EVE?" be answered? I was ganked once? /lol.
People stop playing games because they get bored. And there is no simple answer to "why did you get bored?".


Here are some "secret" principles of gaming:

• New players like to get set up fast, and get access to the "real game" fast.
• They don't like to be bored while they're setting up
• They have a limited tolerance for other people wasting their time (boring non-consensual activities)
• They prefer to play with nice people
• They have a limited tolerance for grovelling to get access to essential aspects of the game (like becoming part of a good Corp)

So how does Gate Camping at the 0.5/0.4 interfaces fit in?

Perhaps you missed the part about it being new players. It is right there in what I wrote, "...new players...."



This is why you use random samples. Holy ****, did I say statistical know-nothings or what? Where I work we use random samples of 50,000 for close to 5 million customers. We use a sample that big so that we can break it down into smaller groups. If we wanted to get a good picture of the typical customer we could probably go down to just 5,000. So yeah...80,000 is probably pretty good.



They did not ask players that. You clearly are ignorant of the study. Let me help you...

CCP took a sample of 80,000 and broke them down into:

Those killed:

1. Illegaly--i.e. suicide ganked.
2. Killed legally--e.g. a war dec.
3. Those not killed at all.

Groups 1 and 2 stayed with the game the longest with 1 slightly beating out 2.

Next time go watch the presentation vs. speaking out of ignorance. There are valid criticism to be made of the presentation, but you have not made any.