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You guys keep going on about bots but tech moons allow an alliance to buy or build a titan every other day, that's mere hours!

Claiming bots ruin the game is a fig leaf you're all clinging to, ignoring the trillions (yes, we're talking trillions) technetium brings in for those who hold the moons.

That was a long read. Quite a bit of good but some odd points popped out.

Absolutely no to skill point respecs. This has been discussed to death in the weekly threads. Copypasting Tippia from a recent one:

Cons:

It removes the point of having skills to begin with.
It removes the point of having attributes.
It removes attribute implants from the game.
It removes variety and instead encourages FOTM and cookie-cutter setups.
It removes the uniqueness, history and "character" of your character.
It removes planning and choice and consequences.
It removes goal-setting, progression and any achievement in those areas.
It kills character trading.
It massively boosts older characters over new ones.
It introduces "catching up" as a concept in EVE and instantly makes it impossible to do.

The supercap situation I can understand (though not agree with as they still can use the other ships, sell their caps or maybe even dock them in the future) but for a CSM member to think that new features like PI should give you an opportunity to respec.... no. Just... no. The only time a skill should be refunded is when it's removed from the game completely. No exceptions.

Ship balancing: The frigates and cruisers really need the balancing, good job with that. The same with the tier 1 battlecruisers. Singling out the drake I don't really agree with. It's the only real choice for an affordable missile ship and it's very much comparable to the hurricane in performance. The proposed new boni would turn it into a missile sniper and we know how popular those are, as seen with the HML caracal and cerberus, or even cruise raven (which admittedly suffers from the poor usability of the large missiles). Of course there is a chance that it will turn out good but with all the winmatar and angel ships going on this seems rather out of the place. And when there's talk about nerfing the naga and ECM I wonder if there are going to be any caldari ships left for pvp.

Wormhole stabilizer: This seems like a bad idea. The wormholes are fun because you can't really blob them, making them ideal for small gangs. A wormhole can support only a limited number of people. If you can easily pour more attackers than the limit that can defend it, WHs become just another place where the large players can go shoot people for lulz. Please don't make them that way. Of course you can fortify a system with lots of caps but if you ever need to relocate it's going to be a pain, and even then it's not going to save you from a determined assault.

Anti-cloak ship: I'm cautiously negative about this. It can be worked out but is it really needed? The worst of the cloaking comes from the fact that it can instantly cyno in a huge raep-blob. I'd say the problem lies more with the cyno system than with the cloak. Tweaking that would not break anything in the wormholes either. If you really must include an anti-cloaking ship the cloaker would need something to counter the local as the residents will know when to start looking. It must also be ensured that it cannot be used to decloak anyone at the gates or they will kill the lowsec.

The talk about the current skill system: I suppose it could be done better but as it is one of those things that set EvE apart from the other mmos any changes will need to be considered carefully. Keep in mind that this is the current version of the loyalty program; the longer you play the more you can do. Please do discuss anything planned well beforehand with CSM and players before starting to implement it.

I know what you're saying. I was a miner too once and I saw Megacyte and Zydrine prices drop to nothing. I haven't mined in over a year and a half now. However, once the drone alloys have been removed and replaced with bounties mineral prices should go up again, especially if WH's are also changed to no longer spawn ABC's.

I could conceivably accept this, but it really would have to strike a very careful balance. My thought is that perhaps JF should have hardened jump drives that require a HIC point or a bubble to disrupt (ala supercaps). My main objection is to being able to be camped in lowsec by one dude in a BC. This could be implemented pretty easily. Though I am sure many people would object to this, it seems pretty good to me C:

Null sec – stations, sov, resources -

Where to begin with this one. It is clear that the current CSM (I will lump you all in because you don't have the sack to say who said what in the minutes) want their territory to become more of a fortress and discourage any possible invaders from even trying to take a shot at you.

"CCP offered a suggestion of having a capital-only docking service added to NPC stations that could be disabled.
The CSM agreed that this might work, as long as the service would regenerate over time"

I don't mind this as long as the same goes for sov null too. If it is NPC null only then it is painfully clear it is only a move to make the current power blocks safer.

"CCP asked if station service hitpoints are too high. The CSM said they are fine, as they are supposed to be
difficult to disable. CCP asked if they should be turned into a target for small gangs, with lower EHP; The CSM
said no."

Last I checked, the CSM did not design that part of the game. Currently the only time station services are disabled is after the residents are already dead(lost). It is nothing but to rub salt into a wound. CSM says they are supposed to be difficult to disable? Define difficult please. The real issue is an arbitrary HP structure that is not dynamic with the actual number of inhabitants in the system. 500 thousand HP on say fitting might be difficult for a small time fleet, but a breeze for a null power block. The amount of time to disable and repair should be the same per person on average. Example: Null power block capital has 1000 different pilots visit it on average over the course of seven days. NPC null system for a small time alliance has 50 different pilots visit it on average over the course of seven days. To repair the null power block capital should average out to 5 minutes per person in a logistic. The NPC null system would average out to 5 minutes too. It is a crude example, but you get the point that the hit points should fluxuate to match the population. The resistances of the station services should fluxuate too to match the peak and dead period of logged in players. That way the amount of work needed per person to repair and cripple is the same. Balancing the numbers is of course up to debate.

Another problem with station services is they each work like a light switch. Either it works or it does not. There is no incentive to bother with them unless you know you can be there for the long haul to make their HP reach zero to have an effect. Again, this needs to be dynamic. As the percentage of health decreases, the services inside the station should become more expensive to use. Make it cost more to repair and such things. Also the associated cost should scale depending on the amount of income the average player makes in the constellation or something. Of course when the HP reaches zero, the service should be completely inoperable.

I of course expect much raging from sperg lords, but keep in mind it was just an example of how to break away from ******** set numbers in HP structure grinds.

Wormholes

There is a great idea already in the assembly hall to replace learning implants with boosters that have a long duration. That way they can still go pew pew to their hearts content without worrying about lost training time.

I understand both points of views on the invaders vs. defenders. It is a tricky situation. The whole race to probe out the new exit and either attempt to squeeze ships in to prepare to make a siege on the fortress and the fortress racing to collapse the whole to keep the system safe. It seems to me the invaders are spending most of their time just trying to get to the entrance of the fortress only for the defenders to spend little amount to delete the door and have it move to some other side of the castle. Something should be done to balance it where the defenders have to spend just as much effort into moving the door as the invaders are spending to find it. That said I do not like the idea of a wormhole stabilizer. I would prefer to see something to encourage the defenders to deal with the ships entering the system (a.k.a. shoot them!) as opposed to taking the safe route and just shutting the door right before they get a chance to even knock.

A clone system in unknown space is tricky. As an attacker, it would be a real steep hill to climb having to see the person you just killed during a fight a few minutes later in another ship while you are still dealing with their friends. The Rorqual would be a great platform for the defenders to bounce back to. I would like to see something smaller for the attackers to bounce back to, but on a much smaller scale. A shot from the hip idea is to allow clone vat backs and very small ship maintenance bays on Black Ops battleships. Maybe enough for a few frigates or one cruiser. Enough clone vat power for 3-5 clones. Again, just a thought.

Sec status vampire - This idea has some potential, but CSM being worried about it hurting allies can **** right off. There needs to be more incentive to fight your neighbor instead of giving them a reach around. Null power blocks talk endlessly about how high sec and low sec residents are scared to fight and are risk averse. All the while sporting a list of allies that goes into the thousands of thousands of players. You want to see a risk averse player? Grab your super NAP train blue list, hold it up and look in the mirror. If the number of blues you have outnumber the number in your alliance; I'm talking to you.

Anyways, I'll give my thoughts about the other parts of the minutes tomorrow. Bring on the flames.

So?

A Kitsune with 4 jammers has 20% jam chance on a ship with 200 sensor strength. With a bit of luck and the scan res of supercaps, it can easily feel like a permajam. Your widow fit would have 36% chance with 6 jammers (but it would have no tank at all).

I liked almost everything but there is one thing:

"CCP offered a suggestion of having a capital-only docking service added to npc stations that could be disabled. The CSM agreed that this might work, as long as the service would regenerate over time."

I agree that npc stations are too easy operation basis for large scale attacks/invasions for big alliances far from "home" but a change like this would drive away from 0.0 completely the small/medium alliances who don't want to be a part of a powerblock under the wings of a big sovholding alliance.

How?

Here is a possible situation: Let's say Test alliance is totally annoyed from The godfathers and other 0.0 pirate alliances activity in Fountain. All they have to do is to destroy the capital docking services on all the npc stations from time to time and the godfathers and other small alliances will be forced out from there because they aren't able to resupply their assets.

At the end only the nearby sovholding powers will sitting on the npc territories while the small/medium alliances will forced to launch their roaming fleets from lowsec.

If you really considering something like that than you have to offer an alternative lifestyle for those alliances in null. Maybe something nomadic life with mobil station/mothership kinda thingy with relative safety for a short period of time everywhere in null but forced to move after that. Of course with limited ship hangar space for battleships (and no capital docking or highly limited ) to remove it's usefullness in 0.0 full scale attacks and wars but still be able to launch small roaming gangs in the name of the gudfites.

Something like that were suggested before by different players so many times so it's not just a random idea by me

A spool-up timer for the cyno projector itself would be an interesting mechanism. Thus the jump-capable ships can jump directly to a cyno beacon when they've recalibrated after a jump, but there would be a delay involved in hot dropping capital fleets on top of a cyno ship. This gives the prey time to decide whether they want to GTFO, gank the projector, or perhaps cyno in their own reinforcements.

The beacon is nothing to do with the mass coming through it. I've thought about that mass-limited option myself too: but in the end, the cynosural field generator is basically opening up enough of a "kink" in space-time for the jump drives of the jump-capable ships to lock on and rip the hole they need to get through themselves (using their own fuel). Perhaps space-time doesn't like being ripped asunder so much, and any particular grid will start resisting attempts to cyno into it after a certain number of jumps or volume of shipping has been squeezed through?

HOW ABOUT NO?

Yawn... difficult to respond to yet more Goon propaganda, as if the CSM isn't already loaded with it.

But, you do make my point for me. Null sec players represent only a small part of the Eve player base, and changes to the game should not be prioritized based on what one minority group feels to be the "only right way to play".

High sec, low sec and WH space issues are taking a back seat to null sec issues and/or being improperly represented, simply because certain CSM members think that everyone should be, or wants to be, in null sec.

Based on player statistics, the majority of the player base just does not happen to agree with that belief.

And, if CCP chooses to cater to the vocal minority, rather than consider the needs of the quieter majority, then they should not be overly surprised if subscription numbers remain somewhat flat, or perhaps even drop. Not everyone chooses to rage quit - most dissatisfied players simply quit without any further comment.